Modify a Cannondale Los Dos for road or buy a new tandem?
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Artmo
We have a Cannondale Los Dos which we bought new about 8 yr ago, but have not used much (<500miles), although it's a great bike and is ex condition, but in mountain config. Now my wife and I want to ride with the crowd at 16-20mph ( I have been doing this regularly on my Trek 2300), but the tandem seems a bit heavy for road use (it could be that we are old). Would it be preferable to change tires to slicks ( we have road tires at the moment) and convert to drop handlebars, live with it as is or should we simply sell it and buy, say a RT1000 or Trek T 1000 or similar? We don't want to pay more than $2500. Our combined weight is ~340lbs and we are in our 60s, but fit!!
If the recommendation is to buy a new tandem, which should it be and why?
And another question: where is it possible in S Central FL to try tandems before you buy? Around Sarasota, it seems I have to buy before I try!!
I've only just joined the forum and have already found a huge amount of useful info. Thank you.
The BikeForums Team
-adv-
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I would bet that with narrow, slick 26" high-presure tires, you tandem is just about as fast and not much heavier than a new Cannondale road tandem.
You could put a drop bar on the front and give it a try before buying a new bike.
Mhendricks
I would bet that with narrow, slick 26" high-presure tires, you tandem is just about as fast and not much heavier than a new Cannondale road tandem.
You could put a drop bar on the front and give it a try before buying a new bike.
Don't know much about the drop bar but I can say that with a change of tires, it will go faster. We just traded our old Raleigh Coupe for a 2004 and the first thing I did is take off the stock tires and put on some Avocet FasGrip City 1.5" slicks (50-85 psi). We noticed a less rolling resistance and good cornering along with an increase in speed. Hope this helps.
Brian
Go with some good high pressure slicks or even semi slicks. Ritchey makes a Tom Slick in 1.4". You'll probably find that your flat bars are more comfy than drops, no need to switch bars. Spend the savings on some new clothing and get something nice for the missus.
Artmo
Another expat, eh. I'm from the UK. Any road up, I already have IRC 1.25 Smoothies on the bike. They are semi slicks, and came with the bike, so I'm wondering if slicks would make a lot of difference. Could be, I have to admit I'm not up to riding with the younger ones on the tandem. I used to have an old Holdsworth USWB, but gave it away because of a small crack in the frame (I did tell the recipient). Maybe I shld have kept it, 'cos that thing would move, but it wasn't very comfortable for any distance. But then I was younger...alas!
As for the bars, I appreciate that they won't make a lot of diff to speed, but I prefer drops. However, it could be expensive to change, but not as expensive as a new tandem. Tks for your input.
Brian
Two of our bikes have 2" wide tires with the fine diamond pattern tread, and plenty fast for us on the road. Drops wouldn't be too much of a big deal to change on a bike that old. Probably easiest to go with bar end shifters and some Travel Agents for the brakes. You'd lose your index shifting, but don't know how important that is to you. Switching to STI would not be cheap at all, better to get a few hundred for your bike and look for a used road bike. My opinion anyway.
SDS
The only thing I would consider would be the gearing: the MTB road tires end up with about 7.5% less circumference than 700C road tires, so it is a relative 7.5% reduction in gearing. The thing to do is to ask a few other tandem teams around if they can get by with 53 X 12T, in which case you will probably be able to get by with 53 X11T and the smaller tires.
There's usually somebody who reads this and says something like, "Yes, but you could use larger chainrings and make up the difference...." I wish to point out that FD capacity is expressed in teeth, and as the rings get larger, the range gets narrower, if capacity in teeth is fixed. This doesn't matter for racer-types on flat ground, of course. Or if there are no hills around at all. Then you can just plug in three larger rings and never miss the small ring you do not have anymore.
Incidentally, with Shimano road triple FDs, which have a nominal capacity of 22T, I am willing to go to 25T (53-39-28), but usually no farther than that. I recall reading a report online of a team that was using 29T, but if I ate bread (not often), I think mine would land jelly-side-down from time to time, so I would not be able to use a 29T difference with my FD either.
Because we are spending your money, I think you should end up with two tandems. First upgrade the one you have to something like STI 9-speed triple, and drop bars both ends, and with more miles on a tandem you will know if the investment of a new tandem is worthwhile, and you will likely have some preferences that you will want to be sure you satisfy. If, for example, you find that your stoker desires more room than can be found on the back of a production tandem, and you are doing it a lot, you will know to get a custom with a longer stoker compartment, without first having sunk the purchase price of a new tandem to obtain that piece of information. A weight of 340, but fit, suggests the two of you are quite tall, and therefore this is an important consideration.
