Advertise on Bikeforums.net



User Tag List

Results 1 to 22 of 22
  1. #1
    Senior Member iherald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,274
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Groove in Carbon

    When my carbon bike was put together last spring they routed the front derailer cable wrong. Under the bottom bracket is a hole that the cable is supposed to run through. They didn't run it through that hole, and as a result there is a slight (very slight, but visible because of the colour and your nail catches it) groove in the carbon.

    I've talked to the bike shop who takes full responsibility for it, and the manufacturer is now involved. I emailed them pictures yesterday and I'm concerned they will say that it's a minor groove and not structurally an issue. I hope they won't, but you never know.

    I've attached a picture of the bottom of my bike, and I drew a very professional arrow to the groove.

    I've read that carbon is super weakened by any breach in the body. I don't want to get into a carbon sucks thread, but I'm curious about a) whether this is a serious issue and b) because of where it is, if they don't honour a warranty claim and I don't feel like going to small claims court, then is this still safe to ride?

    Thanks!
    Attached Images Attached Images
    I rode CanadaWide for Cancer in 2006! I rode 6850km and raised over $110 000 for kids with cancer. Check out the journal at: http://www.cyclingforcancer.ca

  2. #2
    Senior Member Nessism's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Torrance, CA
    My Bikes
    Homebuilt steel
    Posts
    2,324
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Looks like a non issue to me.
    Becareful buying/selling bike parts on-line. I learned the hard way. :(

    Good/Bad Trader Listing

  3. #3
    Taking "s" outta "Fast" AfterThisNap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Zoo York City
    Posts
    1,989
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    yea, I wouldn't sweat it.
    Hit the macro setting on your digital camear (flower pot symbol) and take an extreme closeup.
    Carries suspicious allegiance to Brooklyn Machine Works.

  4. #4
    *********
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    21
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    While the groove is less than ideal, it's not in a highly stressed region.

  5. #5
    Senior Member iherald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,274
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Thanks for the input, I'll try that camera setting to get a better shot.

    Should I put something like clear nail polish over the groove? My thought being it would fill it up as well as add some strength (maybe?!)
    I rode CanadaWide for Cancer in 2006! I rode 6850km and raised over $110 000 for kids with cancer. Check out the journal at: http://www.cyclingforcancer.ca

  6. #6
    Senior Member Nessism's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Torrance, CA
    My Bikes
    Homebuilt steel
    Posts
    2,324
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by iherald
    Should I put something like clear nail polish over the groove? My thought being it would fill it up as well as add some strength (maybe?!)
    Nail polish will not add strength. It would fill the groove and keep crud out though which couldn't hurt. If you are that worried I recommend you dab a little clear epoxy in the groove - clean with alcohol first. It will hold up better than finger nail polish and won't be affected by solvents/oils that may hit the frame in that area.
    Becareful buying/selling bike parts on-line. I learned the hard way. :(

    Good/Bad Trader Listing

  7. #7
    Senior Member iherald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,274
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nessism
    Nail polish will not add strength. It would fill the groove and keep crud out though which couldn't hurt. If you are that worried I recommend you dab a little clear epoxy in the groove - clean with alcohol first. It will hold up better than finger nail polish and won't be affected by solvents/oils that may hit the frame in that area.
    Would you recommend the epoxy, or just not bother with it and keep everything clean as I'm supposed too?
    I rode CanadaWide for Cancer in 2006! I rode 6850km and raised over $110 000 for kids with cancer. Check out the journal at: http://www.cyclingforcancer.ca

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Pittsburgh, PA
    My Bikes
    '''96 Litespeed Catalyst, '05 Litespeed Firenze, '06 Litespeed Tuscany, '12 Surly Pacer, All are 3x8,9 or 10. It is hilly around here!
    Posts
    26,176
    Mentioned
    14 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by twowheels
    While the groove is less than ideal, it's not in a highly stressed region.
    That's my take also. Cover the groove with clear nail polish as you said. If the manufacturer is willing to make an adjustment, fine, but otherwise don't worry.

  9. #9
    Si Senior dbg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Naperville, Illinois
    My Bikes
    Too Numerous (not)
    Posts
    2,444
    Mentioned
    3 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I would not use nail polish. It is primarily Acetone which is a solvent for the epoxy resins in the carbon frame. I would smoothly cover the groove with more epoxy, not with its solvent
    David Green, Naperville, IL USA "The older I get, the better I used to be" --Lee Trevino

  10. #10
    Senior Member iherald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,274
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by dbg
    I would not use nail polish. It is primarily Acetone which is a solvent for the epoxy resins in the carbon frame. I would smoothly cover the groove with more epoxy, not with its solvent
    Well that's very good information to know!! Going to the hardware store, is there a specific type of epoxy I ask for?
    I rode CanadaWide for Cancer in 2006! I rode 6850km and raised over $110 000 for kids with cancer. Check out the journal at: http://www.cyclingforcancer.ca

  11. #11
    Si Senior dbg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Naperville, Illinois
    My Bikes
    Too Numerous (not)
    Posts
    2,444
    Mentioned
    3 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    The stronger/harder ones are also the longer setting ones. If you're not in a hurry I'd use the strongest one available in a convenient small container. (I like those double-plunger dispensers. I keep those around for general purpose repairs. I also have stronger stuff I used to use for golf club assembly)
    David Green, Naperville, IL USA "The older I get, the better I used to be" --Lee Trevino

  12. #12
    Senior Member iherald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,274
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by dbg
    The stronger/harder ones are also the longer setting ones. If you're not in a hurry I'd use the strongest one available in a convenient small container. (I like those double-plunger dispensers. I keep those around for general purpose repairs. I also have stronger stuff I used to use for golf club assembly)
    So, go to the local hardware store, ask for clear drying epoxy that is in a small container and the strongest possible? Is there a brand that you use?

