Singlespeed & Fixed Gear - bah! Another one bites the dust: stay away from basic Suzue hubs

What ever you do, get IRO, get Surly, stay away from Suzue basic. Thank you very much.

Lost my rear hub today. Have about 800 miles on it, no skidding and very little back pedaling resistance. Planning on phoning Tony shortly... :mad:

seriously, dude. this ***** needs to stop. now.

seriously, dude. this ***** needs to stop. now.

eat me, I'm a danish

it's so hard to tell what people really mean on this internerd.

lobo-

Do you break every component you get your hands on? Jesus.

lobo-

Do you break every component you get your hands on? Jesus.

When you are almost 300lbs, yeah, pretty much.

I'm beginning to wonder if I should wait until I hit the 225 mark to start bicycling again.

How did the hub fail?

Stripped when I guess I torqued it a little hard. 46x16 with someone who weighs as much as two adults probably has that effect.

I think I am going to give up on cycling and start using dumb bells until I can get my weight down so that I stop breaking bikes.

So who makes the bulletproof hubs out there?

I'm a NOOB to all this track bike stuff, but I want something tough enough for Velodrome use?

BTW, I just saw that Velocity Track Wheelset with the high flange hubs and Deep V...looks cool. Wonder if they are any good in the rear hub department?

The Suzue basic is just that BASIC! Get the NJS models if you plan to ride hard on them . I have 2 set and have seen other guys happy also.

S/F,
CEYA!

seriously, dude. this ***** needs to stop. now.

Yeah it does need to stop! We keep posting for guys to stay away and they don't. We need to put dunce caps for those who buy then complain about them.

S/F<
CEYA!

We'll see how long mine lasts. 320 pounds, 42x16 gearing single speed not fixed. Been riding the bike less than a week.

I don't understand this. What are you guys doing to the cheap Suzue hubs? I have a set with 2000 miles on them with no trouble. I even built up some for sale on Ebay but I believe the Suzue curse is keeping people away.

I even built up some for sale on Ebay but I believe the Suzue curse is keeping people away.
Or it could be the $35 shipping charge for a set of wheels.

Suzue Pro Max Deluxe Sealed and Suzue Pro NJS = Good ones
Suzue standard = BAD!!

S/F,

CEYA!

Wait until you see the box, I don't scam on my shipping pricing, Once USPS gets their cut i have about seven bucks to cover my time and packaging. MY stuff shows up in one piece, in perfect condition, exactly as described. Hell, the opening bid is what the parts cost me wholesale. Just the front wheel would be $170 from someone like Genuine George.

Perhaps the cog was torqued down too much with a chainwhip and was half stripped to begin with.
Maybe you big guys should try running smaller cogs with smaller chainrings. Bigger cogs put more torque on the threads too. http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=85850

Chuck-
While I don't doubt your shipping costs, time, packaging, etc. There are others on ebay who have MUCH cheaper shipping costs for a set of wheels.
For example, nyc bikes, user name: nycbikes only costs $13.40 to ship priority to me in boston. I guess nyc-boston is a lot shorter and cheaper than NC to boston, but...
Also, bensbike, ebay user name: bensbike, ships their wheels for $25, and they're in milwauke.
Both of these ebay sellers sell fixed wheelsets: i.e competing products, so I think that when your shipping costs are factored in, there are other alternatives which may be more attractive in the end.
Not criticising, but observing.

-Who's genuine george?

Seriously, the quality of my work is better. I do want to know about this stuff. I am trying to figure out how to do more build work and actually make a profit. My opening bids on the two sets I had up were what I had in the wheels. I knew the rep of the Suzue hubs but I have put several on the road for me and several customers with no problems. I really think it has some to do with how the cog and lock ring are installed. I can make some badass wheels but the cost has to be absorbed somewhere. I noticed NYC always has stuff up but the hubs are unbranded (Altho I think I know who makes them, I will have to look into that) and they use straight guage spokes which drops the price a bit compared to mine which are bouble butted. i don't know how they ship Priority so cheap, unless their boxes weigh 2-3 pounds less than mine. Those wheels are sure not any lighter, probably a half pound heavier at the least.

NYC bikes / Iro Cycles / Bensbike all use the same hubs, just rebadged. They are made by formula.
FYI- The formula hubs are of FAR better quality than the suzue basic hubs, on par to surly hubs. The forumla hubs all use sealed cartridge bearings, and higher quality threads.
I'm not doubting your wheelbuilding abilities, I have heard a few negative things about the wheel build quality of NYC bike's wheels and Ben's bike's wheels.

I would have used Surly but they are hard to come by. Seems like they are never in stock, same story with Spot. I tried for three months to get some of their hubs (As a dealer looking to sell their product) with no luck. Formula it may be. I thought I had some of the Suzue cartridge hubs lined up but they are hard to come by as well. Everything else is like my other, no cheap hub, no freight post, the hubs are very exspensive, my cost on a Campy Record rear hub is $144. I can just about build a pair of cheap wheels for that.

