duke01

Hi

My Merckx Strada is getting a new fork (see why on an old thread on this forum); I have chosen a MX Leader fork because that's the first one I've found. I turns out to be an acclaimed design among steel riders: an innovative fork, larger in diameter which would give incredible sensations bla bla. Ok, good for me! Now I have noticed 2 things:


- the fork is chromed under the paint. Can I strip the paint off and leave it like that, unprotected? (It's not a nice paint job at all, a chromed fork is cool while unmatching frame and forks are not...)

- By having both forks running parallel to each other, side to side, I see that my wheel will be 1/2 inch further away from the BB. "more stable and less nervous" Is it gonna make that much difference? Anyone has experience with that?

Enclosed pictures of the things

Thanks for your comments

dsbrantjr

I am surprised that they painted over chrome (and expected it to stick). The chrome plating should protect the steel just as well as, or better than, paint. Try the stripper on an inconspicuous spot to be certain that it will not discolor the plating.

fietsbob

Typically the parts getting painted are not polished , left sandblasted when getting Chromed .
only the parts to be featured is the base Metal Polished..

All other things remaining constant, More fork offset Reduces the Trail..

Andrew R Stewart 

A few points- Don't expect that the chrome under the paint was buffed to the degree that the exposed chrome is. Chrome plate is dull out of the bath. needs polishing to shine. Paint needs dull to bite on to. If all else (axle to crown seat) is the same than a fork with more forward curve (called rake) will have less trail. This is usually considered to result in a handling being less stable and more dependent on the rider steering through the entire turn. But these terms and any one rider's preferences are all over the board... Are you sure that the ft brake fit and work w/o changes? How about the fork crown race fit diameter? Andy.

well biked

Actually it was fairly common for some brands to fully (or partially) chrome a frameset and then paint over it, back in the day.....there were both advantages and disadvantages.

duke01

I should then polish the chrome? aluminium foil + water? (trick found here: Cleaning Chrome - Roberts Cycle)

What is the trail? The experienced LBS down the street said front wheel further from the BB, more stability... Is 1/2 a lot?

Andrew R Stewart 

Trail is the dimension from the steerer axis's virtual point of contact with the ground and the tire's actual contact point. On most all bikes the tire contact sits a bit behind the steering axis's contact. This "trailing" produces a tiller effect so that the tire tends to follow the steerer axis. Or induces some self stability. Think of the shopping cart ft wheels and how the trail behing their steering pivot. Rake is the ft axle's distance from the steer axis. As rake increases the tire contact point moves forward getting closer to the steerer/ground point.

1/2" is a lot when it is taken from the trail or added to the rake. Since trail is typically around 1 1/4" to 2 1/4" a 1/2" is a large proportion of the trail, or rake for that matter. Here is a link to a trail calculator. Bicycle Trail Calculator | yojimg.net

Your shop has things wrong. I hope their mechanical and business savvy are better then their understanding of basic frame design and steering geometry. Andy.

HillRider

Trail is the distance from where the front tire touches the ground to where a line drawn through the steerer tube would intersect the ground. It's equivalent to "caster" in an automobile suspension and effects the self-centering of the steering. More trail gives greater straight line stability and more resistance to turning. Increased fork rake reduces trail and gives less straight line stability and more "eager" turning.

Your LBS meant the increase in wheelbase would give more stability but wasn't addressing the trail difference.

Grand Bois

It's not possible to polish chrome. You can only clean it.

tarwheel 

The only way to know for sure how your bike will handle with the MXL fork is to install it and see how it rides. Lots of older steel frames were fully chromed under the paint. If I were you, I would install the fork first and see how it handles. If handling is OK, remove the fork, strip the paint, and see how the chrome looks. If the chrome is too rough, repaint it black or another color that matches your frame.

BTW, MXL forks are highly sought and desireable. There is one for sale on eBay right now that the seller is asking $888 for! That price is ridiculous and I doubt if it would ever sell at that price, but it's an indication of how desirable they are. I've seen another MXL frame for sale lately for a very reasonable price that nobody has bought because it's missing the original fork.

AnkleWork

When you asked those who acclaimed the fork, what did they say?