    Can I use this stuff on an Aluminum bike too? I saw a hairline crack starting at around the seat post that I'd like to just firm up.
    I rode CanadaWide for Cancer in 2006! I rode 6850km and raised over $110 000 for kids with cancer. Check out the journal at: http://www.cyclingforcancer.ca

  13. #13
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Clinton Hill, Brooklyn
    Posts
    508
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by iherald
    Can I use this stuff on an Aluminum bike too? I saw a hairline crack starting at around the seat post that I'd like to just firm up.
    Whoa there. It is not a cure-all. If you have a crack in the seat stay area of an Alu frame, which is a highly stressed area, the frame is toast & no amount of epoxy will "fix" it.

  14. #14
    Senior Member iherald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,274
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by splytz1
    Whoa there. It is not a cure-all. If you have a crack in the seat stay area of an Alu frame, which is a highly stressed area, the frame is toast & no amount of epoxy will "fix" it.
    Oh well, can't hurt asking!
    I rode CanadaWide for Cancer in 2006! I rode 6850km and raised over $110 000 for kids with cancer. Check out the journal at: http://www.cyclingforcancer.ca

  15. #15
    Taking "s" outta "Fast" AfterThisNap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Zoo York City
    Posts
    1,989
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by dbg
    I would not use nail polish. It is primarily Acetone which is a solvent for the epoxy resins in the carbon frame.

    No, it's not . Nail polish will be fine an is, in fact, a suggested touch up for many a carbon mfg.
    Really, it's the equivalent of a paint chip. I've seen frames with busted tubes that had carbon fragments threading out of the crack and people still rode them home.
    Just dab that thing with nail polish and stop worrying.
    Carries suspicious allegiance to Brooklyn Machine Works.

  16. #16
    Si Senior dbg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Naperville, Illinois
    My Bikes
    Too Numerous (not)
    Posts
    2,444
    Mentioned
    3 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by AfterThisNap
    No, it's not . Nail polish will be fine an is, in fact, a suggested touch up for many a carbon mfg.
    Really, it's the equivalent of a paint chip. I've seen frames with busted tubes that had carbon fragments threading out of the crack and people still rode them home.
    Just dab that thing with nail polish and stop worrying.

    My bad. I misspoke. Nail Polish REMOVER is primarily acetone. Nail polish is more like a varnish and would probably be just fine. But I would still lean toward a long setting epoxy
    David Green, Naperville, IL USA "The older I get, the better I used to be" --Lee Trevino

  17. #17
    Senior Member George's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Katy Texas
    My Bikes
    Specialized Roubaix
    Posts
    5,293
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I would go to a boat store and buy a 2 part epoxy. I think it's called called System 3. It's clear and they sell it in small packets. It use to be $10.
    George

  18. #18
    Newbie
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    4
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by dbg
    My bad. I misspoke. Nail Polish REMOVER is primarily acetone. Nail polish is more like a varnish and would probably be just fine. But I would still lean toward a long setting epoxy
    Acetone only dissolves epoxy before it is cured. After it's cured there is no prob using acetone to clean it

  19. #19
    Senior Member RoMad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Citrus county Fl.
    My Bikes
    Litespeed Tuscany , Lemond Poprad, 1970's Motobecane Grand Record
    Posts
    780
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I would not put anything on a new carbon bike until I asked the factory rep. Having done that, if he has no objection I would use a good name brand epoxy. Devcon makes industrial strength 2 part epoxies that are made for specific materials. Another good one that has been around a long time and I have used on various material (but not a carbon frame) is J&B weld. You can get it at the local auto parts store.

  20. #20
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    S.E. Pennsylvania, USA
    Posts
    1,737
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I've actully used nail polish to keep a carbon seat post from sliding down in the carbon seat tube. No problem with it and it works well. In terms of epoxy on the groove, it will fill and perhaps cover better than nail polish, but provide no real strength. The strength in carbon fiber is not from the epoxy in the matrix; it's from the carbon fibers. I suspect the others are correct in the assessment that this is not a high stress area. If it were mine, however, I'd push for an extended frame replacement warranty as a bottom line, and hope for a frame replacement.
    Oh I used to be disgusted and now I try to be amused. But since their wings have got rusted, you know, the angels wanna wear my red shoes. But when they told me 'bout their side of the bargain, that's when I knew that I could not refuse. And I won't get any older, now the angels wanna wear my red shoes.

  21. #21
    Old Fat Guy paul43's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    SUNNY Melbourne, FL
    My Bikes
    Trek Pilot 5.2, Trek 4500
    Posts
    100
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I think you would be better off doing nothing to the groove until you get an answer from the FACTORY---messing around with stuff like that just may be a cause for them to void the warranty.

    Especially if the bike shop accepted the responsibility for the mistake---I personaly think you are due a new frame--just think how deep the groove might have gotten if you haven't found it. The bike shop should honor the replacement.
    "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has it's limits"
    Albert Einstein

  22. #22
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    1,616
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by BSLeVan
    In terms of epoxy on the groove, it will fill and perhaps cover better than nail polish, but provide no real strength. The strength in carbon fiber is not from the epoxy in the matrix; it's from the carbon fibers.
    For the record, carbon fibers alone have great tearing strength but no rigidity. It's basically just fabric. Rigidity comes from the hardening agent.

    In the OP's situation, though, the nail polish or epoxy would perform the function of a clearcoat, which is protective and cosmetic, but not structural.

    Bob

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •