Commuting - First Experience on Nokian Studded Tires

Well it snowed in Washington DC on Wednesday, so that I knew that my commute would be icy. My commute is 18 miles each way, with most of it on a bike path, which never gets plowed. The bike path was a combination of bare pavement, packed snow and ice. I am using the 700c Hakkapeliitta W106 35mm on my Lemond Propad.

All I can say is that the Nokian Studded Tires are a great product and made riding on ice quite fun.

I never felt out of control on the ice and just had to be extra careful going around corners. Going in and out ruts was a little bit harder. Another benefit of using these tires on ice, is that you will become a much better bike handler.

I have been considering studded tires as well, but, did you have to ride on bare pavement? For me it seems that morning snow is very often runoff by evening. That runoff may well be ice, but how do they handle on iceless, snowless surface? Glad you found a new addition to your bike arsenal.

I took the Metro to work today, and noticed the Mount Vernon trail looked quite icy (the Metro passes over it at one point). I'm thinking about those Nokians. Thanks for the review.

I have been considering studded tires as well, but, did you have to ride on bare pavement? For me it seems that morning snow is very often runoff by evening. That runoff may well be ice, but how do they handle on iceless, snowless surface? Glad you found a new addition to your bike arsenal.

This week was also my first use of my Nokian 106s too (I'm also in the DC area). They handled snow, ice, and bare pavement (going home) like a champ. More rolling resistance - especially on the bare pavement - than regular tires but that's to be expected.

On bare pavement do not expect to go the same speed with studded tires as you would with non studded tires. Also one can not dive into corners on bare bavement as the studs make the bike handle a little squirrly in corners. Overall, riding on ice etc added about 15-20% time to my commute.

I just tried to put mine on this morning but they hit my fenders. I had already built up one of the wheels (not trued yet thank god) for a new wheelset. Now today I get to return the rims and hubs of the 2nd wheelset and the new nokians. I think I'm just going to get some Nokians for my mountain bike so I can get some decent exercise this winter. And if I need to commute anywhere when it is really icy I'll use my mtn bike. Damn I hate clearnance problems!

I have an order in fo rthe Nokian Mount and Ground for my 'nasty weather' ride.

I just tried to put mine on this morning but they hit my fenders. I had already built up one of the wheels (not trued yet thank god) for a new wheelset. Now today I get to return the rims and hubs of the 2nd wheelset and the new nokians. I think I'm just going to get some Nokians for my mountain bike so I can get some decent exercise this winter. And if I need to commute anywhere when it is really icy I'll use my mtn bike. Damn I hate clearnance problems!

Exactly !! Put some Nokian Extreme 296's on the mtb and just leave them all winter. Have one bike for the ice and snow and one for the clear pavement. It's a lot less work when you get all set up. Check the weather and pick your bike. :) :) :)

Well it snowed in Washington DC on Wednesday, so that I knew that my commute would be icy. My commute is 18 miles each way, with most of it on a bike path, which never gets plowed. The bike path was a combination of bare pavement, packed snow and ice. I am using the 700c Hakkapeliitta W106 35mm on my Lemond Propad.

All I can say is that the Nokian Studded Tires are a great product and made riding on ice quite fun.

I never felt out of control on the ice and just had to be extra careful going around corners. Going in and out ruts was a little bit harder. Another benefit of using these tires on ice, is that you will become a much better bike handler.

Glad to hear it ! Wait until you try a lake or an ice rink!!!
Post some pictures if you can.

Here is my unplowed bike path ride yesterday. About 20 miles overall. Nokian Extreme 296's . :)

http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/dad02915/album?.dir=/89c0&.src=ph&.tok=phLdyZCBkzKrc__c

No one around stocks these tires, are there many bad clearance issues? I am planning on building up a "salt" bike. but I would still run Freddy fenders. Is there a huge height dif with the studs? where was the clearance issue? near the BB or just the fender itself? thanks you all for your info.

