zhead

Seems to 'work'.... for a possibly restricted definition of 'work'.

You get 'pretty 3D' pictures and the ability to store your hub, rim, spoke stuff in a local dirtybase.

HTH, Bye for Now.

JohnDThompson 

Just plug in your numbers and turn the crank:

Bill Kapaun

I just store my Spoke Calc results in my wheel build folder. I can't get much more local than that.
You don't need pictures, you need spoke length.

zhead

Kool.

fietsbob

Rohloff manual page 43, 44 https://www.rohloff.de/fileadmin/roh...fo_2.13.en.pdf

zhead

Kool.

Let's go four cross... Whoops. Good Luck with that one.

Bill Kapaun

Would you explain how that even makes sense?
Your credibility is quickly going down the tube.
Maybe you can give it the final flush.

zhead

Sure.. The more you cross your spokes the nearer they get to head of the, left or right, associated spoke. Push it too hard and the spoke you are inserting has to ride up over the head of a previously inserted spoke which may be bad doo doo's.

The 'picture' tells the story prior to the event..

I guess you have never built a wheel.

HillRider

Uhhh, cross four wheels are often built. It takes at least 36H hubs to do so but it certainly can be done. My first bike came with 4X wheels as standard. Have you actually built any wheels?

Bill Kapaun

WOW! A Double Flush on your credibility.
Seeing that you are such a longtime poster on this forum, you must really know about me NEVER BUILDING a wheel.

SquidPuppet

Thanks for the useful information. Nobody here knew that until you wrote it.

zhead

Sorry to disappoint but yes, by buying spokes that matched the original length.

Unfortunately most recently I built up a BMX wheel from scratch using my program and subsequently spotted the mistake. 184mm ended approximately 2mm short of the ERD. Hole Offset Problem. Program now says, give or take, 186mm.

I do not doubt that four cross can be done. In the case presented.. Picture Says No unless you are happy with the spokes riding over the heads.

zhead

They do now.

ThermionicScott 

What are these pictures that don't expand into anything legible? Are you trying to sell something?

SquidPuppet

Congrats on educating a group of seasoned wheelbuilders.

zhead

I guess, being a newbie, that would be a 'forum' problem. Ask Tom.

Otherwise it will be Foss.. Just a Moment..

Here you Go... Something Like

https://pascalworks.com/pics/

AlexCyclistRoch

Of course 4x wheels do exist, but more often on wheels with small diameter flanges and high spoke counts (my 40 spoke British Raleigh does), but with larger diameter flanges and smaller ERD's and fewer spokes, it does not. Once you get to 32 spoke wheels, I don't believe you ever see 4x spoking.

Bill Kapaun

Keep digging.
We LOVE to see little kiddies bury themselves.
It's really amusing to see one back up their ignorance with more ignorance.

HillRider

That's correct. AFAIK, a 32H 700c wheel cannot be built 4X. You need 36H or more.

Bill Kapaun

Divide number of spokes by 9 to get max crosses for "conventional" wheels.
Large hubs (like dyno hubs etc.) are in their own territory.

zhead

So. I would not be able to ask you about tensioning spokes and the resulting tension in them. Hint, I really could not be interested until I find a starting point for their definition.

SquidPuppet

I have a pair of (not deep) 36H 700c rims laced four cross to very small diameter flange hubs and they are maxed out as far as approaching overlap.

Bill Kapaun

You actually think I would bother to tell you at this point?
You are simply an amusing toy that I've grown weary of.

zhead

Not at all. We have arrived at this point as a result of your actions and you would not know the answer anyway. Do Have a Nice Day.

HillRider

As noted, you are just digging yourself into a deeper and more childish hole. Stop the foolish insults and realize you can have expert help if you are civil and ask decently. There is a great amount of truly expert knowledge and experience here that you have chosen to alienate. Grow up.