pressed001

Ha!

Maybe he was just a dyslexic genius that can't tie his own shoes either but can easily postulate the unified theory of gravity?

I sympathize with him. I was also once young and dumb. Now I'm just getting old and dumb-er.

corrado33

Apologies, I don't actually think the way you were responding to. I think that's the way young kids think. I surely don't think that way! I love fixing my own stuff and knowing how to take care of it.

mack_turtle

as a 33 year-old bike mechanic, I think age has nothing to do with the mechanical incompetence of my customers. perhaps older people are more confident in fixing their own problems. while I respect this confidence, their younger counterparts are more likely to access the correct information and do it right, or leave it to an expert. confidence plus ignorance equals failure. for example, I perceive that the most harebrained kludges are cooked up by older customers, like putting Cricso on a disc brake rotor because it was squeaking (some old redneck actually did that!)

I should try to keep track of the ages of flat tire fix customers that I get. where I live is a very youth-oriented city and I am near a college campus, so my observations will be skewed.

on the other hand, I was once in a computer lab (room full of PCs) to sign up for a electrician training program when an older electrician came in. he had probably been an electrician for decades and knew a LOT about wiring. He wanted to sign up for a class to learn some new skill (probably NEC Code or solar panels) and had a piece of paper with a website URL written on it. he sat in front of the computer for a few minutes giggling the mouse around, looking around the computer hardware. then asked me where the "browser" is, that someone told him to "put this in the browser." I think he wanted to put that hand-written note in a port on the computer somewhere! I showed him how to open Firefox or Chrome or whatever the computer had on it and typed in the URL, which had been misspelled, then figured out what the missing letter was and got him to the right page.

There was a login page and I told him he needs to set up an account. he asked me if that was like a bank account and I told him no, just type your email address and make a password. he looked at me incredulously and said, "you mean I have to buy an email account first? I don't have one of those!" then just left.

Old people, they can't learn anything! this guy was just as bad as the OP's story about the kid who could not figure out how to put his chain back on. age has nothing, or very little, to do with it.

habilis

Indeed, education has become quite specialized, even in the lower grades, and is aimed toward commercial success. However, the aim is remarkably inaccurate. For example, grammar schools are offering Mandarin Chinese - rote phrases transcribed into our alpahabet, not the Chinese alphabet, which is supremely difficult to learn. Do we think our kids will go to China and out-negotiate the Chinese in business deals? Do we think the Chinese negotiators don't already know excellent English? It is an incredibly naive educational goal, probably pushed by misinformed parents.

This kind of subject matter has displaced technical training in the main-stream public school curriculum. However, every kid will encounter mechanical problems in life unless they were born wealthy.

mack_turtle

interesting question: should the bicycle industry
A) make bicycles that are simpler so that people will not be intimidated and ride more
B) educate people who mostly don't have any desire to be educated
C) continue to push many people away from cycling and let bike shops handle the heavy lifting

three things that I see the average person has no interest in learning to fix that keeps many people away from cycling:
1. tires. getting a flat tire ten miles from home really sours a person against cycling. too many bikes come with cheap tires that flat easily and changing a flat is more hassle than most people want.
2. derailleurs. single speed bikes are popular partially for this reason, but most people don't want to ride distances or hills without gears. IGH are heavy and expensive and lack range. derailleurs drop chains, get bent and twisted, and require a great deal of skill and knowledge to replace and tune them.
3. quick release levers. for the love of God, these are not that difficult! but people use them wrong all the time, resulting in crooked wheels that rub on brakes and don't shift right. how about we go back to the wing nuts? most people think a QR lever is a wing nut already.

hig4s

Certainly not A,, I never want to go back to riding the type of bike that was available back in the 70s.

mack_turtle

regarding "making bicycles simpler," I mean making simpler bikes for the average, non-cyclist types simpler. there are a lot of "simple" bikes on the market now, but too many people are buying overly-complicated junk from department stores, rather and a quality "simple" bike from a bike shop.

hig4s

In that case the only real answer is B

habilis

The trend in department store bikes is to make them as visually "trick" as possible. The result is kids' mountain bikes with front and rear suspension, 21 speeds with brifters, and QR everything. Yet, even with aluminum frames, wheel rims, stems, etc., the bike manages to weigh 30+ pounds. Now that's an engineering feat! I found such a bike out in the trash, in almost-new condition. The owner evidently gave up trying to pedal this truck around the neighborhood and making the "sophisticated" components work properly. Simple is best, especially where the young and inexperienced are concerned.

