Painting carbon fiber
#1
serenity NOWWW!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Northern Iraq
Posts: 319
Bikes: custom surly SS, several others in the works
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Painting carbon fiber
Can carbon fiber be stripped of its clear coat in order to paint it a different color? Dont really like the carbon fiber weave look and want to paint it a solid black. Its the fork by the way.
__________________
In his surreal surroundings among the clouds, this was his flight! Until, he saw the master caution light.
In his surreal surroundings among the clouds, this was his flight! Until, he saw the master caution light.
#2
Senior Curmudgeon
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Directly above the center of the earth
Posts: 3,856
Bikes: Varies by day
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
I think you don't want to strip the clear coat completely.. Might open the carbon fiber underlay to damage. I think the clear coat is also structural, holding the fiber in place, but I may be wrong..
You also open yourself to some risk by painting. If the frame develops cracks, the paint may hide them. When carbon cracks, I understand that it (like aluminum) can then fail quickly ("catastrophically").
So my answer (admittedly one uninformed by personal experience in painting carbon fiber), is that "yes, you can probably roughen the surface lightly and then paint, but there are negatives to take into account." I'm sure that others with more experience in this area will reply. I look forward to hearing what they have to say.
You also open yourself to some risk by painting. If the frame develops cracks, the paint may hide them. When carbon cracks, I understand that it (like aluminum) can then fail quickly ("catastrophically").
So my answer (admittedly one uninformed by personal experience in painting carbon fiber), is that "yes, you can probably roughen the surface lightly and then paint, but there are negatives to take into account." I'm sure that others with more experience in this area will reply. I look forward to hearing what they have to say.
#3
Shimano Certified
Unlike metal finishes, carbon clearcoat should not be removed to paint it. The Gelcoat is an important part of the material and seals it from abrasion and weather.
To promote adhesion, however, you will want to remove the gloss from said finish. Do so with caution and medium to fine grit; ie 320 or higher and wet it as you go. Stop when it is evenly hazy. At no point should the surface get rough or weave expose, as this means you went through the afore mentioned coat.
Go to an automotive supply store(NAPA) and get a can of urethane primer. It will run about 16 bucks for a spray can, but it goes a long way and has many advantages in this job. Mainly the fact it builds up. Spray two coats with dry time between, then let it dry for a day. Sand lightly with 320-400 grit to smooth it. Tack-rag it off to remove the dust, and paint as you feel fit.
(DISCLAIMER)
All urethane products, primarily those sprayed, should be used in GOOD VENTILATION and user should wear the appropriate filtration mask. Details are available at the supply store. It is simple to use, but as with any paint product, should be treated with propper cautions.
To promote adhesion, however, you will want to remove the gloss from said finish. Do so with caution and medium to fine grit; ie 320 or higher and wet it as you go. Stop when it is evenly hazy. At no point should the surface get rough or weave expose, as this means you went through the afore mentioned coat.
Go to an automotive supply store(NAPA) and get a can of urethane primer. It will run about 16 bucks for a spray can, but it goes a long way and has many advantages in this job. Mainly the fact it builds up. Spray two coats with dry time between, then let it dry for a day. Sand lightly with 320-400 grit to smooth it. Tack-rag it off to remove the dust, and paint as you feel fit.
(DISCLAIMER)
All urethane products, primarily those sprayed, should be used in GOOD VENTILATION and user should wear the appropriate filtration mask. Details are available at the supply store. It is simple to use, but as with any paint product, should be treated with propper cautions.
#4
Shimano Certified
On the subject of frame failures. Carbon has a sharp failure mode when abused. When it has reached its ultimate load it will crack, but these cracks are generally apparent even through paint. Delamination of the weaves within a tube would be harder to detect and are more of a risk to find, however they are not generally hindered by a finish, since carbon is not transparent.
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 9,428
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
Originally Posted by FarHorizon
I think the clear coat is also structural, holding the fiber in place, but I may be wrong..
You also open yourself to some risk by painting. If the frame develops cracks, the paint may hide them. When carbon cracks, I understand that it (like aluminum) can then fail quickly ("catastrophically").
