Touring - Potential LHT build, feedback appreciated

[outgrowth of the "have 4k" post]

My beloved LHT is no more, but I used it on two previous month+ tours. I did worry about the occasional "death wobble" on descents. However, I'm lighter now, and will probably use a Bob, so this should be less of an issue.

Goals are basically to have a backup/alternate to my thorn for touring. I need:
- big gearing range, as I'm a big dude and will be tackling Cascades next year, possibly on this bike.
- disc brakes and friction shifters, as I've always found rim brakes and indexed derailleurs too finicky.


So the following is a first cut at an LHT disc trucker build. For a few things, I'm not sure what to get, including the brake levers (short-pull, separate from shifters), derailleurs (need to deal with mountain triple in front, and huge (36t) cog in rear). Will the Silver shifters work w/ all thuff?

- disc trucker frame, 60cm $409.00 modernbike

- road avid bb7 x2 $142.00 amazon ASSUMING ROAD BRAKES WORK
- brake levers, short-pull for road bb7, WHICH?

- SOS levers x2 $107.00 rivendell (friction, bar mount)
- shimano HG61, 9spd, 12-36 cassette $50.00 rivendell
- deore XT 44-32-22, chainrings, $0.00 reuse
- SRAM PC-890 chain $28.00 amazon
- derailleurs, WHICH?

- wheelset $750.00 peter white, white industries disc, 40-spoke
- 2 new tires, schwalbe supreme 700x35 x2 $150.00

- Nitto Noodle, 48cm $83.00
- handlebar tape, leather $70.00 velo-orange
- thompson seatpost $0.00 reuse
- saddle B17 $0.00 reuse
- pleischer kickstand $0.00 reuse
- assorted cables $100.00
- stem WHICH?

Thanks,
pete

This thread:
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/794251-Shimano-HG61-12-36-29Er-Cassette-on-Cross-Check
talks about the Deore M592 SGS shadow derailleur to deal w/ the 12-36. $54 shipped from Niagara.

For the front, should I go w/ a mountain or road derailleur?

stem WHICH?

that is a fit issue, not do able assess over the blind web.
What was the stem size and rise angle on the last bike, how did you like the fit?

I have gone from a 8cm and Randonneur bars to a shorter stem Noodle Drop bar,
quill type then,
then my newer bike I adopted trekking bars .. Magura HS33, hydraulic rim brakes.
Rohloff grip-shifter..

brake levers, short-pull for road bb7, WHICH? road no Brifter lots of choices .
you can even get campag levers without the gizzards in them ,
or get their lower end ones and strip the Brifter parts out. :crash:

V brake long pull Tektro , Cane Creek make a lever in both types..

its almost like saddle choices .. see whats in the shops, hold it in your hand

I have some of Shimano Aero levers, they are on my bar end shifted road bike..

Riv stocks those {?]

I did a similar build with an '86 Specialized Expedition. I went with XT derailers front and rear. I used the same 48cm nittos with Shimano brake levers. Love the bars, hated the levers. They were very narrow. I ended up with Cane Creek levers with a much wider platform to rest your hands on. They also come in normal and long pull versions at Harris Cyclery. Being a big guy, the wider levers made a huge difference. I also went with leather bar tape, but double wrapped it over some cheap gel tape. That gave a great feel to the bars.
What made you choose the White Industries wheels over the Phils? The cost? I wanted the Peter White touring wheels with the Phils, but ran out of money and am still using the original wheels with a 7 speed until I can afford them.
The Velo Orange stem is very nice looking, or to keep it in the family you could go with a Thompson to match the seat post.

Cane creek scr-5? They look pretty good. White industry's are less than Phil wood, I've had a problem w/ a Phil wood hub before, and some of philwood.com is not rendering on google chrome/ Mac. :-).

Cane creek scr-5? They look pretty good. White industry's are less than Phil wood, I've had a problem w/ a Phil wood hub before, and some of philwood.com is not rendering on google chrome/ Mac. :-).

Mind elaborting o the problem's you've experienced with Phil Wood hubs? I'm currently having a set of Mavic XM719's laced to Phil Wood hubs by Peter White and am curious about your experiences.

Further more, I too am building a LHT (Trucker Deluxe) and looked at the Velo Orange stems though I spoke with someone at VO and they are no longer having 31.8 stems being made and the ones they've got on their site are all they're going to have. As with levers, I've got the Cane Creek SCR-5's installed and Surfjimc's opinions seem to be right on. They provide a lot of space and I can't wait to put some miles on them.

