redscarf

Hi guys! So, I've completely rebuilt my bike in the off season, and I did everything myself except switching the steel threaded fork and headset to a carbon threadless fork and headset (for one thing, I didn't have a saw, but anyway...) The only other thing I was kind of baffled by was the cabling - I thought I wouldn't be able to get the shift cabling done correctly, but a few people told me it was easy, so I thought I'd give it a try.

Well, I got it to work on my front derailleur (of course my chain is jumping...ok, I can adjust that - no big deal) but nothing at all happens when I switch gears on my rear derailleur. Sure, the cables get more taught as I switch to larger cogs, but the derailleur doesn't budge - it just won't switch to a larger cog at all.

Also, depending on how taught I made the cable before tightening it at the rear derailleur, my STI shifter clicks only about six or seven times when shifting, even though it's indexed for ten. I feel like I've tried everything. Does anyone have any advice? Should I just go to my local bike shop and have them do it for me?

Thanks for any advice!

hammond9705

Check out the Park site at:

https://www.parktool.com/repair/byregion.asp?catid=53

They have well written instructions.

Bob

I_bRAD

Sounds like you have WAY too much slack in the cable or more likely you've routed the cable wrong. Do you have pics?

Steve K

just some few things to check before adjusting the cable

make sure your shifter is completely upshifted so it would be in the smallest cog
check the limit screws by hand (use your hand to move the derailleur all the toward the largest cog)
make sure that the cable is being routed through the derailleur and pinchnut the proper way (straight through)
i'd back the barrel adjuster on the rd itself all the way out (allowing you to tighten it when it turns, rather than loosen. you can always stretch a cable a bit if you need to, i've found)
and then pull the cable so it doesn't move the derailleur (to do this, i usually pull the cable tight so that the derailleur moves and then let it slacken just a tad)

make sure all of the housing is situated into any ferrules correctly.

a great tool for this and any cable adjustment is a set of cable stretchers. the pedro's set is cheaper, but i think the grip on the park one is much nicer and allows for a stronger grip.

good luck with it!

cascade168

A couple of notes about cable stretchers (aka "fourth hand"):

1. Almost never needed for Rear derailleurs. Just pull the cable tight with a pair of pliers. I pull them tight with my fingers all the time and just use a turn or two with the barrel adjuster.

2. Not normally needed with Front derailleurs, either. Usually, a pair of pliers will do. Just take the slack out with the pliers, lock down the cable, and then use the barrel adjusters to finish the tensioning.

3. Most brake cables don't need this tool either. Just squeeze the pads against the rims (fingers will usually do, but a third hand clamp helps sometimes), pull the slack out of the cable and lock down. Again, the barrel adjusters will finish the fine adjustment.

4. The one type of brakes that I find often needs the use of a cable stretcher is cantilevers. These seem to be the hardest brakes to adjust (and, most hated by LBS types). I love v-brakes ;-)

One tip that makes any and all of these cable adjustments easier is that any and all barrel adjusters should always be screwed in all the way (i.e. CW) before you lock down any cable. This gives the barrel adjusters the best chance to get the cable to the correct tension. If you can't get enough tension with the barrel adjuster, THEN it's time to break out the fourth hand cable stretcher.

redscarf

It doesn't seem like I have too much slack, but let me take some pictures. Give me a minute...

JanMM

what they said...esp. reference to Park site.....and "taut"

cascade168

Sorry, I should have read your OP more carefully. There are a couple of things that can cause this.

If your STI shifter is only clicking six or seven times, then you probably did not completely upshift it (with the small lever) before you pulled the slack out of the cable. Push repeatedly on the small lever until it stops clicking. This should set you up for the highest gear (the smallest rear cog).

Now, before you take the slack out of the cable and lock it down, pull the brake lever and look inside the STI assy and make sure the cable anchor head is seated correctly in the STI. If it is, now you are ready to pull the slack out and lock down the cable.

You should be good to go at this point. If a downshift click with the big lever does not give a corresponding shift up to the next bigger cog, then turn the barrel adjuster a full turn. Repeat until you get a full shift and then fine tune the barrel adjuster for the smoothest shift.

redscarf

Ok - so here are pictures I took of my cable routing. If you notice any mistakes on my part (highly likely!) please let me know. Thanks!!!

https://redscarf.net/cables/

cascade168

Yup, you definitely made a mistake right at the pinch bolt.

The cable is not supposed to go under the little tab (it's part of the washer under the head of the pinch bolt). The cable should go straight through the barrel adjuster and just fit between the washer and the body of the RD - in a straight line. You have it making a 90deg turn at the pinch bolt. This is a very common mistake and will definitely affect shifting.

I will try to find a good description and some pictures of the correct routing.

redscarf

Hammond & JanMM: The Park site and Sheldon Brown's derailleur adjustment pages were my two main guides in this (mis)adventure...I *feel like* I followed them very closely, studies the pics, etc. But I probably still missed something...

