Classic & Vintage - Another ID thread. Why do I always get the weird ones?

Got this from a local guy. He knew nothing about it. It feels light but that means nothing at this point.

What I do know...

Frame:
Near vertical rear dropouts w/ adjusters
26.4 or possibly 26.6 seatpost size
English threading and 68mm BB shell
BoCaMa Competition lugs
Internal cable routing on top tube

Fork:
May not be original to frame
BoCaMa fork crown
Campagnolo fork ends

Most likely Reynolds 531 tubing

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes668.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes669.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes673.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes670.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes671.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes680.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes677.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes675.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes676.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes678.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes679.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes682.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes674.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes672.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes681.jpg

Could it possibly be an Olmo??;):D

Could it possibly be an Olmo??;):D

You call that an Olmo? THIS is an Olmo. Right there behind ky0cef's Paramount. Haha.

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/bf_bikes.jpg

Give me a shout, Richard. I'll answer. I promise. :D Hectic times have been afoot down here.

Anybody else care to throw out an idea?

Check for a tubing logo on the steering tube. Looks high end Japanese to me.

The quality paint job clearly marks this as an Italian frame! <snicker>

Check for a tubing logo on the steering tube. Looks high end Japanese to me.

Specs are up top. No logo found on steerer. How common were BoCaMa lugs on Japanese frames?

Andrew there's something about the end of the stays at the rear drops that looks familiar but I can't dredge it up right now.

Found another bike with the same rear dropouts. These are just pantographed "Basso".

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes887.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes891.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes893.jpg

I'll have to look but I think my Bianchi Protos have the same or very similar drops but stamped shipmano.

The quality paint job clearly marks this as an Italian frame! <snicker>Almost looks to be powder-coated, and if so, none too well, but that does look like primer under those paint chips. I wonder how bad it looked before someone made it look bad again? No clue. Could be a Cilo; they often had those lugs.

Another ID thread. Why do I always get the weird ones?

Perhaps that should be a lesson to you, young man........
I know, I know; you can't help yourself.

N+maybe?

I did a trade with a local guy guy t help him out. Needless to say, he didn't help me any. I just want to get out from under it. Tired of looking at it.


Almost looks to be powder-coated, and if so, none too well, but that does look like primer under those paint chips. I wonder how bad it looked before someone made it look bad again? No clue. Could be a Cilo; they often had those lugs.

Another ID thread. Why do I always get the weird ones?

Perhaps that should be a lesson to you, young man........
I know, I know; you can't help yourself.

N+maybe?

Chainstays appear to have originally been painted past the bottom bracket shell, from the looks of the roughened-up chrome.

-Kurt

Measurements? Looks like a 58cm.

Doubt if the fork is for that frame, or the rear would have eyelets, also.

Measurements? Looks like a 58cm.

Doubt if the fork is for that frame, or the rear would have eyelets, also.

It can't be the original fork. The rake is wrong, as well.

It's 58cm CTT with a 57-57.5cm TT.

I have a Giuseppi Limongi built frame that has the same end work on the stays. Can we see inside the BB shell? The shot-in junction at the top is not consistent but Pepe built a lot of styles.

Is that a sticker/decal that has been painted over on the right side of the seattube in picture 7?

The fish mouth stay ends are kind of a Gitane trademark and it does have French lugs. Just a thought. It's a much later model than I would be familiar with.

Agreed, the fork is not OEM to the frame. Besides the difference in eyelets, the finishing of the blade and stay ends is totally different.

Looks European, but beyond that I don't know. I suspect the fork is not original.

Found another bike with the same rear dropouts. These are just pantographed "Basso".

They are almost certainly Gipiemme semi-vertical dropouts:

http://velobase.com/VeloImages/FrameParts/65D5BB31-8178-4DC6-9E0A-CA64077296BD.jpeg

I'll have to look but I think my Bianchi Protos have the same or very similar drops but stamped shipmano.

Shimano "UF" dropouts are quite similar, but were not as widely used as the Gipiemme version, as the UFs had breakage issues:

http://www.os2.dhs.org/~john/dropouts/shimano-uf1.jpeg

The rear derailleur hanger on the OP's frame more closely resembles the Gipiemme dropout as well.

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg93/realestvin7/Bikes/Bike%20Parts%202/Bikes674.jpg

With all due respect, the subject dropouts look more like the Shimano. On the Gipiemme, the thicker portion is restricted to the immediate vincinity of wheel and derailleur mounting areas, while on the Shimano there is a thick web interconnecting the two areas. The OP's droputs clearly have the thicker portion extending between the two areas, similar to the Shimano dropout.

I have a Giuseppi Limongi built frame that has the same end work on the stays. Can we see inside the BB shell? The shot-in junction at the top is not consistent but Pepe built a lot of styles.

I'll see if I can get one in a bit.


Is that a sticker/decal that has been painted over on the right side of the seattube in picture 7?

The previous owner clamped a pump pug right there while the paint was still a little wet. Lol.


The fish mouth stay ends are kind of a Gitane trademark and it does have French lugs. Just a thought. It's a much later model than I would be familiar with.

Too bad it has English threads. :(


Agreed, the fork is not OEM to the frame. Besides the difference in eyelets, the finishing of the blade and stay ends is totally different.

How coincidental that the replacement fork has a BoCaMa crown.

Too bad it has English threads. :(

It looks modern enough to me that it would not have French threads even if it was a French frame. I'm not insisting that it's French. Like I said, just a thought.