Foo - Do you think you can save enough money to pay for bike injuries.

Maybe, Sort of misleading, but we do get injuried while cycling..I did..I have a company sponsored Medical Plan..My shoulder injury cost about $20,000...Happened while biking..
The new HHS secretary says your employer should only be responsible for Catastrophic care coverage..You would have to establish medical accounts to pay for non-life threatening medical costs...See link below in Los Angeles Times about this story..I know, if not covered by a group medical plan,you probably have no coverage anyway.....What 40 million Americans have no medical coverage. So your worries will be the same..
Poll..Think you have enough discretionary income to pay for your bike injuries..I know a friend while biking broke a rib..Cost his insurance company over $100,000....
Another question..How much cash do you think you need put into a medical account before you get to the age needed to qualify for Medicare..Think you can stash away enough for 40 years worth of non-catastrophic medical bills..??
Might interfere with the kids college fund?


http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/0131-06.htm

Does this not let your employers off the hook in terms of providing medical coverage..Do you have the ability to buy your own policy.

Most catastrophic plans have a 2 to 5K deductable. So you really only need the max out of pocket in the bank to be safe.

This is one of the major drawbacks of self employment. Insurance is MUCH cheaper in group policies. Even group policies through an association are still pricey (IEEE and ASCE offer insurance, most large ones probably do).

Luckily that doesn't apply down here, all our medical is free (paid by the taxpayer). When I hit a dog last year I woke up in hospital, had a few x-rays and a stayed there for the day, it cost nothing. I didn't even have to sign anything.

I also had a Hernia operation about 10 years ago, and was in for 3-4days, that was free also. People in Australia should stop b!itching about our hospital system, as far as I can tell it's pretty good.

CHEERS.

Mark

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/0131-06.htm
that's so fubar... makes you think the policy makers have stock in supplemental insurance companies.

Ironically, the people who'd suffer the most are the ones who voted for said policy makers.

So is catastrophic care begin at 5 or 50,000...My understanding is $50.000....And is it defined by cost of definition of what is catastrophic...
Think much luck in shopping about for a MRI/Cat scan..Maybe they have 'bargin Tuesdays'.

Luckily that doesn't apply down here, all our medical is free (paid by the taxpayer). When I hit a dog last year I woke up in hospital, had a few x-rays and a stayed there for the day, it cost nothing. I didn't even have to sign anything.

I also had a Hernia operation about 10 years ago, and was in for 3-4days, that was free also. People in Australia should stop b!itching about our hospital system, as far as I can tell it's pretty good.

CHEERS.

Mark


How much do you pay in taxes for this insurance?

I only know what I know from looking at group policies from associations. Most call their high deductable plans "catastrophic" and they offer no Rx card or co-pays before you meet the deductable. I have no idea if your employer will offer the same. It is a small step above being uninsured, and best used for healthy young people without chronic illnesses.

Some MSAs do not allow you to roll the balance over from year to year, so make sure you know the details before you decide how much to contribute from your paycheck.

I would also try to negiotiate some more $ from the employer to cover the increased healthcare costs, since they will be paying much less for your insurance, but that's just me. I don't like it when employers lure with benefits and then think you won't notice when they disappear.

Our nephew lived in Barcelona Spain and now Singapore..He pays less than $100 a month for insurance for he and his wife..that because he has not taken out papers to become citizens..
We have some experience with the medical system in France/Spain..My wife was hurt in a accident while horse back riding...Fell off a horse hit a block wall...Superfical head wounds (amazing) and two breaks in her left arm...
Went to the ER room...In an ambulance...Four x rays, ER, doctors exam, set arm, put arm in cast,and three therapy follow up sessions...
Cost was under our US deductible...About $55...Said if had been life threatening it would have cost us nothing..Service excellant..No wait...No paper work until we were on the way out..Spanish staff treated us royally..
Hospital was familiar with bone breaks, in the Val De' Aran in the Spanish Pyreenees...$55 because we were non citizens.
What in US less than one X ray..
Don't know what they pay in taxes, but our nephew said it wouldbe far less than the $700 a month my employer pays in premimums, that some day I might have to pay..
The ambulance service was considered a municipal service..no charge.
ps---Spent the week in a hotel in Toulouse , and that trip-I without a bike. While Gina's pain lessened...But, that week at least the Tour De France passed through Toulouse, so something to watch..Bored, but my job was to look after my wife..

