Advocacy & Safety - Bikers forced to wear reflective vests

So in the UK, they passed a law that requires bikers to wear regulation safety vests, and there was a massive protest.

What if they start making us wear reflective vests here in America?

There will also be a massive protest?!?

http://bikersofamerica.blogspot.com/2011/09/uk-bikers-join-in-national-protest-with.html

yea, given it is for motorcycles and scooters. i just wouldn't be surprised if something like this spread to america

Is it really worse than making people wear seat belts?

I wouldn't be as mad if the regulation vests weren't so ugly though... I work in the reflective safety industry, and from my research, there is no scientific or logical reason why the vests need to be that ugly to be efficient. Reflective tape industries are in control of these standards, and make sure that the government forces roadside workers to wear vests using their design (a design that uses their tape).

I hate lobbyists... and I hate the ANSI 107 standard.

Is it really worse than making people wear seat belts?

Yes!! if they are gonna make me wear a safety vest, it best not be ugly as sin

I wouldn't be as mad if the regulation vests weren't so ugly though... I work in the reflective safety industry, and from my research, there is no scientific or logical reason why the vests need to be that ugly to be efficient. Reflective tape industries are in control of these standards, and make sure that the government forces roadside workers to wear vests using their design (a design that uses their tape).

I hate lobbyists... and I hate the ANSI 107 standard.


Maybe this'll create a market for some sort of nicer looking reflective safety vest? :rolleyes:

Yes!! if they are gonna make me wear a safety vest, it best not be ugly as sin

I use this one. http://www.rei.com/media/mm/b1917317-b5c7-44e1-afa6-22078ba308cd.jpg
It's only sorta ugly.

Maybe this'll create a market for some sort of nicer looking reflective safety vest? :rolleyes:

Well to be honest, I have been trying to push for area reflective fabric, and for the designs to add more flexibility on materials, but the tape industries in control of the standards won't even listen to me, because they don't know how to make it themselves, and it does not include tape. I even had a conversation with one representative of the ANSI/ISEA 107 committee, and he told me, and i quote, "If it doesn't have reflective tape, I don't want to hear about it." I wish I had him write that to me in a documented letter.

The regulated reflective gear is specified so that it can be visible from around half a mile away, but 1) there is rarely a section on many roads that allow you to even see that far, unless you are on a really straight highway, 2) car's won't even locate you visually until you are around 140 meters away...

The area reflective fabric is visible from around 200+ meters away, plus it covers way more surface area on the body, plus it allows for more flexibility on more fashionable designs. Alas, regluations will never allow for it, because it is not made of reflective tape, and for that reason alone.


God Bless Big Businesses, and millions they spend on lobbiest.

I use this one. http://www.rei.com/media/mm/b1917317-b5c7-44e1-afa6-22078ba308cd.jpg
It's only sorta ugly.

haha, thanks, yea that vest isn't bad ^^ i'll check it out!

haha, thanks, yea that vest isn't bad ^^ i'll check it out!

But doesn't that have reflective tape on it?

If you're willing to use readily available reflective tape, it isn't all that hard to make your own reflective vest if you have sewing skills. I don't know about the availability of reflective fabric, but I believe I've seen garments made out of it in the past.

And honestly, I really wouldn't have a problem with it if reflective vests were required by law for night riding.

But doesn't that have reflective tape on it?

If you're willing to use readily available reflective tape, it isn't all that hard to make your own reflective vest if you have sewing skills. I don't know about the availability of reflective fabric, but I believe I've seen garments made out of it in the past.

And honestly, I really wouldn't have a problem with it if reflective vests were required by law for night riding.

Well the vest doesn't meet regulation standards, but it doesn't mean that it's not good. I haven't seen it in person yet, or tested it out, but it looks nice.

Calm down. It's not going to happen here.

I'm not saying tape is bad. I like tape. My business runs off tape. It's just that it's not right to make a standard that is driven to protect the interest of certain companies, and ignore scientific evidence / field research.

The armed services require members to wear vests when riding a motorcycle.

The armed services require members to wear vests when riding a motorcycle.

I think it's good that people are protected by these vests, and made more visibile. I just wish people were able to have more of an option of what they can wear. This is America. If they are gonna force someone to wear a protective vest, they should also give that person a wide variety of options to choose from. I don't want no ugly gear crampin my style.

I think it's good that people are protected by these vests, and made more visibile. I just wish people were able to have more of an option of what they can wear. This is America. If they are gonna force someone to wear a protective vest, they should also give that person a wide variety of options to choose from. I don't want no ugly gear crampin my style.

The problem is that there is no market for good looking safety vests. Low cost is more important to the people that are required to wear a vest. The average person couldn't care less about their appearance while digging a ditch.

The problem is that there is no market for good looking safety vests. Low cost is more important to the people that are required to wear a vest. The average person couldn't care less about their appearance while digging a ditch.


Perhaps you are right. And I agree that low cost is more important in those situations, however those vests get dirty really fast and new vests are required to be purchased after around 2-3 washes, because the washing machine destroys them. Area reflective fabric can be much more durable to wash, while sustaining reflective functions. But then again, this could potentially hurt the reflective tape industry, which is why the reflective tape companies are working so hard to prevent anything new from entering into their market, regardless of convenience or safety.

ANSI/ISEA 107 standard, isn't really about safety. They hide behind reasons of safety to protect their main interest, their business... which is wrong.

Calm down. It's not going to happen here.Yeah, that's what everyone was saying when there was talk of outlawing online poker, but the politicians tacked the law onto the ports security bill and passed it at 1AM in the morning after most legislators had gone home for the session. Land of the free is long gone.

But I guess I shouldn't be complaining, since my business profits off of this standard as well. I just find the large companies annoying, because they pick on us little guys whenever they can... One time they called me out (a large company that I won't mention for legal reasons) for selling a vest through a municipal contract that "didn't meet ANSI 107 Standards." I then told them to re-test it at a laboratory, and results showed that my vest did in fact pass their ridiculous standards (ridiculous for reasons I can explain if anyone cares to know), and then I went on to call them out on one of their own vests that I found did not meet their own standards, and it in fact DID NOT PASS.

Unfortunately, the sample of their vest that did not pass standards, mysteriously vanished off the face of the planet... conspiracy? I think so.

Yeah, that's what everyone was saying when there was talk of outlawing online poker, but the politicians tacked the law onto the ports security bill and passed it at 1AM in the morning after most legislators had gone home for the session. Land of the free is long gone.

LOL, yea... so sad... i like online poker. But anyways, I can't say that I don't want a law to be passed about making bikers wear reflective vests, because it would help my business, but I hope that in the event that something like this happens, that people would have the mind to stand up to it.

To be real, blinkers/headlights already make bikers sufficiently visible to drivers. Reflective gear would most definitely make bikers more visible, but if reflective gear is forced to be worn, I strongly hope they will have the decency to give us a wide variety of reflective gear to choose from...

I'll be damned if I actually have to wear one of these vests that I sell... lol

It would be ironic if they managed to institute such a law in PA since they undid the motorcycle helmet requirement a couple years ago. That said, I would not mind it being more common to use vests. Some of the Amish are even using them now. Once I sat down with my sewing machine and reshaped it to not be baggy/flappy it isn't so bad to wear.

France requires everyone walking/standing on a road to wear a safety vest. This includes motorists when they get out of their cars, for example

When I go on Sky Rides they make us wear their reflective tabards.

Even if we turn up without it, they still get it out of the car and make us wear them.

281728

Why not require a safety vest while having sex?
This world is becoming too regulated!

Why not require a safety vest while having sex?
This world is becoming too regulated!I believe those are called condoms and they're available in safety yellow.

So in the UK, they passed a law that requires bikers to wear regulation safety vests, and there was a massive protest.

What if they start making us wear reflective vests here in America?

I have no problem wearing a reflective vest. At the same time, any regulation that is enacted, shouldn't end up being weak at best.

The only reason I don't wear a reflective vest, is because my long-sleeve biking jacket is rayon yellow. So it is virtually impossible to not see me. Unless the motorist is not paying attention to the road.


Is it really worse than making people wear seat belts?

Ditto!!

France requires everyone walking/standing on a road to wear a safety vest. This includes motorists when they get out of their cars, for example

I think the whole UK requires it. And it has to be of EU471 Standards. EU471 standard vests are virtually the same as ANSI/ISEA 107 Vests.

Guess where EU471 got the idea from...

All reflective vest standards are controlled by the top guns of the reflective tape industry, and they all work together to maintain their industries through the ANSI/ISEA 107 standard. I've been working to push a standard through ISO to allow more flexibility in the standard, unfortunately my voice has constantly been muffled by the giants.

These standards have been around for so long, that noone really questions why they are the way they are. People all realize that the construction vests are ugly, but they don't realize that it's not necessary for functionality. The big guns created the design for everyone to follow, and people do, because the government makes them, in the name of safety.

Now this won't really be a problem for us unless America decides to follow after the EU in making everyone make these regulated vests...

I don't have a problem with the functionality of the current standardized vests, I just have a problem with the standards being driven by protecting the reflective tape industry, over scientific research/ field tests. If anyone wants, I could procure the documents showing that it's unnecessary for these standards to be so restrictive on creative design.