2many thanks for the pics, is that your commute? that is gorgeous. Where in NE is that?

I am running SKS45 fenders and do not have a clearance problem with the 35mm 106s.

2many, nice pics, are the pictures from the Amherst, Ma. area?

No one around stocks these tires, are there many bad clearance issues? I am planning on building up a "salt" bike. but I would still run Freddy fenders. Is there a huge height dif with the studs? where was the clearance issue? near the BB or just the fender itself? thanks you all for your info.

2many thanks for the pics, is that your commute? that is gorgeous. Where in NE is that?

For pictures and information about the tires and a source check the ICEBIKE web sight. The tires were avaliable on line from All Weather Sports in Alaska, just google them, you can get the tires on line.

The clearance thing is a tough one. It depends on the individual bike, the exact fenders, and the exact model tires. It may be hard to do that without seeing the bike. I think the Nokian 296 tires will fit on just about any Mountain bike. Regular full coverage Freddy fenders will be too close I think. You don't want full coverage fenders that are close to the tires anyway, they will clog. To really do this nice, either live without fenders (I REALLY don't recommend it) or make your own high clearance fenders. I already have fender photos on the computer for someone else, here they are.

I made motocross type fenders starting with a Topeak DeFender front fender and adding pieces.

This was on The East Bay Bike Path from Providence Rhode Island to Bristol Rhode Island. 14.2 miles one way.

Oops. I had to edit my post, this is the sight for the "Ocean State Bike Path Association" there are lot of photos of the path in warm weather (links to photos).

http://members.cox.net/osbpa/

Nashbar has their studded ATB tires 26X1.95 on sale now for 34.95.
700X35 for 19.95.
Enjoy

All I can say is that the Nokian Studded Tires are a great product and made riding on ice quite fun.

Another convert! Welcome. ;)

Question for long-term Nokian users: How long do you think the studs will hold up on dry pavement? Sometimes my rides take me on long stretches of clear pavement so I was curious about that. I hear the Nokian studs are much more durable. True?

(I have studded tires, but not Nokian. I didn't want to spend the money and realize I didn't like riding in the winter. Mistake on my part!)

vtjim, I have a friend who has commutted on a set of Nokians for 3 seasons (bare pavement and snow/ice combination) and he feels that he should be able to get through a 4th season without replacing them. His commute is 18 miles each way. Remember these are carbide studs and not steel.

Another convert! Welcome. ;)

Question for long-term Nokian users: How long do you think the studs will hold up on dry pavement? Sometimes my rides take me on long stretches of clear pavement so I was curious about that. I hear the Nokian studs are much more durable. True?

(I have studded tires, but not Nokian. I didn't want to spend the money and realize I didn't like riding in the winter. Mistake on my part!)

It does sound like you read my post about inexpensive $50 steel studded tires lasting one year, and my Nokians Tungsten carbide studs now on year four. I did go out of my way not to ride either on the pavement very much. Say good bye to steel studs on pavement if you do much of it.

I did as little as possible except for a couple of 30 mile rides on the Nokians. The Nokian studs are not wearing down much. They are slowly going into the tire, I think the rubber underneath is wearing. So far no changes in handling. Eventually I will be switching the middle studs with the outer studs, as they don't wear on the outside that I can even see. I will probably build up the back of the stud when I put them back with a few thousands of something to keep the stud out about .010 more of the hole.
I don't have a computer on my ice bike so I don't have a record of how far I have been. All I can say is not much on pavement. A typical ride is only about 1/2 mile to get to the snow or ice I ride about twice a week from ? December To March? not all this time is snow or ice, I may ride another bike when the pavement is clean.

No one around stocks these tires...

Another place to get them: http://harriscyclery.net/site/page.cfm?PageID=49&Description=stud+tire

I got my Nokian H106s from them - good price, good service.

