HerrKaLeun

I have WTB Speeddisc 26" wheels and all internet tells me they are not designed for tubeless tires.

There are several internet sources that show how to make rims tubeless with a sealant etc. I'm not really sure if that means that sealant is needed when the rim is already designed to be tubeless. Is there a way to make mine tube-less? I know if manufacturer says no this sounds like a stupid question. but i thought i ask anyway if there is a way.

I have 26"x1.9" tires and they show many cracks, so they are not safe. If there ever is a time to go tube-less it is now. If it isn't possible i either get some cheapo Walmart tires or some puncture resistant ones.

Mickey2

I have been looking at this too, but it's a long time since I had a tubeless tyre. If the rims are made for tubeless it should be easier, but I think it's possible to make a wheel air tight using a specific rim tape and tyres. This is a good guide to pick up all the tips and stuff needed to get it right.

AnkleWork

Why are your tires cracked?
What would a tubeless setup do for you?
When you asked the people at WTB, what did they say about using those rims tubeless?
When you asked the "internet sources" about tubeless conversions, what did they say?

HerrKaLeun

thanks, Mickey2. That helps a lot and it seems if one goes the proper route one needs to get the rim tape, sealants and the "tubeless easy" tires. They also say the sealant has to be re-filled every 2-7 months. I looked for the prices of the required material and tires and it is quite steep. I also don't want to re-fill sealant all the time (and will i end up with a heavy tire full of dried sealant?)

I guess it can be done, but doesn't make my life easier. Reason I looked into this is the same why cars have gone from tube to tubeless (more reliable, less weight and friction) . Although cars managed to go tubeless without all these special requirements. I'm hoping this technology develops a bit more and becomes more mainstream for bikes.

My tires are just very old I guess, they are Continental, so it wasn't just a cheapo tire. As rubber ages it cracks.
I didn't ask WTB, that would be pointless since they state it doesn't work and those rims are not one of their current models. The Schwalbe tubeless material seems to work regardless of rim (but that obviously is not a guarantee). It probably is more hassle than worth with the drawbacks. I wanted to simplify maintenance, but the way the tubeless works for bikes that wouldn't be the case.

dabac

Any wheel/rim can be made tubeless, but not all tires can be made tubeless.


A "ghetto tubeless" conversion is very tolerant of what rim you use. And - as the name suggests - not very expensive.



Most, probably all sealants do need to be topped up every now and then.
Frequency depends on choice of sealant, storage conditions and permeability of tires.



No way around that. Sealants are liquids. Liquids do tend to evaporate.



"All the time" is a bit harsh. Unless you live in a desert climate, you're looking at 2-3 times yearly.
And it's a fairly quick task. Faster than replacing a tube. Not really a big deal.


This sealant https://www.rosebikes.co.uk/article/...ant/aid:345625 is supposed to last longer.



Don't worry about ending up with tires filled with gunk.
The particulate amount in the sealants - what's left when the liquid fraction evaporates - isn't that high.
Eventually you end up with some accidental creations called "stanimals" (https://www.google.se/search?q=stani...mals&*&spf=192) in your tires.
It'll take a considerable number of refills before they'd pose a real concern.



Cars have their own "special requirements". Far thicker sidewalls and tread. A lot stronger beads. Stronger rims to allow the bead to set with a lot more force which makes it easier to achieve an air-tight seal.



There are some engineering challenges to that.

My guess is that once you have something as fit & forget as a car tire, you'll have something similar to car tires in (proportional) weight and sidewall thickness.
A wheel where spokes and rims are cast as one piece is naturally easier to make tubeless - less holes to seal.


MTBers have long complained about UST tires. One advantage to tubeless is to be able to use low pressures w/o being plagued by pinch flats. But as sidewalls become thicker, part of that desired suppleness and handling disappears.


I don't doubt it could be engineered, but how would it ride?
Would tires still be possible to mount/dismount with simple hand tools?



Unless you see frequent pinch flats, or penetrating flats of the size sealants can plug, the improvement offered by tubeless for everyday riding isn't much, if any.


What maintenance are you trying to simplify, flat repair?


Inflation interval?


Tire replacement interval?

HerrKaLeun

Wow, great information. i didn't consider the spokes for air-tightness, but that also explains the tape they want.
My understanding is Schwalbe recommends 2 sealants, one for just installation, the other one for puncture resistance that one needs to re-fill. Is the latter needed with puncture-resistant tires? Or do they need it to seal the rim/tire interface better?
right now my maintenance is to adjust pressure every once a while. Never had a flat. I was just thinking if one time I need to replace the tube, and now the tire, tubeless would be the way. but it seems more difficult. This is an old bike, so I don't want to invest $100 if i don't have to. i also saw the "Ghetto"methods, but don't want to risk breaking down.

I probably will order some of these or similar tires. Puncture resistant, and reasonably priced.

Maybe when I have to buy new wheels tubeless will be more advanced and widespread. Thanks for all your advice. I appreciate it.

dabac

I haven't used full-factory-approved setups much, so I can't really tell.
I've met a few riders who've managed to get tires to seal entirely "dry". IME, most will need sealant.


Do note that puncture-resistant means exactly that. Puncture-resistant, not puncture-proof.


If you don't flat often, a spare tube and a pump will be overall easier to deal with than topping up on sealant.



If you don't flat often, and aren't interested in running low pressures, and not too interested in chasing low rolling resistance, the benefits for you to go tubeless are small.



Different rather than difficult.
Yes, you'll need to muck about with sealants.
No, there's no tube to damage during install.


Some flats can be fixed by adding sealant instead of wrestling with a stubborn rim/tire combo. For a rider who finds tire/tube changes difficult, tubeless might offer an advantage.


Bicycles are very mature technology. Significant change is rare. Unless you're chasing a podium finish, old bikes can still be entirely useful and enjoyable.
If you like the bike, don't worry about accumulated age. Maybe think about remaining age.



"Ghetto tubeless " is a bit experimental WRT how well the tire sidewalls will seal up.
But if it goes wrong that's a (slow) leak, not an instantaneous failure.


Most common (only?) sudden issue with "ghetto tubeless" is the tire "burping" from a combination of cornering and low pressure. Never heard about it happening at regular pressures.

Mickey2

I have had various bikes and tyres over the years, and by far the least maintanance I've had is with Schwalbe Marathon Pluss tyres, with presta valves. I max out on the air pressure for easy rolling. This is a heavy tire, I like it, but it all depends on what type of riding you do. I have had this tyre on 26" wheels as well as narrow 28", even 40-635 (the only puncture resistant tyre I could find in this odd size). They are a bit more expensive, but they are the most puncture resistant tyre I have had and very durable too. For comparison, I find Continental Touring Plus very much like the average tyre in most respects.

These days it's mostly top of the range bikes and enthusiasts that bother with tubless tyres, and I imagine it's not the most low cost solution. If you find a pair of tyres in your dimensions and like to try it, nothing shoud stop you, but I don't think low maintenance should be the reaon. I need to replace the rear tyre roughly once a year, and I often replace both if I can't find a match to the front wheel or just want to change to something else.

For easy maintanance I go for hub bakes, gear hub, well built parts in general, but all moving parts require a certain amount of upkeep. It reduces upkeep to regular wash, hosing off and lubrication; a bit more to service hubs, crank set, and wheels, but it's more of a once a year thing.

athrowawaynic

Why do you want to go tubeless?

M2faux

I noticed the Sealant specs read "can only be used with unsrewable valve stem insert"

corrado33

Considering your obvious lack of expertise in the subject. I wouldn't recommend trying to convert your rims to tubeless. Definitely not with wal-mart tires.

It's honestly not worth it. Tubes work fine. If you are getting flats there are other ways to prevent them. Having a temperamental tubeless setup is just going to give you more headaches. Every single person I've known that has setup tubeless has had significant trouble with setting it up, even on tubeless compatible rims and tires. I can't imagine how much trouble someone who doesn't know what they're doing is going to have when not using either...

dabac

And....

Injecting sealant through the valve can either glue the valve shut, or keep it from closing properly.

The valves purpose-made for tubeless already have removable cores, so it's not really an issue.

Tubes are available with removable cores too.

HerrKaLeun

I think this thread can get closed (if this is an option). Last night I received my Park tool "Big Blue Book" and had I read that before I probably wouldn't even have asked. Seems really only worthwhile if you have the correct rims and tires. Any other method is just too much trouble and jury-rigging it doesn't sound like reducing problems.

Thanks for all your responses and help.