You also open yourself to some risk by painting. If the frame develops cracks, the paint may hide them. When carbon cracks, I understand that it (like aluminum) can then fail quickly ("catastrophically").
#6
Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 30
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Question for mtbikerinpa...
I have a Trek 2300 that has the clear coat peeling. I scraped the peeled clear coat off with an exacto knife and I'm litely sanding the rest. Can I just spray a lacquer clear coat on or do I need to primer first with a eurethane primer?
Thanks...
I have a Trek 2300 that has the clear coat peeling. I scraped the peeled clear coat off with an exacto knife and I'm litely sanding the rest. Can I just spray a lacquer clear coat on or do I need to primer first with a eurethane primer?
Thanks...
#7
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Torrance, CA
Posts: 3,059
Bikes: Homebuilt steel
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2180 Post(s)
Liked 419 Times
in
332 Posts
Most carbon parts have a clear coat (paint) on top of the gel coat (structural epoxy holding the fibers in place).
In either case, painting is no problem. Rough up the existing finish with 400 wet paper and lay down a sealer coat of your choosing (I used PPG DP Epoxy when I painted my Look HSC3 fork). After the sealer coat, spray your color and clear per normal.
Good luck.
Ed
In either case, painting is no problem. Rough up the existing finish with 400 wet paper and lay down a sealer coat of your choosing (I used PPG DP Epoxy when I painted my Look HSC3 fork). After the sealer coat, spray your color and clear per normal.
Good luck.
Ed
#8
serenity NOWWW!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Northern Iraq
Posts: 319
Bikes: custom surly SS, several others in the works
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
excellent. thanks for the help everyone!
__________________
In his surreal surroundings among the clouds, this was his flight! Until, he saw the master caution light.
In his surreal surroundings among the clouds, this was his flight! Until, he saw the master caution light.
#10
serenity NOWWW!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Northern Iraq
Posts: 319
Bikes: custom surly SS, several others in the works
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Raiyn
You'd think that for most people that would be the whole point of getting Carbon Fiber
__________________
In his surreal surroundings among the clouds, this was his flight! Until, he saw the master caution light.
In his surreal surroundings among the clouds, this was his flight! Until, he saw the master caution light.
#11
645f44
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Oxford, Uk
Posts: 482
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
Isn't the epoxy used with carbon degraded by uv light? Not a problem if you are going to paint a solid colour but if you are planing to clear coat a peeling frame it might be something to look into.
#12
Shimano Certified
Essentially all finishes are degraded by UV. It is merely how much and how fast. A pigmented topcoat(not clear) will last longer than a clear to be sure, but a quality gelcoat should still last years before it becomes an issue.
Laquer clear should be avoided if you can help it. The higher volatility of the laquer solvents can damage the gelcoats in some instances. Not always, but it can and it would really be a bugger to find out That is the purpose of using a urethane finish. Urethane is non reactive to the materials it is applied to, not to mention it is wayyyyy more durable. I know it costs more but it is worth it.
Laquer clear should be avoided if you can help it. The higher volatility of the laquer solvents can damage the gelcoats in some instances. Not always, but it can and it would really be a bugger to find out That is the purpose of using a urethane finish. Urethane is non reactive to the materials it is applied to, not to mention it is wayyyyy more durable. I know it costs more but it is worth it.
#14
Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 30
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Sooo... If I like the looks of the fiber weave, can I just spray Urethane primer on it and leave it, or do I need to spray a top coat on the primer, or can I spray only a Urethane clear coat with no primer? Sorry for my confusion on this, I just want to get it right the first time. I'll be moving to the the Gulf Coast soon so I want the frame to be well protected from the elements.
Thanks for all the help, I really appreciate it...
Thanks for all the help, I really appreciate it...
#15
Shimano Certified
Urethane primer will typically be in ship gray, red-oxide, or black. You can use clearcoat over the material directly, provided you clean it perfectly of any contaminants. Acrylic is also non-reactive. In fact, Acrylic-urethane is a commonly available automotive finish. It posesses most of plain urethane's durability but with some different propperties of acrylic. Straight acrylic will work on the application, but do not be lured into cheaping out, as it will potentially haunt you later. Pay more now and save for the life of the frame(A/U is a 10-15yr life expectancy when continually outdoors.