My health insurance will pay for my medical expenses, save for co-pays, unless I was in an offical race.

I have regular health ins. 2 life ins. policies. Short term disability and Long term policies. As well as Aflack. I am covered from head to toe. Worth every penny.

I have regular health ins. 2 life ins. policies. Short term disability and Long term policies. As well as Aflack. I am covered from head to toe. Worth every penny.
But do you pay for them yourself. Could you afford to pay for all of them out of your own pocket. Sounds like over a grand a month, to me..How many people can afford that...
Today, I heard, the cyclist friend who had the $100K hospital bill.. his wife made him give up cycling for one year..Feels he does not concentrate on the road ahead enough...Sort of like motorist....

But do you pay for them yourself. Could you afford to pay for all of them out of your own pocket. Sounds like over a grand a month, to me..How many people can afford that...
Today, I heard, the cyclist friend who had the $100K hospital bill.. his wife made him give up cycling for one year..Feels he does not concentrate on the road ahead enough...Sort of like motorist....

I pay for the aflack and one of the life (non-term) ins. policies. Everything else is picked up by my employer(health, dental, vision, life). The life ins policy cost me $40/mo. The aflack (sp?) policies cost me less than $20/mo.

My employer now pays out a little under $700 a month for my medical coverage..It is a big organization..How many companies can pay out that much..?That is just medical...
I read of late, some poor smuck with Health Net..Family member needed chemo....Health Net has such low pay out schedules..Family had to raise $24,000 of own funds before Chemo. could commence, because provider's base fees just not cut it..All of you have $24,000 to spare..
ANother story...Unemployed woman in Utah...Utah has highest rate of bankruptacy in the nation..Very aggressive medical insurance companies there...She had a brain clot...Had to remove clot with brain surgery...
Medical provider did the operation, but would not put back in place her skull....Would not until she came up with funds for surgery...She had to wear a helmet, since she had no skull.
Finally, the story made it to Salt Lake city TV..Looked too bad , gave her back her skull before she could finish payment...Injury came about as a result of a car accident....Don't know how payment was settled...Her skull was kept in a refrigerator...Do all of you have enough cash to get back your skull...

Not a political slam or anything, but I'm glad to be Canadian.

But do you pay for them yourself. Could you afford to pay for all of them out of your own pocket. Sounds like over a grand a month, to me..How many people can afford that...
Today, I heard, the cyclist friend who had the $100K hospital bill.. his wife made him give up cycling for one year..Feels he does not concentrate on the road ahead enough...Sort of like motorist....

A recent Harvard study shows that about 1/2 of the personal bankruptcies are caused by costs related to health problems. I think we all knew that much. However, the real shocker is that having insurance DIDN'T MATTER! In other words, when you REALLY need insurance, it's most likely not going to be there due to contractual issues.

Read about it here (http://www.reutershealth.com/archive/2005/02/02/eline/links/20050202elin017.html)

A big influence in our thinking was my wife's horseback accident while in Spain..No worries..Don't know about the Spanish medical system, but the only stress we felt was my wife's physical discomfort...That was enough in addition to not need to secure a bank loan..

Not a political slam or anything, but I'm glad to be Canadian.
Pedal..We were a condo owner when we lived in Sarasota , Florida..Our next door neighbors were from Sudbury , Ontario...If they had anything more than a simple cold, they would high tail it back to Ontario ASAP, no matter what the plane fare costs or how bad the weather was...
Florida is full of Canadian snow birds...

Even employer provided health coverage isn't what it used to be. I work for a major worldwide corporation with tens of thousands of employees. They pick up the cost of my health insurance - about $250 per month - and offer nothing for the rest of my family. Every 2 weeks, another $374 is deducted to cover my wife and 2 boys. That's over a grand per month for a healthy family of 4, not including dental, vision, supplemental life or LTD.