If the standardized vests allowed for more creativity, it could open a HUGE market for bike shops, running shops, sportswear lines... but that government regulated market, has been closed off by the reflective tape giants... I would protect it too, being that it's like... a multi-billion dollar market. It's pretty smart really.

Does it make anyone else angry that the giant reflective tape industries are growing fat off these standards and shutting off the market to clothing designers?

When I go on Sky Rides they make us wear their reflective tabards.

Even if we turn up without it, they still get it out of the car and make us wear them.

281728

Under what authority?

I would only support a law that requires a cyclist to either wear a reflective vest or equip the bicycle with some sort of reflective device between dusk and dawn. In other words, either you, or your bike, should have some reflective on. I think that would be reasonable.

Does it make anyone else angry that the giant reflective tape industries are growing fat off these standards and shutting off the market to clothing designers?
Given that no bicyclist in the US is required to wear reflective vests by any state or local government and that there is no proposed legislation anywhere in the U.S. to change the status quo: Why are you so obsessed with this issue?

The Village of North Utica, Illinois has an ordinance that requires the wearing of reflective clothing or items (not specifically a vest) at night. The fine is not less than $10 nor more than $100 for each offense.

Why not require a safety vest while having sex?
This world is becoming too regulated!

I've never heard of it referred to that way... but yes I wear a safety *vest* while having sex. Why?

A vest seems more or less superfluous if you have a good blinkie and on-bike reflectors. I've never felt the need to wear one.

As to tape, SOLAS tape is awesome stuff.

Given that no bicyclist in the US is required to wear reflective vests by any state or local government and that there is no proposed legislation anywhere in the U.S. to change the status quo: Why are you so obsessed with this issue?

eh, reflective gear is what i do for a business. i suppose i'm just venting some frustration because the big dogs in the industry keep pushing around the little guys, and it makes me angry when there isn't much I can do about it but rant. It sucks when it doesn't matter who is right or wrong, and just matters who has more money and the bigger guns.

Why not require a safety vest while having sex?
This world is becoming too regulated!

It would get in the way of the harness, and possibly jam up the block & tackle.

Is this one of those things where there's a dangerous group of road users, so they make other people change their behavior instead?

I never fail to be amazed at the incomprehensible confusion of thoughts that must lead to some of these laws.

I will not be surprised if some day there is a law requiring cyclists to wear body armors and be equipped with a loud speaker announcing: "Watch out, bike here!"

And yet, living in the U.S., I can still play online poker anytime I like. A nationwide mandate for reflective vests is absurd. Unlike the UK, the U.S. has 50 state legislatures.

Is this one of those things where there's a dangerous group of road users, so they make other people change their behavior instead?
This thread has nothing to do with riders or cycling, but rather the OP's "venting" and ranting about his own job related frustration.

This thread has nothing to do with riders or cycling, but rather the OP's "venting" and ranting about his own job related frustration.

Well, in my world it is related to cycling, as I do cover cycling gear, and it is a potential future issue. If you don't like it, or care, no one is forcing you to read it. Reflective gear and blinkies don't have anything to do with riding bikes, but people still discuss them on cycling forums. They are both forms of safety gear. Safety and cycling is my world, I'm sorry to have offended you.

Well the vest doesn't meet regulation standards, but it doesn't mean that it's not good. I haven't seen it in person yet, or tested it out, but it looks nice.

Aerotech Designs , a bicycle clothing maker has set up a room and along with 3M they are designing a garment to give 360 degree reflection

Also I were reflective vest but that didn't seem to matter to the guy who hit me in a construction zone while i was wearing it

Well, in my world it is related to cycling, as I do cover cycling gear, and it is a potential future issue. If you don't like it, or care, no one is forcing you to read it. Reflective gear and blinkies don't have anything to do with riding bikes, but people still discuss them on cycling forums. They are both forms of safety gear. Safety and cycling is my world, I'm sorry to have offended you.

Reflective gear may be cycling related.

Your personal nightmares about non-existent laws that you dreamed up as a "potential future issue", may be your personal issue, but are NOT cycling issues.

Why not require a safety vest while having sex?
This world is becoming too regulated!

Yeah, I can hardly keep track of the number of times I'm nearly run over from behind by a car when I'm having sex.

Why not require a safety vest while having sex?
This world is becoming too regulated!
Also too full of of worry-worts panicking about compliance with non-existent regulations.

I'd be OK with it as long as they make cars and pedestrians wear reflective vests as well. Fair's fair, right?

I actually always wear a reflective vest except when I'm riding in broad daylight in the summer with no jacket - but then I'm wearing an alertshirt.

So in the UK, they passed a law that requires bikers to wear regulation safety vests, and there was a massive protest.

What if they start making us wear reflective vests here in America?

Did they? When did that happen?