Uh, you know you're talking to the Rev, right? :)
I think most of NYC Bikes wheels use Sovos/Quando hubs which are a step down from Suzue basics. Anyway, I agree with the Rev, I think most problems arise because of how the cog and lockring were installed. A 300lb person is going to put a lot more torque into a chainwhip than a 150lb person, but a 300lb person pushing 80 gear inches at 20mph is putting the same torque (more or less) than a 150lb person doing the same. Additionally, Rev. replaced the stock bearings with higher quality ones. That and adjusting the cones properly make a huge difference in the hubs' life.

EDIT: nycbikes' cheaper wheels were Sovos/Quando. They do have a bunch or newer, higher quality wheels now.

I checked I can easily build and sell, with some margin, a wheelset(thats a pair) with Suzue hubs, straight Dt spokes and Alex Dm18 eyeletted rims for $140. About what wholesale for the Campy hub is. i just need to research the shipping thing. I can't figure how these guys do it so cheap unless they put part of the shipping cost inot the wheel cost, which means they skimp somewhere on the wheel. I have a Phil spoke cutter and could reduce costs some by buying blanks and cutting them to length myself, hmmm.

I always thought the Bensbike's wheels where machine built...

I always thought the Bensbike's wheels where machine built...
Are wheel building machines expensive? I don't see how it would be economical for bensbike to use one, unless they were really cheap....

I checked I can easily build and sell, with some margin, a wheelset(thats a pair) with Suzue hubs, straight Dt spokes and Alex Dm18 eyeletted rims for $140. About what wholesale for the Campy hub is. i just need to research the shipping thing. I can't figure how these guys do it so cheap unless they put part of the shipping cost inot the wheel cost, which means they skimp somewhere on the wheel. I have a Phil spoke cutter and could reduce costs some by buying blanks and cutting them to length myself, hmmm.
Chuck- another thing about the shipping.
Priority mail shipping costs are based on weight and distance. The nyc bikes wheel set shipping cost from NYC to boston was about $14.
I plugged in a CA zip code(90210), and the shipping costs went up to $24. The shipping costs DEFINITLEY depends on where you are in the country.

Are wheel building machines expensive? I don't see how it would be economical for bensbike to use one, unless they were really cheap....

Machine built at a big giant factory in the Far East I'd imagine.

That is true, we(my wife does all the grunt work) just figure the max cost and list it becuase it is easier and most of the stuff we ship is small and goes flat rate anyway. We are going to have to change that I see.

"Are wheel building machines expensive? I don't see how it would be economical for bensbike to use one, unless they were really cheap...."
The machine is pretty exspensive, but there are several places that have their wheels machine laced and rough tensioned, by another vendor, which is about all most wheel machines do and then they are finished by hand. The quality is lower and some thing a wheel machine won't do. I have seen quite a few wheels done this way that were not even brought up to full tension. I presume this is because the wheel was pretty straight and these guys often do no stress relieving or radial truing. This is based on comparison to the many thousands of machine built wheels I have had to clean up coming from our bike dealers and wholesalers. Man, nobody wants my $700 Campy wheels :0

Machine built at a big giant factory in the Far East I'd imagine.
Nope, bensbike wheel's are "professionally handbuilt"
here is the text of one of their ebay listings:

"A great set of wheels for your fixed-gear or track bike.**Professionally Hand-Built!* 32-hole*High-Flange Hubs are*laced 3-cross to*Alex DV15*700c clincher rims.**Formula hubs have real smoooth sealed-cartridge bearings, large flanges with cut-outs, and real track nuts to keep them secure.* Rear hub is flip/flop and is threaded Fix/Free - meaning you can put a fixed cog (and lockring)* on one side and a Freewheel on the other. Rims are*Black*with machined sidewalls*and are made from 6061-T6 alloy.* Rear is spaced at 120mm / front is 100mm. "

EDIT: Even their lowest cost wheels (suzue basic/velocity aerohead) are handbuilt. $150 BIN, $25 shipping.

This is not to say that some of those that claim handbuilt are fibbing some*, but often wheels touted as handbuilt are handfinished. Quality, I believe, does their wheels this way. Machine roughed, hand finished. But production line work is not the same as hand work.

* Heck, that is my claim, I need an inset shot of me in my shop slaving away :)

When you are almost 300lbs, yeah, pretty much.

I'm beginning to wonder if I should wait until I hit the 225 mark to start bicycling again.

Yikes. Track components are built for a max load of 150lbs. The columbus tubing on my Moser says 150lbs max. That is a road race frame.
Next you will coplain that mavic krysium wheelsets are crap.