55/Rad

One of my biggest bones to pick with our medical insurance is not just its expense, but also dealing with its bureauracy..
Example..My shoulder operation...Took two months to approve an MRI to approve needed completely , torn rotor cuff repair..All the while the muscles were atrophying...And after surgery, they only gave me 10 weeks of therapy..Not enough ..One session per week..ps-- Before the operation, they gave me two weeks of therapy, 2 sessions per week, when it was totally useless...Therapist had to convince them it was useles..How nice of them..

A recent Harvard study shows that about 1/2 of the personal bankruptcies are caused by costs related to health problems. I think we all knew that much. However, the real shocker is that having insurance DIDN'T MATTER! In other words, when you REALLY need insurance, it's most likely not going to be there due to contractual issues.

Read about it here (http://www.reutershealth.com/archive/2005/02/02/eline/links/20050202elin017.html)

I have heard that many times.
Wait and see if someone from Canada or Australia, and many other industrialized nations, come out and complain about their health care system. Chances are no one. I used to live in Japan. I don't miss much about the cultural thing but only thing I miss is a health care coverage. Only people in Japan complain about the health care system are in the medical industry.

By the way, bac, your link is forbidden to others.

By the way, bac, your link is forbidden to others.

ThanX for the heads-up. Here's another link that (I hope!) works:

Harvard Study on Bankruptcy (http://business.bostonherald.com/businessNews/view.bg?articleid=66443)

ThanX for the heads-up. Here's another link that (I hope!) works:

Harvard Study on Bankruptcy (http://business.bostonherald.com/businessNews/view.bg?articleid=66443)

Thanks bac, it worked.

Here's a part of the article,

" Nearly two-thirds of the people in the study had health insurance, but one-third lost their coverage when they lost their jobs. "

Not a political slam or anything, but I'm glad to be Canadian.

Thinking the same thing. I only have to cover the 'extras' myself or thought work coverage :)

I was hoping someone from Utah would confirm what I am sure I read...Utah has the highest rates of personal bankruptacy in the US...All caused by super aggressive medical insurance companies.
To top it off..US bankruptacy laws have been changed...Past debts are not ever forgiven , just delayed - as I recall...So you get on you feet again , you have maybe that $100,000 medical bill rearing its head again..
I saw the author of the Harvard Bankruptacy study interviewed on C Span....She compared the US medical insurance umberella to one that melts in the rain...She has cadillac insurance from Harvard and when her daughter suffered from a sports injury, she ended up paying over $5,000 that the insurer would not cover for more than two months therapy...
I got ten weeks...Instead of almost $100 a session, I will forever have a gimpy shoulder...Had hoped swimming would help..Have a long way to go to be normal..

Question to those who think they can actually pay for your non-catastrophic medical bills out of your descretionary budget..Are you sure?

this is one of the things that makes me want to move to another country.

we don't get our education paid for.

we don't get our health care paid for.

40% of the federal budget goes down the drain on old people somehow... although they still can't afford their meds. apparently canadians are dying at an alarming rate from the meds their government gives them. so old people here can't go there for their meds. and a box of kleenex's has to cost about $7 in a hospital. can't have to many of those precious things. man.


just kinda shows ya how much this country's politicians really care about us.

Merton.....A question...Recall the scandals we just had with Vioxx.....How many died...I raise the point...We hear all this stuff about frivilious lawsuits...! Think those who died of Vioxx think a lawsuit might be frivilious? Any tie in there to Vioxx and a payoff for torte reform? and we are told Canadian medicine is risky..Ask a Vioxx victim !..?

I was hoping someone from Utah would confirm what I am sure I read...Utah has the highest rates of personal bankruptacy in the US...All caused by super aggressive medical insurance companies.


This is true, but I don't believe the medical insurance companies are a major factor in Utah's high bankruptcy rate. I think it's the local culture and large familes due to the prominant mormon religion. Larger than average families and homes, low wages, high home prices and high "charitable commitments"... more... (http://www.bankjr.com/teachers/reasons_for_bankruptcies.jsp)

Joe...Curious..Is there a way to find out how many bankruptacies are caused each year for medical reasons in Utah...? Did you read about the unemployed woman and her missing skull? I read it finally made Salt Lake City TV news? That is how she got her skull back...Also, if personal charity is so successful you would think the rate of bankruptacy would be less...What your study referred to said 24% higher than national average..
My point, the Harvard study said something like 50% of national bankruptacies are caused by medical costs. or 3/4 of a million people.