Kopsis

Of course you can polish chrome -- how do you think it gets that mirror-like finish in the first place? It doesn't come out of the plating bath looking like that. Now, chromium is pretty hard for a metal, so you need the right abrasives (and power tools unless you're looking to kill a lot of hours). And if you don't know what you're doing, you run the risk of polishing right through it. But there's a big difference between "needs the right tools and skill" and "not possible".

fietsbob

NB: Most of the work of polishing is done to the Base Metal, steel, Before the chrome, Plating.. is applied

It,, as a Plating, can be removed electrolytically and then you can polish the entire fork ,
then get the Chrome plating Re Applied ..

Andrew R Stewart 

I learned a long time ago that good chrome work is not a plug and play result. The plater needs to be motivated as well as know their stuff. I've seen chrome that flakes off and has no "depth" from plating shops that show off their wonderfully done Colt 45s and Harley engine fin work in their lobby. Good prep is a must but good process is also a must, just a lot harder to anticipate whether the plater will do their part of the job with best practices. There are frame builders who cherish their platers and hold heir names close to their chest. Andy.

duke01

That's a good point, but I have read those comments. Besides that, they were commenting on a fork + its original MXL frame while I am assembling heterogeneous parts.

duke01

Thanks everyone for your help.
I have learned what the trail is; good thing to know when you choose / compare frames or when you want to understand frame geometry.
Now I will just rely on empirism to test the fork. The best way is indeed to install and ride it

Tarwheel, I try not to be influenced by components prices when choosing parts... By the way, EM frames are not really expensive here in their home land..!

duke01

So basically, in order to work on this chromed fork, I would need either to get many tools, which I won't, or to be highly skilled...
Wouldn't that aluminium trick clean it?
By the way, could I just ride the fork as is, i.e. paint stripped off, without a shiny look? Isn't a dull chrome more protecting against rust than naked steel?

Kopsis

The aluminum trick is typically used for removing rust from chrome. The chrome itself obviously doesn't rust, but microscopic scratches, pits, and pores will allow water and oxygen to get to the underlying steel. The resulting surface rust expands through the pits in the chrome producing that characteristic spotty rusted chrome appearance. Aluminum foil is harder than iron oxide but softer than chromium, so it will abrade the rust without scratching up the chrome.

You can certainly ride the fork as is. The dull chrome will provide some corrosion protection. I recommended that you seal the surface for additional protection (especially if you've had to remove rust pitting). This is usually done with some form of wax. The chrome polishes you'll find in an auto parts store are really just cleaner/wax compounds, but any automotive grade wax will do. You'll want to reapply periodically depending on how much time the bike spends in the elements.

dbg

Ideally you can get stats on the offset (rake) value of each fork (along with other geometry values) and plug them into that trail calculator link mentioned earlier. Also note that calculator assumes your two forks will exactly match on the distance from lower crown race to wheel dropouts. If it's longer or shorter, it will pitch the front up or down slightly and change things. Probably not noticeably but maybe. If you're used to a trail of, say 57mm, and the new fork drops it below 45mm --you will likely notice the difference. And what may seem "better" at lower speeds might get "quirky or jittery" doing a corner at a higher speed. Also your ability to "no hand" might get affected. Another place I think I've noticed a difference is riding loose gravel. High trail tends to plow and resist turning a bit more than low trial. Also loaded front ends (front panniers, etc) seem a little easier to ride with lower trail. --just mentioning some of the "issues" with varying the front "trail".

Grand Bois

You don't know what you're talking about.

andr0id

It gets the mirror like finish because they polish the metal underneath before they chrome it.
Then all it takes is a light buffing to polish up the chrome.
If the metal underneath is not polished, the chrome finish will stay dull no matter how much you polish it.

Kopsis

A "light buffing" is polishing.

True if the smoothness of the underlying surface is less than the depth of the plating (since you'd burn through the plating in the high spots before you got them even with the low). But this is speaking to the efficacy of polishing. I was taking issue with the statement that polishing chrome is not possible. Polishing most certainly is possible (eg. Chrome Rouge Buffing Wheel Bar Compounds) and is often employed after electroplating to remove imperfections and increase luster. It's also used in professional restoration work where aggressive cleaning techniques prove insufficient.