Regardless what you do, post some pictures once it's up and going!

One thing I found , smaller shops in the high season are not set up to hand build wheels on demand
so some times a common 36 spoke freehub will be better , if you damage the rim
an off the peg wheel wont be premium components, then you have to tear out
the premium hub, un build the wheel, and mail it home.

Had no problems with my Phil Hub, but I used a Freewheel.
so the hub was simple ..

- disc brakes and friction shifters, as I've always found rim brakes and indexed derailleurs too finicky.

If you think that rim brakes are too finicky, you're not going to like any of the mechanical disc brakes. I love discs, but will be the first to admit that the BB7 Road and BB7 Mountain are more finicky than any rim brake I've used.


- road avid bb7 x2 $142.00 amazon ASSUMING ROAD BRAKES WORK

Match them with the right levers and BB7 Road brakes work as well as the MTB version...


- stem WHICH?

They're all about the same these days. If you want something that offers some adjustment, I like Specialized's line of shim-adjustable stems. I've broken two cheap, infinitely adjustable stems. The Specialized stems, like the Comp Multi-Stem (http://www.specialized.com/us/en/ftb/components/mtb-stems/comp-multi-stem) are light, offer a useful range of stem angles, and won't break...

Thanks for the comments, guys. I talked to Dave at Rivendell for a bit and he was very helpful. Says they spec bikes with the SOS shift levers and the 12-36 rear cassette all the time. I'm going to use Cane Creek SCR-5 brake levers, plus interrupter levers from my old bike (can't remember what they were).
sstorkel, I have a BB7 on the back of my thorn and like it quite a bit, so I think it'll be okay. I am going to use the road disc brake model. I've heard preferences both ways (road better, and ATB better), so I'm going to just stay w/ the road.

scubasteve, it actually happened to one of my touring buddies. His bottom bracket started snapping, popping, and crackling. The local ISP theorized that the builder hadn't used any/enough grease, and the builder did pay for everything. Seems unlikely to have made that big of an error, though, as he is a very well-known, and well thought of, custom builder. *My* Phil Wood has been fine, but I no longer think of it as being bullet-proof.


I'll have an Arkel handlebar bag and probably a bob on tour. I'll upload a picture when I build it up.


pete

sstorkel, I have a BB7 on the back of my thorn and like it quite a bit, so I think it'll be okay. I am going to use the road disc brake model. I've heard preferences both ways (road better, and ATB better), so I'm going to just stay w/ the road.

With the BB7, both road and mountain, I find I have to adjust the pad spacing a bit almost every time I remove a wheel... and sometimes when I don't. In that respect, they're quite a bit more finicky than rim brakes. Can't remember the last time I had to do any maintenance to a rim brake, other than change the pads when they wear out.

With the BB7, both road and mountain, I find I have to adjust the pad spacing a bit almost every time I remove a wheel... and sometimes when I don't. In that respect, they're quite a bit more finicky than rim brakes. Can't remember the last time I had to do any maintenance to a rim brake, other than change the pads when they wear out.[/FONT]

I'm constantly adjusting cantilever brakes. Maybe the springs and/or housings have just gotten messed up. I haven't replaced them in five years.

Regarding finicky indexed shifters, I use an 8 speed system on my two touring bikes and on my foldup bike. I have almost no problems at all. Shifting on my foldup is a bit sloppy but I have to use outer housing on the full length of the derailleur cable and it is long enough that I have to use a tandem cable because of the folding mechanism.

Was your finicky shifting on a 9 or more speed system?

I occasionally have to clean and lube the plastic cable guide under the bottom bracket, but that will cause a shifting problem on indexed just as much as on friction.

I use friction front shifter.

The Rivendell silver shifters will work with just about anything, I'm running a full XT setup and they work great.

Was your finicky shifting on a 9 or more speed system?

There were a number of elements: 9-speed megarange cassette (11-34), mountain front, mountain deraileurs, and it turns out road shifters (LBS says they would work, lots of people now tell me no). So the shifters could be at least part of my problem. I've had problems on other bikes as well, as I generally have very large ranges.

W/ friction it might not be fast, precise, but at least I know I'll be able to get in the top and bottom gears, plus appropriate ones in the middle.