I got mine from www.peterwhitecycles.com (http://)

I have been considering studded tires as well, but, did you have to ride on bare pavement? For me it seems that morning snow is very often runoff by evening. That runoff may well be ice, but how do they handle on iceless, snowless surface? Glad you found a new addition to your bike arsenal.

They work peachy fine. I just put them on when I think that the weather warrants it, then leave them until it's time to switch to my road bike.

I love my Nokians. They have reduced the incidence of buttock to pavement to 0 during winter riding. Before I had them mounted, I would have an average of one slide/year due to snow/ice issues on my commute.

One thing however...be careful with the idea of only using one tire. When it's really icy, you need two. Found *this* out shortly before I passed about 300 cars on the way to work (after crashing out) since it was so icy. One isn't enough sometimes.

Enjoy the cold,
Tom
Flawil, Switzerland

P.S. The tires I've got on currently are three seasons old. Most of the riding I do is on non icy/non snowy pavement. I've lost two studs. That's it. EXCELLENT quality, and well worth the cost.

Nokians -- don't leave home without them! Wednesday in DC was one of those great days with most of the cagers hoplessly mired.

Paul

I went out yesterday WITHOUT Nokians and have a BLACK and BLUE mark all down my left side....came home and called every local bike shop for studded tires. Not one had them but said they could order them for me and I would have them in 1 - 2 weeks... So, I went to PeterWhiteCycles.com and called (Peter answered the phone). Took 5 minutes and I purchased the Nokian Extremes for (181.50 w/shipping) and I'll have my Tires by Tuesday. :) Great timing because we're expecting 12 inches of snow this weekend!!!

I don't think bike shops stock studded tires because there's not enough of those "you're nuts" kinds of bicyclists around!

So far I've commuted 159 miles for the month of Jan. thanks to studded tires. If not for those tires I would maybe have a quarter of that.

Another benefit of using these tires on ice, is that you will become a much better bike handler.


I'll warrant that handling the ice without the use of these tires will improve your handling skill even more ;)

I'll warrant that handling the ice without the use of these tires will improve your handling skill even more

And boost your medical bills....my left side is black and blue as proof of that...:)

Thanks for your responses, I believed that the studs on pavement would be like slicks on ice, not sure why I thought that. One last bit, are any of you running studded tires on a road/cross bike? 700c? that is what I would be attempting.

Lastly, do they sing? Do they make a cool sound on pavement when you really stretch it out? (I won't be dissapointed if they don't) Thanks again for your insights.

nyc:

I am using the 700cc Hakkapeliitta W106 35mm on my Lemond Propad.

Thanks for your responses, I believed that the studs on pavement would be like slicks on ice, not sure why I thought that. One last bit, are any of you running studded tires on a road/cross bike? 700c? that is what I would be attempting.

Lastly, do they sing? Do they make a cool sound on pavement when you really stretch it out? (I won't be dissapointed if they don't) Thanks again for your insights.

I don't have 700c, I have 26" myself, I bet there are other out there who do.
It's not like riding a slick on ice, but, when you ride studded tires on pavement you do not have good traction, you have to be careful. Mine are crunchy ! Even when I roll them when walking they make a crunching sound. It's hard to describe. You can't sneak up on someone on the pavement.

Do be careful of the nice kitchen floor. The bike can slide sideways and scratch the floor, even tile. Same for hardwood. Also do not roll them over your nice, but fragile neoprene booties. For than matter don't roll them over anything you like. Do not have the tire where you can open your car door into the studs.(really). Tungsten carbide is probably harder than anything you own.
I guess you can figure out how I know this. Maybe you can learn from my mistakes. :o

Nashbar has their studded ATB tires 26X1.95 on sale now for 34.95.
700X35 for 19.95.
Enjoy

Lasted me no longer than 10 rides. Nokians next time.