Merton.....A question...Recall the scandals we just had with Vioxx.....How many died...I raise the point...We hear all this stuff about frivilious lawsuits...! Think those who died of Vioxx think a lawsuit might be frivilious? Any tie in there to Vioxx and a payoff for torte reform? and we are told Canadian medicine is risky..Ask a Vioxx victim !..?

what was the question mr. rambly man?

oh. you think the gov and the drug are in bed with each other? yup. it'd make the bestest nasthiest porn ever.... maybe. :D

also... i used vioxx.. for a few weeks..i'm gonna shut up fore i jinx myself. :cry:

This is true, but I don't believe the medical insurance companies are a major factor in Utah's high bankruptcy rate. I think it's the local culture and large familes due to the prominant mormon religion. Larger than average families and homes, low wages, high home prices and high "charitable commitments"... more... (http://www.bankjr.com/teachers/reasons_for_bankruptcies.jsp)

"Just over two-thirds of them are filed as Chapter 7, which means Utahns want to be relieved of all unsecured debts."

Isn't it safe to say the biggest debt they want to be relieved of is the unpaid medical bills? what you think the hospitals would do, if so many people file a bankruptsy to avoid paying bills? Like keeping the skull until the patient pays?

Look at this in logical way, it is a major factor of the bankrupsy in the rest of the nation. It is also a major factor in Utah. The article tells why it's worse in Utah.

How much do you pay in taxes for this insurance?
It's hard to say really. We pay income tax, which is on a sliding scale, the more you earn the more you pay. If some one earns $50,000 a year they lose about $10,000 to the tax man, but they can claim some of this back as work related expenses. Like dry-cleaning, stationary, magazines, petrol, car payments (if used for work) etc. Plus all workers (Not employees) pay 1% tax toward Medicare. We have a nationwide 10% flat rate GST (goods and services tax) on everything we buy. Couples earning $100,000 combined pay an extra 1%. I think we are taxed about the same as most Western countries. The benefit is that regardless of where you live in the country, or your financial situation, you have access to "free" Hospitals. And they are reasonably good Hospitals, with a lot of modern equipment. BTW Almost all workers get an award wage as a minimum, even burger flippers at Maccas (that's one reason we don't tip down here). The employee pays money toward superannuation, and workers compensation.

CHEERS.

Mark

I almost forgot, our Lotto winnings are tax free, not that I'll ever have to worry about that.

When between jobs our expenses for medical insurance were about $500 a month, so we went without..That will pay a lot of taxes....Taxes rarely cause you to go bankrupt like unpaid medical bills...If had to buy it now, due to being older, would cost up like $700 a month. Again that Pays a lot of taxes...About the same as the income of $50,000 in Australia..

[QUOTE=Dutchy]. BTW Almost all workers get an award wage as a minimum, even burger flippers at Maccas (that's one reason we don't tip down here). The employee pays money toward superannuation, and workers compensation.

CHEERS.

Mark


A Cheapo friends of ours , complains that a higher mininum wage increases the cost of everything...Here in the US restaurant workers can make sub-minimum wage, because tips are so good...
I had this conversation with a bar keep in the south of France..Restaurant workers in France make a good salary so they do not tip , they are considered professional, (ie-the emphasis they put on restaurant protocol in France, Italy...)With a good wage and health benefits, he agreed- there are no jobs not beneath someone's dignity-as we say in the US...Besides, what is the use of taking a job with no benefits, when a sickness will wipe out all your savings. ?
The heart of my question, restaurant workers , besides getting medical coverage, they probably make a decent minimum wage?
This cheapo friend..Says restaurant workers, should not make much money..It is an entry job , whatever that is..
I tell them when eating out..Maybe he should inspect his food to me sure he is not the victim of a disgruntled worker...If you get my point. It is only their health.