My silver shifters should be here tomorrow, frame and almost everything else is now in the mail and on it's way to me. Unfortunately, it turns out Peter White is backlogged, so my wheels will take a month to get here :eek:.

pete

Unfortunately, it turns out Peter White is backlogged, so my wheels will take a month to get here :eek:.

Peter White isn't the only guy in the country who knows how to build wheels... Hell, I bought the parts and the tools and built wheels myself. Had them faster that PW could deliver, they're every bit as reliable, and despite the cost of tools they ended up being cheaper! Having built them myself, I'm now much more confident that I could repair them on the road.

You might want to look closer at your chain selection. That Sram chain only comes with 114 links and with the extra chain stay length on the LHT, it will most likely be too short. I just replaced mine and found this out this the hard way. Surly spec's out a Sram chain on their complete builds, but they are just cutting the length they need from a spool of chain.

I'd go cautiously with the kickstand with a Surly frame. Surly has a statement about kickstands on their website, specifically about crushing the chain-stays. While I am aware that you aren't some noob likely to crush chain stays through over-tightening, there may be a warranty issue lurking there anyway that they can use in case you ever have any difficulty.

http://surlybikes.com/info_hole/spew/kickstands_on_long_haul_truckers
(http://surlybikes.com/info_hole/spew/kickstands_on_long_haul_truckers)
P.S. The Pletscher is one that they recommended near the bottom.

I'd go cautiously with the kickstand with a Surly frame. Surly has a statement about kickstands on their website, specifically about crushing the chain-stays. While I am aware that you aren't some noob likely to crush chain stays through over-tightening, there may be a warranty issue lurking there anyway that they can use in case you ever have any difficulty.

http://surlybikes.com/info_hole/spew/kickstands_on_long_haul_truckers
(http://surlybikes.com/info_hole/spew/kickstands_on_long_haul_truckers)
P.S. The Pletscher is one that they recommended near the bottom.

Also look into a click-stand (http://www.click-stand.com/). Much more elegant and weighs very little compared to any kickstands. It will fit easiy in your handlebar bag.

You might want to look closer at your chain selection. That Sram chain only comes with 114 links and with the extra chain stay length on the LHT, it will most likely be too short. I just replaced mine and found this out this the hard way. Surly spec's out a Sram chain on their complete builds, but they are just cutting the length they need from a spool of chain.

This is a bit worrisome, though I've always used SRAM chains on my broken trucker, and the three that I've checked all have 114 links. What do you use?



I'd go cautiously with the kickstand with a Surly frame. Surly has a statement about kickstands on their website, specifically about crushing the chain-stays. While I am aware that you aren't some noob likely to crush chain stays through over-tightening, there may be a warranty issue lurking there anyway that they can use in case you ever have any difficulty.

http://surlybikes.com/info_hole/spew/kickstands_on_long_haul_truckers

P.S. The Pletscher is one that they recommended near the bottom.

Yep, I used the Pletscher on my old trucker and liked it quite a bit. Much heavier than a clickstand, but so convenient. Nothing like it for holding the bike when fixing flats.

This is a bit worrisome, though I've always used SRAM chains on my broken trucker, and the three that I've checked all have 114 links. What do you use?I guess the the required length will depend on the size of the largest chain ring you are using. I have the stock crankset with 48-36-26t rings. In order to get the chain around the largest cogs with an inch of extra chain, which is how I was taught to size chains, I needed 116 links. The original stock Sram chain also had 116 links. Any of the 9 speed Shimano chains can be had with 114,116 or 118 links. I saw online where another LHT owner contacted Sram to see if he could get a longer chain and they advised him to buy 2 chains and use an extra power link to lengthen to the desired 116 links. I went with a Shimano Ultegra chain.

I guess the the required length will depend on the size of the largest chain ring you are using. I have the stock crankset with 48-36-26t rings. In order to get the chain around the largest cogs with an inch of extra chain, which is how I was taught to size chains, I needed 116 links. Any of the 9 speed Shimano chains can be had with 114,116 or 118 links. I saw online where another LHT owner contacted Sram to see if he could get a longer chain and they advised him to buy 2 chains and use an extra power link to lengthen to the desired 116 links. I went with a Shimano Ultegra chain.

Well, I do have an extra powerlink, so that should be okay :-) Also, my biggest chainring is 44, so I might squeak by.