So what do people ride when the roads are mostly clear, but black-ice is all over the place? I'm getting a set of nokians from my LBS (had to order them) but will probably be riding 20% plowed with residual, 70% clear, 10% Black ice. I'm going to run studs figuring that I'll do better on the 70% clear with studs than the 10% ice without. Anyone disagree with this?

So what do people ride when the roads are mostly clear, but black-ice is all over the place? I'm getting a set of nokians from my LBS (had to order them) but will probably be riding 20% plowed with residual, 70% clear, 10% Black ice. I'm going to run studs figuring that I'll do better on the 70% clear with studs than the 10% ice without. Anyone disagree with this?

I agree with you.

The studs are the only thing that will get you over black ice. To try and get more life out of your studs
you can look for snow or flat ice on the road instead of dry pavement to ride on. If there are deep ruts that are fozen hard and are almost in the same direction of travel that you are going ,you need to avoid them. Even with studs. They will toss you right over.

I love my Nokians. They have reduced the incidence of buttock to pavement to 0 during winter riding.


Where did you get them, Tom?
Velo Plus?

I got mine from peter white. Highly recommended.

I just turned 1750 miles/2800km on my Mount-n-Grounds, mostly on pavement with patches of ice. From December to March the chance of encountering black ice on my commute one direction or the other is almost 100%, but at least 50 % of the distance traveled in that time will be on clear pavement. I am noticing a slight increase in slippage on cornors now. The extra resistence is worth the extra security.

I just turned 1750 miles/2800km on my Mount-n-Grounds, mostly on pavement with patches of ice. From December to March the chance of encountering black ice on my commute one direction or the other is almost 100%, but at least 50 % of the distance traveled in that time will be on clear pavement. I am noticing a slight increase in slippage on cornors now. The extra resistence is worth the extra security.

I bought some replacement studs on line from All Weather Sports. I have an old pair of dentists pliers with
concave jaws that hold the studs pretty good. Some windex in/on the stud/hole and you can twist them in or out. I also noticed my studs were sinkng in the hole a few thousands. I may shim them out with a piece of something when I get to replacing them.

The Nokian Hakkapeliitta W106 35mm 106 is really best as a "chance of black ice tire." It is not really designed as a serious, Yukon Trail sort of thing. The lower stud count and less knobby tread makes it work well on dry pavement wituot noticable wear. I have mine put on in December and taken off in March. I'd guess that well over 90% of my travel during this time is on dry pavement.

They do sing -- a sort of frying bacon sound. However, when you hit ice, the go utterly silent, and you have this dreamlike floating sensation, because black ice is far smoother than any pavement.

When I ride over metal grates, there is a sort of a squirmy feeling. No big problem, but is does feel strange.

Paul

I visited the Peter White site, and I have a question.

I presently ride with 700/35 Innovas, and they do well enough, except on frozen ruts.

I had thought of going to the Nokian W240 tires because of the side studs and their ability to do a better job in ruts (and a better tire all around).

Does anyone know how narrow Nokian makes the W240?

35mm?

Does anyone know how narrow Nokian makes the W240?
35mm?

Per the specs, 40 mm for 700c. That's what's made, not necessarily what you can find here in the US.

http://www.suomityres.fi/bike/winterspecs/index.htm

just completeds my first commute on the Nokian Hakkapeliitta W106 35mm 106 after recieving a foot of snow in the area.

i really dont think my commute would have been possible (well possible BUT SCARY with a couple wipes probably) without the studs.

thses tires are no better than normal ones in anything but the hardest snow pack but on hard snowpack and ice they are life savers. i kept expecting to slip at least a little going downhills and around iced over turns this morning but nothing, no slipping on ice! these things gave me instant confidence to ride over even the iciest mess.

i really expected more rolling resistance, it wasn't too bad! makes a cool rapidly clicking hum on pavement. i expect i'll leave them on for the whole week and give them some real use. but for now they rock!

and just another reminder, they are no better than anything else in loose snow.... it's still gotta be packed down pretty hard or loose enough that you sink through to the bottom before these studs will grip.