Steve K & Cascade: I did everything both of you said (it was sitting correctly in the shifter), but no change. I think there's some fundamental flaw in what I did. Because really, the RD is not moving at all.

cascade168

Go to this page on the Park site:

https://www.parktool.com/repair/readhowto.asp?id=64

Scroll down to the last pictures on that page and it will show exactly what you did wrong. As I said, this problem is so common that they actually have pictures and discuss it. So, don't feel too bad - it's happenned a million times before ;-)))

cascade168

Can you push on the derailleur and get it to move across the planes of the cogs? This would be equivalent to manually shifting without the cable.

redscarf

Cascade: I've tried all positions...I just switched to going straight through and it's the same situation. I'm going to try to take a movie to show how nothing at all is happening...

I_bRAD

The cable was wrapped around the washer funny but that shouldn't result in NO shifting, just poorer shifting. Sounds like you fixed that anyhow. Next step is to make sure it's connecting at the shifter properly- double check to make sure the head of the cable is engaged in the shifter properly (kinda sucks since you've got the bar tape done already, but with a flashlight and patience it is possible to feed the cable back through without removing the tape.)

redscarf

Cascade: Yes, I can manually shift. Just not with my shifter.

Anyway, I uploaded a video of me shifting to my lower cogs and back...but as you see, the derailleur doesn't move. Sorry that it's 5.5 megs.

https://redscarf.net/cables/MOV06869.MPG

cascade168

OK, let's talk about "manual" shifting for a second ...

Assuming you have a repair stand, disconnect the cable completely. Now, crank the pedals.

On your derailleur, the parallelogram is the piece of the derailleur that says "Ultegra" on it. While you are cranking the pedals, grab the end of the parallelogram that is at the "U" end of "Ultegra". While grabbing that end, push the other end (the "a" end of "Ultegra"). By pushing on the "a" end, you should accomplish manual shifting by pushing the jockey wheels across the planes of each cog in succession. Until you can do the manual shifting, don't even both with the cable. It sounds like you could have a problem that's more basic than a cable tension problem.

You could do this without a repair stand by flipping the bike upside down and standing on your head. No, just kidding. Don't stand on your head ;-) But, crank the pedals and see if you can manually shift.

I_bRAD

The cable isn't in the shifter properly

redscarf

I_Brad: I did check that the cable was sitting correctly in the shifter, and I can garuntee that it is. And with Shimano, shifter cables don't go under that bar tape, so even it that does turn out, somehow, to be my problem, I wouldn't have to take it off. Anyway, I wouldn't have put it on until I had the cables all set if I had had Campy or Sram shifters.

Thanks for helping me out guys...just want to mention that.

I_bRAD

duh yeah. Forgot it's the brakes that are under the tape. Well, for future reference it is possible to re-route the brake cable through the housing without removing the tape with some patience.

So if you were to unclamp the cable at the derailleur and actuate the shifter it pulls the cable?

redscarf

Wait a sec...I think Brad was right...I don't think it's in the shifter properly...but give me a moment to play around...it keeps slipping, I'm hoping nothing's wrong with the shifter...eegad!

cascade168

Here's what I got from the movie (no problem with that file size, BTW):

I can hear you shifting, but I don't see the derailleur moving at all (but, you already know that). This would tell me that you still have slack in the cable somehow. So, here's the drill again:

1. Loosen pinch bolt.
2. Up shift completely (w/small lever - as many clicks as you can).
3. Squeeze brake and check cable anchor head seating - you should be able to look straight at it, in a line with the cable, from the side of the bike.
4. If cable anchor head is seated and STI is completely up shifted, make sure any barrel shifters are screwed in all the way CW.
5. Pull slack out of cable and lock down pinch bolt.
6. Test shifting and adjust cable tension with barrel shifters as needed.

redscarf

Alright, I haven't fixed it yet, but I have a pretty good idea of what I did wrong:

So, I had everything adjusted to the smallest cog when I did everything, EXCEPT when I first inserted the cable in the shifter. I guess I thought it was enough if shifted up before doing the housing, etc. I can't even get the cable out right now...oh well, I know it's possible...

Thanks for your help again guys!!

cascade168

This may sound a bit extreme, but it would not be a bad idea to completely remove the cable and re-install.

If you do this, here's the drill:

1. Remove cable.
2. Up shift the shifter all the way (click with small lever until it stops clicking). The hole that goes through the brifter should now be lined up properly with the cable housing. This is VERY important.
3. Now, insert the cable by pulling on the brake and inserting the cable straight in from the side of the STI housing - just like you're trying to poke the cable into the housing, but the brifter is inbetween.
4. Push the cable through and route to derailleur. Make sure you get the cable anchor head seated completely before you do anything further.
5. Perform everything already discussed above.

EDit: If your cable is frayed, go to LBS and buy a new one for $2. That's a lot cheaper than replacing your brifter.

I_bRAD

It's possible. It might take some time and a dremel but it's possible. Good luck, I'm off for a ride!