Touring - Boy if I could do that tour again I would ..................!!!!

I am not new to bicycles but am new to this touring thing. My plan is to retire next spring, hop on my Surly LHT and ride 1000 miles from central Mt. to eastern SD where I grew up. Will be doing this myself, camping for most of it and of course credit card to motel when I need/want to. I have been riding quite a bit and putting good miles on the bike and will work hard at it next spring to get into shape also. Plan is to strike out about 1st of June and head east.

So that being said, I'm just asking this, we all have said it many times for different reasons but don't we all catch our self saying " boy if I could do that again I would blah blah blah, do that different or blah blah blah bring that along, or not bring that along. Or gosh I wish I would have done that.

I'm going to try to learn to relax and take my time as I have no deadlines. Just want to feel retired. Is that possible?

Let your fingers do the keyboard and thanks. :):):):)

Marlowe
Great Falls, MT.

It is possible, whether you're 24 or 64.

There isn't much I would change in terms of what I bring on tours. We're on a long tour (7.5 months) right now, and I've used most of what I packed and don't regret much of anything. I might have taken 2 pairs of cycling shorts instead of 3, but not a big deal. But that's what shorter practice tours are for.


However, this tour has introduced us to various parts of the world ... and we would really like to return to some of them ... to travel in those areas again, for longer ...

-- Hokkaido, Japan. We spent 10 days there and would like to spend a month.
-- Scotland. We spent 3 weeks there and could probably spend 5 or 6.
-- Switzerland. We spent a little over a week there, and could easily spend 2 or 3 or more (but it is very expensive)
-- And so far, best of all, the west coast of France ... the Velodyssey Route. The whole route goes from the UK to Spain. We only cycled a small portion in the middle, but really enjoyed it. So much, that we've been talking about renting a house for the summer there ... or maybe even staying longer if possible.

I Should have read tons of history , before going thru places
with a long, rich history, all around me.

Coming from AHistorical USA, and going to Ireland and the British Isles
which had settlements of stone tool making people.

OK NA has those people too But they were wiped out
to take their Land and repeatedly sell it to each other.

http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/doc/?o=1&doctype=journal

For some inspiration, read the journals of these ppl who have toured from all over the world.

Have a great trip.

Regarding things I'd do differently on tours i have done...
I'd would pack a lot lighter on my earlier tours if I had it to do over. In particular I'd have splurged on a lighter tent (I carried a 10 pound tent for the three of us and cursed at it every day). I also would have taken less spare parts on the TA. On the other hand, I would have taken a Unior Cassette Cracker, but at the time I didn't know they existed.

I regret not having kept journals for the tours I did when I was in my twenties. For my recent tours, in my late fifties, I have kept journals. It's not that I even reference them much, but I still like the concept that I can.

An easy one when hidsight is factored in.

I begged to get "downsized" by May of '99. I was and rode across the country and then some. The following winter I was getting set to tour Andalucia from mid-May to the end of April and then start another extended cross country trip in late May following ACA's Pac. Coast, Northern Tier, Great Parks (north and south), Trans Am and Atlantic Coast routes. In February, I met a woman who was 12 years my junior and got serious in a very short time, which was the last thing I was looking to do. When I returned from Spain, the aforesaid woman suggested that, instead of riding across the country, I come visit her and her friends who would be interning in Mesa Verde National Park. After that, we would have a grand time doing some car touring and then head up to WY for an organized tour. I agreed.

While I was on the road, we would write each other and occasionally talk on the phone. I believe I have the abiliy to read people fairly well. At some point I got the feeling that my arrival was becoming, how should I say it, less anticipated. The feeling grew so stronger. After crossing Hooiser Pass, I stopped in Fairplay, CO, which is where I had to decide to stay on the Trans Am east or take the Great Parks South route to Mesa Verde. I spent over an hour in the town park trying to determine whether my Spidey senses were out of whack or whether my feeling was accurate. In the end, I decided on the former. I made the wrong deicison. About a month later I found myself in Denver waiting to start a train trip back home.

That feeling of no deadlines, no rush, at peace with yourself, and with the world, and all who are on this ship together, is possible.

It's an inner attitude, or spirit, and may be the most important part of a tour.

Indyfabz,

Very reminiscent of some variations on those themes in my own touring.

That feeling of no deadlines, no rush, at peace with yourself, and with the world, and all who are on this ship together, is possible.

It's an inner attitude, or spirit, and may be the most important part of a tour.

+1

That feeling of no deadlines, no rush, at peace with yourself, and with the world, and all who are on this ship together, is possible.

It's an inner attitude, or spirit, and may be the most important part of a tour.
+1
For that reason I usually advise folks try to not have fixed schedules or end dates on tours unless the geographic end point is flexible. Being saddled with a firm exact deadline or rigid schedule sucks.

Touring is 90% mental,10% physical.....as long as you have time on your side......
If you have time issues,it's the other way around.....You don't have to think much to get to point B as fast as you can.....doesn't take much brain power to put your head down and push the pedals.

Have fun!

+1
For that reason I usually advise folks try to not have fixed schedules or end dates on tours unless the geographic end point is flexible. Being saddled with a firm exact deadline or rigid schedule sucks.

I know the hardest part will be for me to kill the portion of my brain that for the last 30 years has caused me to be on time, don't miss this or that schedule. This is not a sanctioned tour at all. I have never ridden more that a few miles until I decided a few months back that this is what I will do when I retire. I bought the Surly and have been riding hard. Lost 15lbs with a few to go yet. Legs seem to be good at 62, lungs are good.

I hoping the only worry I have is will I make the next town before dark. And really with my bike packed with a tent and sleeping bag not sure why I should ever worry about that either. I just don't want to get all done with trip and say, "why didn't I do that or I should have taken the time to do that". Hey you know maybe I will do it again the next year. I should have the time right!!!

Thanks for the advise. Come on now, don't be shy guy and gals. Need more input here.

Marlowe

I know the hardest part will be for me to kill the portion of my brain that for the last 30 years has caused me to be on time, don't miss this or that schedule. This is not a sanctioned tour at all. I have never ridden more that a few miles until I decided a few months back that this is what I will do when I retire. I bought the Surly and have been riding hard. Lost 15lbs with a few to go yet. Legs seem to be good at 62, lungs are good.

I hoping the only worry I have is will I make the next town before dark. And really with my bike packed with a tent and sleeping bag not sure why I should ever worry about that either. I just don't want to get all done with trip and say, "why didn't I do that or I should have taken the time to do that". Hey you know maybe I will do it again the next year. I should have the time right!!!
Thanks for the advise. Come on now, don't be shy guy and gals. Need more input here.

Marlowe
There really is no way of doing it right or wrong. It's done the way you wish it at the time.

I suppose the way to put it is, that it's the experience that counts. Use the experience to make it better next time.

One of my beliefs is: Our experiences yesterday give us the skills today to handle the challenges tomorrow.

It's one of the reasons why Machka posted what she did -- you may not get it right this time, but there is always the chance to do it again.

I know the hardest part will be for me to kill the portion of my brain that for the last 30 years has caused me to be on time, don't miss this or that schedule. This is not a sanctioned tour at all. I have never ridden more that a few miles until I decided a few months back that this is what I will do when I retire. I bought the Surly and have been riding hard. Lost 15lbs with a few to go yet. Legs seem to be good at 62, lungs are good.

I hoping the only worry I have is will I make the next town before dark. And really with my bike packed with a tent and sleeping bag not sure why I should ever worry about that either. I just don't want to get all done with trip and say, "why didn't I do that or I should have taken the time to do that". Hey you know maybe I will do it again the next year. I should have the time right!!!

Thanks for the advise. Come on now, don't be shy guy and gals. Need more input here.

Marlowe

Have you done some short tours yet? If not, go do some ... in the conditions you expect to encounter.

The answer to your question about what we might do differently is ... it depends. It depends on so many things.


For example, we have discovered that for the type of touring we're doing, folding bicycles would have been a better choice than the non-folding bicycles we chose. But the non-folding bicycles we chose would work well for other types of tours.

I like the post above about 90% mental (reminds me of a favorite Yogi Berraism). Something I was successful with on my last tour, not so much on previous tours, was keeping happy every day no matter the conditions. Somewhere along the way I learned that you can be in a good place or a bad place--your choice.

On the physical side, I think lighter pack weight and a simpler load leads to increased happiness. On that last tour, I halved my previous load and at least doubled my contentment.

Try not to second guess yourself about everything (or possibly even anything).

Last year during a ten-day trip in MT we really watned to ride this one pass, but it was offcially closed due to a huge washout. It's possible that we could have made it through, but had we gotten up there and found it impassible, we would have been in a world of hurt. We decided against risking it and instead took an alternate route suggested by an Adventure Cycling Association employee we had fortutiously ran into at a camprgound several days before. It turned out to a wonderful alternative. While I still want to ride that pass one day, I don't let the decision we made nag at me.

On the physical side, I think lighter pack weight and a simpler load leads to increased happiness. On that last tour, I halved my previous load and at least doubled my contentment.

For me the simplicity of living with a very few, but well thought out, gear and clothing items greatly enhances the touring experience.

On the other side of the coin I met a guy who was carrying 10 times the gear weight I was (literally 10 times) and apparently enjoying the trip very much. That was before I went as light as I have recently have, now it would be more than 20 times as much. So there is a really wide range of what folks find acceptable.

I do recommend folks trying going ultralight if so inclined though, but acknowledge that it isn't for everyone.

Try not to second guess yourself about everything (or possibly even anything).

While I still want to ride that pass one day, I don't let the decision we made nag at me.


Yeah, route changes happen.

Is I look back at my touring days, I regret that I did not make more of an effort to mix with the locals.

Marlowe, I thought about your question for a couple of days. On any ride that things went wrong, I learned something. On a ride where things went perfectly, I learned to appreciate that.

Brad

Is I look back at my touring days, I regret that I did not make more of an effort to mix with the locals.

Is that because of a time line you needed to make or was it a camping issue (stealth camping)? In a hurry or what?

Thanks,

Marlowe

If I ever do a very long tour again, what would I do different.... I wouldn't keep a live journal online. I kept one in 2005, and eventually the Columbia newspaper picked up on the tour. While it made me have followers at the time, I also felt like I was doing it for them instead of myself. Also what I would do different, I would take a day off from time to time, I realize now that rest days are very important.

Bring a point and shoot camera.

Take some pics each night when you stop.

It will help you remember each day later on.


http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/10wheels/Birth%20Place%20of%20Texas%20Ride/BirthPlaceofTexasRideApril2010039.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/10wheels/Birth%20Place%20of%20Texas%20Ride/BirthPlaceofTexasRideApril2010031.jpg

This is your first tour so I am going to suggest being well prepared. Pick a predictable route. If it is partly or all on an Adventure Cycling route, all the better. Look at gear lists of folks your age and see what they brought and what they would leave home next time. Now that is the safe way to tour.

Here is the next step up. You have decided on a starting point and finish point, great, don’t spend much time planning a route. Or if you have a route planned out don’t have a time line. If you have a timeline don’t have a planned route or a finish point.

If you have an interest and hopefully more than one, draw a big circle around your starting and ending and find all the places that match your interests, be they nature, birding, national parks, people, the arts, history, etc. Now see how you can link them together into some semblance of a route. Keep in mind once you are out on the road you will find at least that many places that were not on the map and some will be of even more interest to you. Now you are starting to tour.

This fall I rode from Quilcene, Washington on the Olympic Peninsula to Eugene Oregon. Google Maps put it at 540 kilometers by bicycle, an easy flat four day ride. I rode for thirty days and covered 2300 kilometers much of it on dirt roads and even a little single track. I explored four mountain ranges and many rivers. Eugene wasn’t my destination, just a stopping point precipitated by some mechanical problems or I might have ridden on for another week and finished riding to my home in Portland. Even though I took the Amtrak from Eugene to Portland I have no feeling that I didn’t finish the ride. The ride is never finished it just pauses and resumes in different places at different times depending on your interests. I could start and stop in the same two places and never even cross the first route.

Exactly the type of info I'm looking for. Great tip 10 Wheels.

Marlowe



Bring a point and shoot camera.

Take some pics each night when you stop.

It will help you remember each day later on.


http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/10wheels/Birth%20Place%20of%20Texas%20Ride/BirthPlaceofTexasRideApril2010039.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/10wheels/Birth%20Place%20of%20Texas%20Ride/BirthPlaceofTexasRideApril2010031.jpg

I'm wondering if you might not kick yourself a couple of days into your trip for not putting it off for another month or so. Early June is still pretty unpredictable as far as weather in your neck of the woods ain't it? A thousand miles shouldn't take very long to do, seems like the weather would be more stable in July than early June where you are.

Look at gear lists of folks your age and see what they brought and what they would leave home next time.
I am curious about why you add the "folks your age" part of that. My experience both as a tourist and as a host has been that age doesn't have much to do with packing styles. People plus or minus ten years of my age (61) have ranged from a 10 pound base weight to well over 10 times that. Young folks seem to be in a similar range at least based on the ones I have met.

The only difference I have seen with the age groups is that the older folks were just a bit more likely to have worked out a packing style that works well for them whether that style was heavy or light. That difference is probably only because more of the younger folks I met were on their first tour. For those first timers the common problem was that they were overloaded.

I am curious about why you add the "folks your age" part of that.

I don’t know. Wasn’t thinking I suppose. Marlowe didn’t give his/her age. Somehow I assumed mid-sixties, in which case I should have said “our age.” I have made two observations on older touring cyclists on their first tour. These are both from their internet gear lists and what I have seen unloaded at campgrounds. They tend to take way too much gear and often inappropriate gear (i.e.: a heavy stove more appropriate to car camping or as you mentioned an oversized-overweight tent) often resulting in physical injury and general physical and mental stress. Talking to them it seems to result from an insecurity of not having or not being able buy a needed item on the road. I have seen lots of young riders doing the same, but they seem to be able to adjust a bit easier.

The second is the predictability and security of the ride, day to day. Your legs give out in the afternoon, you run out of daylight before you make it to the next campground. The motels or the campgrounds are full, where to stop for the night? How many miles can I ride given the elevation gains? Will I be safe if I pull off the side of the road for the night? This is where ACA maps and a smart phone are at their best for the first time rider.

On my most recent tour I decided to turn east from the Pacific in Southern Oregon and go over the mountains on a Forest Service road. I met a USP driver in a small town the day before and he gladly offered to give me detailed information on any route I might take. I pulled out my map and showed him my proposed route and the smile left his face, “Are you sure?” he said with a bit of trepidation. “It’s almost 5,000 feet at the summit.” I went to the USFS office in Gold Beach the ranger told me they don’t allow RVs or trailers on the road but didn’t know about a bicycle. I think she was looking at my gray hair. She suggested I talk with the folks at the visitor center. “They have all the local road information.”

The visitor center volunteer said they tell folks in low clearance passenger cars not to try it, but that I should try the Forest Service office, “It is their road and they are responsible for keeping it safe.” You would have thought I was planning to head over the Pamir Highway in January. I said to myself, “God, what a waste of time.” and rode east.

I recount this not as a personal triumph over the naysayers, but just to state heading off into the unknown with dire warnings from folks who know nothing about bicycle touring might not be reassuring to the first time older rider. On the other hand, if a sixty five year old heart patient can do it and state with joy and satisfaction that it was both literally and metaphorically one of the high points of his tour then most anyone with a little experience and knowhow can also.

Looking back, I wish I would have slowed down more and smelled the roses but my type A personality and my real world schedule generally prohibited that. I'm really looking forward to touring without a time table in a year or two.

I'm wondering if you might not kick yourself a couple of days into your trip for not putting it off for another month or so. Early June is still pretty unpredictable as far as weather in your neck of the woods ain't it? A thousand miles shouldn't take very long to do, seems like the weather would be more stable in July than early June where you are.

Boy the heat/humidity in the upper plains can be a killer in July and August. And coming from central Montana where the humidity is very low will be hard on my old body in July and August. I am whining aren't I? June on the other hand is not so hot. Yes, thundershowers, spring storms, and bugs might be an issue for sure. Thanks for thinking about that though. The plan is to do 50-70 miles a day max and a day off a week or more often.
Marlowe

The second is the predictability and security of the ride, day to day. Your legs give out in the afternoon, you run out of daylight before you make it to the next campground. The motels or the campgrounds are full, where to stop for the night? How many miles can I ride given the elevation gains? Will I be safe if I pull off the side of the road for the night? This is where ACA maps and a smart phone are at their best for the first time rider.


ACA maps aren't going to help you if you venture out of the US and tour other countries. :lol:

Instead, this is where going on short tours in preparation for the longer tour are a very good idea for the first time cycletourist. Short tours can give you a good idea of what to bring, what to leave home, what to expect in terms of your body's ability to handle the ride, and they can also give you experience with following a real map, finding food, accommodation, etc. They can also tell you if touring is really your cup of tea ... touring isn't for everyone. And different people like different touring styles. Some feel comfortable with wild camping ... others like campgrounds ... others prefer to stay in hostels or hotels etc.

I highly recommend going for long day rides, overnight tours, long weekend tours, and week-long tours. Ride in all sorts of weather conditions, ride in all sorts of terrain. Discover for yourself a good weight limit for your panniers ... how heavy can you go before you can't make it up the hills? Discover for yourself a good daily riding distance. It is NOT necessary to ride 100 km/day, which seems to be a common number thrown about the forums for a daily distance. 30 or 40 or 50 km a day might be a much better choice for some people to allow them time to take it easy out there, to enjoy their surroundings, to stop and smell the roses, and to arrive at the next town in the middle of the afternoon so that there is time to find accommodations.


Cycletourists can take what they learn on shorter tours and apply them to longer tours.

I don’t know. Wasn’t thinking I suppose. Marlowe didn’t give his/her age. Somehow I assumed mid-sixties, in which case I should have said “our age.” I have made two observations on older touring cyclists on their first tour. These are both from their internet gear lists and what I have seen unloaded at campgrounds. They tend to take way too much gear and often inappropriate gear (i.e.: a heavy stove more appropriate to car camping or as you mentioned an oversized-overweight tent) often resulting in physical injury and general physical and mental stress. Talking to them it seems to result from an insecurity of not having or not being able buy a needed item on the road. I have seen lots of young riders doing the same, but they seem to be able to adjust a bit easier.

The second is the predictability and security of the ride, day to day. Your legs give out in the afternoon, you run out of daylight before you make it to the next campground. The motels or the campgrounds are full, where to stop for the night? How many miles can I ride given the elevation gains? Will I be safe if I pull off the side of the road for the night? This is where ACA maps and a smart phone are at their best for the first time rider.

On my most recent tour I decided to turn east from the Pacific in Southern Oregon and go over the mountains on a Forest Service road. I met a USP driver in a small town the day before and he gladly offered to give me detailed information on any route I might take. I pulled out my map and showed him my proposed route and the smile left his face, “Are you sure?” he said with a bit of trepidation. “It’s almost 5,000 feet at the summit.” I went to the USFS office in Gold Beach the ranger told me they don’t allow RVs or trailers on the road but didn’t know about a bicycle. I think she was looking at my gray hair. She suggested I talk with the folks at the visitor center. “They have all the local road information.”

The visitor center volunteer said they tell folks in low clearance passenger cars not to try it, but that I should try the Forest Service office, “It is their road and they are responsible for keeping it safe.” You would have thought I was planning to head over the Pamir Highway in January. I said to myself, “God, what a waste of time.” and rode east.

I recount this not as a personal triumph over the naysayers, but just to state heading off into the unknown with dire warnings from folks who know nothing about bicycle touring might not be reassuring to the first time older rider. On the other hand, if a sixty five year old heart patient can do it and state with joy and satisfaction that it was both literally and metaphorically one of the high points of his tour then most anyone with a little experience and knowhow can also.

Thanks for the clarification.

Touring is 90% mental,10% physical.....as long as you have time on your side......
If you have time issues,it's the other way around.....You don't have to think much to get to point B as fast as you can.....doesn't take much brain power to put your head down and push the pedals.

Have fun!

Sorry but touring is 90% physical and 10% mental ...except for those times when it's 90% physical and 90% mental;) The only time I've ever found it to be 10% physical is when I'm flying down a hill.

ACA maps aren't going to help you if you venture out of the US and tour other countries. :lol:



Quite true, but The OP was planning to ride from Montana to South Dakota. I know there are grumblings by some Northern Tier states of secession from the Union if the current president is reelected. If that happened, it could pose problems for the ACA cartographers. You might also need an international card for your phone.:eek:

Sorry but touring is 90% physical and 10% mental


Not according to the folks who quit the Great Divide Ride, as seen in http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1530991/.


Quite the opposite, in fact I think Booger1 nailed it.

Sorry, but I have to go with Yogi on this one,

"Touring is ninety percent mental and the other half is physical"

Is that because of a time line you needed to make or was it a camping issue (stealth camping)? In a hurry or what?

Thanks,

Marlowe
Hmmm...that's a good question. I'm not sure how to answer it; guess I never really thought about it much.
Although I seem quite gregarious to my friends, I truly am an introvert. Touring was a way to be alone in a crowd, I suppose.

Sorry I took so long to reply.