...and just another reminder, they are no better than anything else in loose snow....

Loose snow is the worst! What I hate most is areas where it looks like hard-pack, and then your tire just slips down and you go all squirrly because there's ice underneath. I nearly wiped out yesterday because of it. I still think it would have been better with studs because of the ice underneath. I'm eagerly awaiting the arrival of my W106s this week!

Loose snow is the worst! What I hate most is areas where it looks like hard-pack, and then your tire just slips down and you go all squirrly because there's ice underneath. I nearly wiped out yesterday because of it. I still think it would have been better with studs because of the ice underneath. I'm eagerly awaiting the arrival of my W106s this week!

If the snow is loose enough and the tire sinks all the way down to the ice underneath, then you do have good traction. As Max-a-mill pointed out, if there is no ice or hard snow underneath then it's the same as a similar tire.

One thing I never mentioned. On bare hard dirt, the studs help too. They hold very well.

Ken Cox - The side suds will grab better, but if you get into a hard frozen rut that is 2" or 3" deep and almost parallel to your path, there is really nothing that will help. Not even the Extreme 296's. If the rut is deep and frozen you can easily be tossed sideways. It's like getting your tire caught in the railroad tracks.
Shallow ruts sometimes are OK if you can see them and know what to do. Or if they are not rock hard.

On the bike path I can stay up (I have fallen) but I might be going 45 degrees to the way I was going, and instantly moved over 5 feet. I would not ride in parallel ruts near traffic. You might need a whole lane if you want to stay up.
Of course I'm pointing out the worst ruts I have ridden in just in case it's something you encounter. There are plenty of conditions that are not so bad.

If it's footprints in ice or a small rut that is perpendicular, just slowly ride on over them. If you know you are going to be riding over a lot or bumpy ice for a long time start with the lowest pressure on the tires. You might want to go even lower if you are going over miles of ice bumps

Well it snowed in Washington DC on Wednesday, so that I knew that my commute would be icy. My commute is 18 miles each way, with most of it on a bike path, which never gets plowed. The bike path was a combination of bare pavement, packed snow and ice. I am using the 700c Hakkapeliitta W106 35mm on my Lemond Propad.

All I can say is that the Nokian Studded Tires are a great product and made riding on ice quite fun.

I never felt out of control on the ice and just had to be extra careful going around corners. Going in and out ruts was a little bit harder. Another benefit of using these tires on ice, is that you will become a much better bike handler.

I commute the same route into DC as you do, but I decided for the very limited number of snow/ice days in the DC area, studded tires are too expensive (Nokians) or fast wearing (Nashbar and Inovas). Anyway, I've been doing OK on low profile cyclocross treads- Kenda Kwick 700X35c on my $50 Schwinn beater fixed gear. I'm probably stating the obvious, but you can do a lot with cyclocross tires, assuming your frame has the clearance, if you just drop your tire pressure. I weigh 150lbs (without gear and heavy bag) and 45 psi front, 50psi rear on wide road rims works for anything except black ice. I can roll (gently) over curbs at that pressure. The fixed gear is much better than a freewheeling bike in snow and ice, you can keep your rear wheel turning while slowing, no need for the front brake most of the time, and much less maintenance and trouble with a frozen drivetrain. The beater Schwinn has a centerpull front brake, which allows clearance for cross tires, wide rims, and full fenders- a must in the slush. It also helps to put your bike out into the cold for a few minutes before you ride, if you store it indoors to keep the snow from sticking to the warm metal when you first take off.

Two feet of snow on the bike path today. Too deep for a bicycle. The roads had mostly hard packed snow and ice, with a little loose snow at the intersections. In the high teens for temperature, not much melting.

Perfect studded tire conditions. A nice day too. I took some photos.

http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/dad02915/album?.dir=/7e86&.src=ph&.tok=phktEbCBFMNfWXJZ

So how do the studs fair on the slushy, greasy mash potato stuff? better off with studs or with this coating are they useless? Thanks again for all your help.