You have some idea of the speed of the people with whom you want to ride, and the stories about tandems and speed variation are true: with two men
on a tandem they are very fast everywhere, but with a mixed team they will usually be slower going uphill, and slightly faster going downhill. This means that there is a requirement for slightly wider gearing than will be found on a single bike, often accommodated with 700C wheels by the same cassette (the tandem really gets to use the small cogs, instead of just talk about them....) and a triple crankset instead of a double. With the smaller wheel circumference, higher gearing is likely to be required.
I think the smaller wheels have a slight aerodynamic edge over identical 700C wheels, and that altogether you could build up a light and fast tandem with drop bars, etc. Depending on how fast you want to go, and the incidence of hills in the area, and your sizes, you might never need anything else, save the slightly larger chainrings.
Some stokers can get by with an upright position in back, but most prefer their single bike position, plus some amount of space between them and the captain. The arguments about stoker fit center around whether or not they should get single bike fit or upright, and what the proper spacing between the riders should be, and how to measure that. For example, do cowhorn bars make the back of tandems longer or not? Some of us have ideas about that, but it could be that we could save that for the time when new tandem purchase(s) are being considered.
TandemGeek
Would it be preferable to change tires to slicks and convert to drop handlebars, live with it as is or should we simply sell it and buy, say a RT1000 or Trek T 1000 or similar? We don't want to pay more than $2500. Our combined weight is ~340lbs and we are in our 60s, but fit!!
If you haven't been riding and aren't sure you will be able to amortize the investment in a new tandem, I'd say ride what you have for a while. As for upgrading the tires, if what you're calling Smoothies have any kind of tread that creates road noise then yes, high-pressure slicks or a tire with a herringbone tread ($50) would "probably" have less rolling resistance. As for the bars, unless you're actually going to ride in the drops I'd strongly consider adding some bar ends (http://www.jensonusa.com/store/imgWrapper.aspx?img=/be/BE602A02.jpg&type=3) ($18/pr) to give you some optional hand positions and a more forward leaning posture vs the expense of drop-bars, new shifters, brake levers, etc...
Bottom Line: If you give it a go "as is" or with just some inexpensive mods ($90) and find that you're spending a lot of time out riding the bike, then a newer road-specific bike would certainly be the way to go.
If the recommendation is to buy a new tandem, which should it be and why?
It should be the one that you can test ride before buying and/or that excites you enough to take a leap of faith on IF you can be sure it's the right size. $2,500 will snag quite a few nice 2nd hand tandems that were originally sold new as $3,500 tandems in the late 90's and early 00's.
And another question: where is it possible in S Central FL to try tandems before you buy? Around Sarasota, it seems I have to buy before I try!!
It's really hit or miss with most Trek & C'Dale dealers (mostly miss) as they don't usually stock tandems.
Your best bet would probably be Chainwheel Drive up in Clearwater (Santana & Co-Motion): http://chainwheeldrive.com/site/intro.cfm
I believe Suncoast Bicycles up in Inverness is a Co-Motion dealer: http://www.suncoastbicycles.com/
If you punch in your zip code and select "100 miles" at this URL you'll find quite a few Burley dealers:
http://www.burley.com/dealers/default.aspx
Just call and ask what they have in stock at the various stores and then plot out a day or weekend-long adventure visiting the various shops that have tandems in your size for some test riding. Call it your "Tour de Tandem '05".
Artmo
SDS - I really appreciate your detailed response. I don't think gearing is the ansr as I don't think we could push 53X11 even on the flat! It seems to me that as suggested, we stick with it for a time and see how it goes. I had already added bar ends some time back, plus a riser for the bars + more comfortable saddles - so comfortable in fact that my wife doesn't have to stand up to stretch even on a 20 mile ride!
The tires (26X1.25; 95psi) are almost slick and have a herring-bone pattern, so going to slicks will probably not make a big difference.
Thanks for spending my money :)
Artmo
Tandemgeek - many thanks for your advice; you have probably saved me a lot of money, at least in the short-term! See my response to SDS for some other points you mentioned.
I'm new to this forum, but I note you are in Atlanta. We have a son in ATL so visit quite frequently. Do you have bike store?
TandemGeek
Tandemgeek - many thanks for your advice; Do you have bike store?
You're most welcome and, No; no shop. I'm just an over-enthusiastic tandem enthusiast who likes to see couples and families having a great time riding tandems.
If you need for info on tandems & tandeming you'll find links to most of what's on the Web here:
http://www.TheTandemLink.com
Artmo
Well, I finally got around to changing the tires; I fitted Richey Tom Slick 26x1" 100psi and it's made a dramatic difference to rolling resistance and thus speed. No need to change tandems!! Thanks again to all for your input.
rlong
Go with some good high pressure slicks or even semi slicks. Ritchey makes a Tom Slick in 1.4". You'll probably find that your flat bars are more comfy than drops, no need to switch bars. Spend the savings on some new clothing and get something nice for the missus.
I'm picking up a set of 1" Tom Slicks (max psi 100) tomorrow for my 26" Burley. They made a huge difference on my touring bike. Performance Bike has them for $16.50.