InGrained

I am 22 and almost never touched a bike when I was younger. I learned how to change a flat, and tune/replace brakes(including calipers) through youtube videos. I regret not learning this simple stuff when I was younger with my dad. Every mechanical act no matter how simple is daunting at first. The machine is intimidating because its workings are mostly still foreign to me. I have gotten my hands on a vintage road bike and it needs lots of mechanical work done. Simple stuff I'm sure but a lot of it I've never done so I feel very intimidated . That being said I've had to deal with chains coming off gears a few times.

InGrained

Todays youth is not being taught enough with tools or mechanics. I don't think we need simpler. We need more exposure to it and to be shown how to deal with the problems ourselves.

habilis

You are going about self-education in exactly the right way: Refurbish an older bike and use the resources available on the internet. There are many great instructional videos to compare and choose from.

corrado33

Is shop class still a thing? In my middle school (8th grade perhaps?) everyone was forced to take Home Economics and Shop Class, regardless of gender. I already knew how to work with wood, but that's where I learned to sew and "cook."

InGrained

No. Tools are disappearing from schools. I never hear of anything like shop class anymore.

Rich Gibson 

Don't be misled. Being familiar with jargon and knowing how to operate 'apps' is not being technologically advanced. So many are helpless when they are disconnected from their 'smart' phones. Already educators are noticing a loss of writing skills and lack of ability to concentrate in students. Watch television carefully and you will see constant stimulation, extremely brief cutting and frenetic music overlaying everything. Contemplation, concentration, 'lost in thought' are forgotten terms. Multitasking is the hot term among millenials: doing more than one thing poorly. Here in northern Virginia cursive handwriting is no longer taught. The pendulum will swing back in time.

Rich

Marcus_Ti

Now now. 95% of adults and kids do not tie their shoes properly. Especially the ones that claim to "know".

Almost everyone ties "granny knots" and not proper shoelace knots, hell both my parents taught me wrong too...which is why everyone resorts to kludges likes "double" knotting to keep their shoes tied-because the base knot is tied wrong. Then I became enlightened due to being a stage hand...

Ian's Shoelace Site - The "Granny Knot"


Once you know what to look for, you can spot improper shoelace knots 20ft away.

SquidPuppet

Dad type "A" (High income executive): Son, home repairs/maintenance, auto repairs/maintenance, plumbing and electrical repairs, and landscape maintenance are all very expensive. It costs a lot of money to pay someone to do these things. So, I am going to teach you how to make a lot of money.

Dad type "B" (lower/middle class): Son, home repairs/maintenance, auto repairs/maintenance, plumbing and electrical repairs, and landscape maintenance are all very expensive. It costs a lot of money to pay someone to do these things. So, I am going to teach you how to do those things for yourself.

My Dad was "B", and I am grateful for that almost everyday of my life.

corrado33

It's surprising how much more effective the correct knot is at keeping your shoes tied than the granny knot. Here's the gist, if your "bunny ears" point up and down instead of side to side on your shoe (parallel to the length of the shoe instead of perpendicular), you're tying your shoes wrong. Easy fix? Instead of doing left over right or right over left (whatever you do) on the initial overhand knot, do the opposite. Then you'll tie a correct knot.

Reynolds 

A variation of this is someone actually trying to do something, but not having the slightest idea about materials limits. The other day I saw 2 20ish year old guys attempting to tow a car with a cable attached to the plastic bumpers. Also remember someone asking if you can use flash to take a photo of the moon (true story).

rydabent

Just a small point. Someone alluded to the fact that most of the tech stuff that young people use today was invented by us "old geezers". And what is more amazing is the fact that they used slide rules. No batteries required. My 3 sons that are tech savvy and work on their own cars find slide rules amazing. I keep a small one in the car to figure gas mileage.

Rich Gibson 

It's so pervasive its depressing. Watch a night sporting or entertainment event at a stadium and see how many people use their flashes on their precious 'smart'phones. Doh!

Rich

Gresp15C

They don't know how to turn off the flash.

Gresp15C

@mack_turtle, regarding your post, I'd add one more thing:

4. Brakes. I was coming home last night, and was at a stoplight alongside a couple of people on bikes. I noticed that both of the bikes had the brake levers all the way down to the handlebars, i.e., way out of adjustment and barely working.

Rich Gibson 

Worse I suspect. They think it will illuminate the stadium.

Rich

cny-bikeman

That's getting a bit picky - most phones default flash setting is Auto, so it will go off in any low light condition. Few people bother to turn it off just because it won't have an effect, as there's no harm done.