I'd say that the studs have little effect in slush. The Nokians are strongly treaded, and this makes a big difference, however. They woerk much better than slicks.

It's probably best to think of the W106 as a winter bike tire that has studs.

Paul

Where did you get them, Tom?
Velo Plus?

yup. Velo Plus is the way to go.

Getcher Nokians right here! (https://www.veloplus.ch/shop/artikel_detail.asp?grp=320)

Closer to you than to me...

ya hoser...<g>

Get the W106 HAKKAPELIITA version, that's more than enough. Nah...just perfect!

So how do the studs fair on the slushy, greasy mash potato stuff? better off with studs or with this coating are they useless? Thanks again for all your help.

I agree totally with PaulH. The studs have little effect unless there is something hard to bite into. They don't cause any loss of traction in that stuff either.
But the tread helps.

I went out today for the first time on my new Nokian Extremes. I went to the MUP and of course it was not plowed and there were plenty of ruts from utility trucks that travel down the path to fix train things....Anyhow, it was completly different from my normal rides...(Not bad, just completely different)

First, let me just say...I would never have been able to ride at all without the Nokian Extremes. Secondly, on a normal (no snow) day I ride 15 miles in about 55 minutes. Today I rode 2.6 miles in 25 minutes and I was so tired after my first mile and a half that I had to turn around for fear that I would not be able to make it back.

The temp was -5f but I was plenty warm...I think tomorrow I'm going to try a totally different route (some street, some off road) so that I can push a little longer that 25 minutes. But overall -- I feel great today! I finally got that cabin fever (non excercise) feeling out. The $171 I spent with PeterWhiteCycles for the Nokians were worth every penny!

lbs called and my W106s are in. We'll see how I like um.

I went out today for the first time on my new Nokian Extremes. I went to the MUP and of course it was not plowed and there were plenty of ruts from utility trucks that travel down the path to fix train things....Anyhow, it was completly different from my normal rides...(Not bad, just completely different)

First, let me just say...I would never have been able to ride at all without the Nokian Extremes. Secondly, on a normal (no snow) day I ride 15 miles in about 55 minutes. Today I rode 2.6 miles in 25 minutes and I was so tired after my first mile and a half that I had to turn around for fear that I would not be able to make it back.

The temp was -5f but I was plenty warm...I think tomorrow I'm going to try a totally different route (some street, some off road) so that I can push a little longer that 25 minutes. But overall -- I feel great today! I finally got that cabin fever (non excercise) feeling out. The $171 I spent with PeterWhiteCycles for the Nokians were worth every penny!

If you ran into a lot of frozen ice bumps and it was very bumpy, experiment with low tire pressure. It helps in the snow too. Of course it's slow, but as you say this is different. I am 175 lbs and I run 25 psi in back and 22 in front on ice, and most of the time in the snow too, on my hardtail. Find a safely frozen lake or a skating rink. !!

If you ran into a lot of frozen ice bumps and it was very bumpy, experiment with low tire pressure. It helps in the snow too. Of course it's slow, but as you say this is different. I am 175 lbs and I run 25 psi in back and 22 in front on ice, and most of the time in the snow too, on my hardtail. Find a safely frozen lake or a skating rink. !!

It was that the snow on the MUP was too deep. We got 14 inches of snow the other day and it hasn't melted at all.... That's why I'm going to find a different route tomorrow...I think in a week or so, the snow should melt down to 3 or 4 inches and then it will be alot easier to get through. I read icebike.org last night to make sure I knew what I was getting myself into...and one thing they got right --- "Expect to fall and falling in the snow doesn't hurt." :)

I did hit a small hill that was completly covered in ice...The Nokian extremes grabbed that hill and took me right up as if I was on dry pavement...I was really shocked and wished the whole path was covered in ice.