This is not to say that some of those that claim handbuilt are fibbing some*, but often wheels touted as handbuilt are handfinished. Quality, I believe, does their wheels this way. Machine roughed, hand finished. But production line work is not the same as hand work.

* Heck, that is my claim, I need an inset shot of me in my shop slaving away :)

Skeptic. :D If you are sekptical of bensbike wheels, then many others can be skeptical of your wheels, as you both make the same 'handbuilt' claims! :D

... Man, nobody wants my $700 Campy wheels :0
i don't think it's so much that nobody wants them as it is that none of us can afford them ;) , at least i know i cant...

Exactly true, which is why I try hard not to talk **** about other peoples work.

Thanks for the tip. Good to know.

"i don't think it's so much that nobody wants them as it is that none of us can afford them , at least i know i cant..."
I need to find that comprimise between price and quality. It is much easier when someone comes up and wants X to be built. Even educated guessing can be tough on the wallet. Oh well if no one picks up the wheels I have up now I will build up a road single for my wife. Already have a tcr frame and profile fork, just need bars, cranks and a singulator.

Stripped when I guess I torqued it a little hard. 46x16 with someone who weighs as much as two adults probably has that effect.

Not to take the thread too far off topic, but you stripped a cog off the hub body? Did the cog come off while you were riding? I have basics and have to rebuild them every couple of months, but ripping a properly seated cog through the threads seems a little unusual to me. I've pretty much given up hope of getting my cog off this hub, but I can't imagine it stripping, 300 lbs or no...

Exactly true, which is why I try hard not to talk **** about other peoples work.
By my count, you have bagged on quality bike parts' wheels, NYC bikes' wheels and also ben's bikes' wheels.

Not to take the thread too far off topic.....
You mean ON topic! ;)

Oh no, no, no. Didn't say anything about Bens. I said NYbikes uses an unbranded hub(They don't mention brand and it has no visible label) and straight guage spokes (They do) I said Quality used a wheel lacing machine, they did, There is a picture of it in the 2003 catalog And I said lots of larger suppliers use a wheel lacer or have wheels laced and then hand finish them.
I Did say I do better work( I do better work than most.)

It is topic evolution. Like a fish on a bike.

You mean ON topic! ;)

Not enough iron in my irony, evidently ;)

Back to the topic about the Suzue hub :rolleyes:



S/F,
CEYA!

What method do you all use to overhaul a suzue?

I repacked a friends rear wheel yesterday and i relized it was missing a bearring on the track specific side of the hub (she rides ss). After i smothered it in grease the wheel was still pretty gritty feelling. Where can i get a replacement bearing?

After i replace the bearing, what else is done to tune it up properly?

adjusting the cones properly, is the most missed peice of the puzzle.

S/F,
CEYA!

adjusting the cones properly, is the most missed peice of the puzzle.

S/F,
CEYA!
Yeah, after doing a search, i think that was my problem.

When you pull the hub apart, clean off the cone and race and look close for any pitting. If the cone is pitted you can replace it. If the race is pitted you are out of luck but you can still stick it back togethr set it up just a little loose and keep on riding it. You can loose ball bearings from a bike shop and probably places like Granger, Granger would want to sell you 500 tho.

You can go into Ben's Cycles (bensbike) just about anyday and you'll see at least one person lacing up wheels. All their wheels listed as hand-built are that - HAND BUILT - No machines involved at all.

I've got a question: what's the difference between the low-flange SIW hubs that NYC BIkes sell and the more ubiquitous high-flange Suzue Basic/Jr? I've been riding an SIW hard for 6 or 7 months now and it has held up great. It's been out in the salt, slush and crud of our harsh maritime winter everyday for the past few months and no signs of disaster. This hub is cheaper than the Suzue Basic... any ideas?

Also, am I correct that SIW = Suzue Industrial Works?

m.

The SIW hub has a steel body vs and aluminum hub with the Basics.

back to the origional post, what we need is some 300 lb guys testing level hubs. no threads to strip. Maybe the company needs a couple of big testers, maybe they'd give you a good deal.

As for high quality wheels sold on ebay, anyone who is gonna pay $500 plus for a set of wheels is going to do so locally for practical purposes, ie included adjustments, warrantee work. No offense rev, but there's guys in every town who, when paid to do so, do all the things that make your wheels so special and they build just as nice a wheel.
Open markets generally do not favor quality, you're competing with the wrong sort of people when you compete on ebay. I'm not saying they're dishonest or that they are all low quality builds but everyone shopping for stock wheels on ebay is doing so for one reason - to get the cheapest possible price on the hub/rim combo they want. Your fine handbuilding, that you deservedly want to be compensated for, is unimportant to them and they will not pay for it. You can build wheels for this market but you can't make money at it unless you can possibly (through volume pricing) bring down your materials cost.