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Old 05-11-06, 03:16 PM   #1
rat_factory
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suntour freewheel & shimano freehub

I know the first thing most people will say is to upgrade to new technology, but I am curious to see if this will work, and I dont have the $$ to upgrade.

I am making a slick set of wheels for a cannondale sm500. this is currently running suntour q/r hubs and a suntour accushift 7sp freewheel in back. i'm not sure of the rear spacing.

the wheelset I am putting together is shimano alivio parallax. the rear wheel is a shimano cassette freehub. I overhauled the bearings, etc and put it back (I think) in the same way I took it apart. now i have no previous point of reference for the alivio wheel working with my suntour system, but when i put the alivio wheel in the frame the indexing of the suntour accushift x-1 shifters and derailleur does not line up correctly with the cogs.

are shimano 7sp cassette freehubs compatible with suntour 7sp accushift freewheels? can i just space the axle in the frame diffrently with washers? are there cog spacers available to do this? am i in way over my head? is this the most pointless wheelset mix ever made?

last resort and simplest solution, although not as nearly fun/frustrating is to simply change tires when i go on the trail.
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Old 05-11-06, 03:43 PM   #2
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I'm not exactly sure about your question, but I'll take a shot.

Suntour 7-speed systems used unequal spacing between the centers of the teeth on the cogs. The bottom three are spaced 4.8 mm apart, while the top three are space 5.0 mm apart.

Shimano 7-speed systems are all spaced 5.0 mm apart.

I don't think that your Accushift shifters will reliaby index with a Shimano cassette.
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Old 05-11-06, 04:29 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spunkyruss
I'm not exactly sure about your question, but I'll take a shot.

Suntour 7-speed systems used unequal spacing between the centers of the teeth on the cogs. The bottom three are spaced 4.8 mm apart, while the top three are space 5.0 mm apart.

Shimano 7-speed systems are all spaced 5.0 mm apart.

I don't think that your Accushift shifters will reliaby index with a Shimano cassette.
It's true that the spacing is slightly different. However, the Shimano Hyperglide sprocket teeth are so very superior in shifting performance, compared with the relatively primitive Sun Tour sprockets, that this sort of mismatch usually results in improved shifting in practice.

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Old 05-11-06, 08:33 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheldon Brown
However, the Shimano Hyperglide sprocket teeth are so very superior in shifting performance, compared with the relatively primitive Sun Tour sprockets, that this sort of mismatch usually results in improved shifting in practice.....
Thanks for the correction
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Old 05-12-06, 07:13 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spunkyruss
I'm not exactly sure about your question, but I'll take a shot.
my simple question was if the 7sp shimano cassette wheel will work with my current index adjustment, shifters, and derailer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheldon Brown
However, the Shimano Hyperglide sprocket teeth are so very superior in shifting performance, compared with the relatively primitive Sun Tour sprockets, that this sort of mismatch usually results in improved shifting in practice.
first let me saw that i am surprisingly starstruck, Mr. Brown. I have looked to your website for years for advice on stuck seatposts, bottom bracket size equality, and many other things not found in my repair manual.

i gave it a try and it seemed pretty crunchy. shifting was present, but the derailer pully was not aligned with the first cog, and become less aligned as I shifted to higher cogs. I would like to be able to switch wheels without re-adjusting the derailer everytime, as it is already very fussy adjusting ndexing on the original hardware.

funny you and practically everyone else should say that hyperglide is massivley superior to non-ramped/pinned/and twisted teeth on conventional freewheel cogs. I went to my LBS today trying to locate an axle for this same wheel because I thought the axle may have been bent because the when the rear wheel freewheeled in my repair stand, although the cogs were stationary, the freewheel seemed to pivot unevenly around the axle. The wrench at my shop said this was normal and it allowed the chain to be slightly misaligned every rotation so shifts were better. I was shocked naturally and said I thought the HG stuff was miles ahead of that technology. They said it was just a shimano ploy and they don't shift that much better. Well, I bought my rim-tape and left. I have had previous trouble with this shop before.

anyway, i think i am just going to change tires when I hit the trails. i'm too tired to do any more work on this old bike.

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Old 05-12-06, 07:23 PM   #6
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.....anyway, i think i am just going to change tires when I hit the trails. i'm too tired to do any more work on this old bike.
All that practice will make you blindingly fast at fixing flats!
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Old 05-12-06, 08:37 PM   #7
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I have to disagree with your conclusion about Sun Tour and Shimano shifting. I've ridden both in both friction and index form. There is absolutely no comparison. Current Shimano drive trains are so superior to what Sun Tour produced any comparison is absurd. Sun Tour may have equaled Shimano if they'd have stayed in business longer but they didn't and they didn't.

Even Campagnolo's first two attempts at index shifting were dreadful compared to the Shimano components at the same time. They eventually got it right and are fully equal to Shimano now but Sun Tour wasn't around long enough to do so.
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Old 05-12-06, 09:47 PM   #8
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perhaps I didn't make myself clear. my LBS thought old plain freewheels shifted better than hyperglide. I was shocked because I have ridden both technologies and I was saying that hyperglide is superior.
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Old 05-13-06, 08:20 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by rat_factory
perhaps I didn't make myself clear. my LBS thought old plain freewheels shifted better than hyperglide. I was shocked because I have ridden both technologies and I was saying that hyperglide is superior.
Sorry. I guess I didn't read your comments carefully enough. We certainly agree and I can't believe your LBS thinks otherwwise. Does he have a bunch of old freewheels he is trying to sell?
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