Advertise on Bikeforums.net



User Tag List

Results 1 to 6 of 6
  1. #1
    go wake forest!!!! bandaidman's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Posts
    313
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    tubeless verses tubes

    i had new tires put on my truck today...of course they are tubeless

    i have always had "tubed" bike tires

    what are the advantages of "tubeless" tires...i have heard they do not hold air as long...if that is true ....why?

    while i find it a pain to change out a tube on a road bike tire...what do you do if you have a flat with a tubeless mtb tire (i am unsure if there are tubeless road tires)???


    a second question...i have noticed that on presta valves most do not have a screw on cap....you can get them and i have always heard you need to protect the valve from dirt and damage...i know the little metal piece on the valve does that to some degree....do you put valve caps on those little valves????

  2. #2
    Chi
    Chi is offline
    Rides with Cows Chi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Fixing a flat
    My Bikes
    Trek 7000
    Posts
    1,232
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I can answer the second question: New tubes come with the caps, but from what I've seen and heard, they don't do much since prestas have that built in valve core screw cap. The built-in cap acts like the plastic cap on the schraeder (sp?) valves (Trek Owner's Manual) and protects the valve from automatically deflating the tyre.

    I still keep the plastic caps on my prestas on my MTB, but that's because it's something I'm used to doing since it's good practice for schraeder valves.

  3. #3
    Senior Member roadrage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Posts
    118
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I think they don't hold air as well because they are not sealed as tight as a tube is. They help with pinch flats if that is something you get due to running lower presssure for increased traction. On the trails I frequent, it does not seem very advantageous, but some trails it would.

    A flat with a tubeless tire, you can boot stick on boot it, repair or patch the inside of the tire, or remove the tubeless valve portion and run a tube.

    I keep the the caps on. I figure they just keep dirt out and my pump heads won't possibly get gummed up. I ride in some bad weather sometimes. Some of this may just be old school thinking and a habit that is hard to break, but for now, I'm sticking with them as they are really not doing any harm. I suppose the weight(which is minimal could be a consideration as well as time in a race to remove the cap and screw it back on).

  4. #4
    hors category TandemGeek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Posts
    7,143
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Originally posted by bandaidman
    what are the advantages of "tubeless" tires...
    The primary advantage is eliminating pinch flats which account for the vast majority of the flats experienced by aggressive off-road cyclists. Moreover, with the vulnerability to pinch flats virtually eliminated, off-road riders can safely run lower tire pressures which can improve traction in soft, muddy or sandy soil conditions. However, there are some practical limits to how low you can go. There are also purportedly some other "performance related benefits" but they are neglible for the average cyclist regardless of what the marketing guys will print.

    Originally posted by bandaidman
    [B]i have heard they do not hold air as long...if that is true ....why?[B]
    To a certain extent, it is true that tubeless tires bleed down a bit faster than a butyl rubber inner tube. Of course, so do latex tubes. Just remember to check your tire pressure before each ride or between race events relative to 'Normal' leakage. However, keep in mind that tubeless tires are very different than conventional bicycle tires in that you need to get the tires to properly seal on the rim before they'll hold air. Much like an automobile's tubeless tire, you need to make sure the surface of the tire and rim are both clean, ensure a good coating of soapy water is applied to the beads of the tires (although any type of water will do in a pinch), and then over-inflate the tire to ensure a tight seal is formed. Any dirt, grit, grime or a break in the seal will cause leaks. The latter is one of the constraints on how low you can run the tire pressure. If it gets too low the likelihood of having the tire "shift" on the rim increases and in addition to breaking the seal you can also drag grit into the seal area which will result in a leak.

    Originally posted by bandaidman
    while i find it a pain to change out a tube on a road bike tire...what do you do if you have a flat with a tubeless mtb tire (i am unsure if there are tubeless road tires)???
    You cuss a lot. Field repair of a tubeless tire is not it's strong point. Carry a spare inner tube and use it if you flat your tubeless. Trying to get a good seal "in the wild" isn't an easy thing to do and remember, you've got to get the tube's tire pressure high enough to get a good "POP" and seal. As for fixing the puncture, once you're back home go ahead and apply your patch. A tubeless tire's liner is repaired with a tire patch in the same way that you fix a butyl tire, it's just inside out. Then, it's a matter of cleaning the tire and rim surfaces, applying your soapy water and reinstalling the tire without the tube.

    Keep in mind, if you don't have a lot of pinch flats and find that you more often than not are the victim of a puncture (i.e., thorns, cactus needles, nails, etc...) tubeless tire technology is not going to help you. Manufacturers will cite "self-healing" qualities but they're overstated. A tubeless tire won't "pop" or go flat nearly as fast a punctured tube; however, they'll still loose air and require a patch.

    Bottom Line on Tubeless: If you'd like to ride with lower air pressure and are usually taken out of a race or put down on a recreational ride by a pinch flat, tubeless tire technology and the associated cost premium may well be worth it for you. If you find that you're pulling thorns out of your tires and patching tubes and have never even considered that you aren't getting enough traction they may not be a good value.

    Originally posted by bandaidman
    do you put valve caps on those little valves????
    Presta Valves - No. No longer own bikes that use Schrader Valves but if I did I'd still use them to keep the dirt from getting into the valve opening.

  5. #5
    feros ferio John E's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    www.ci.encinitas.ca.us
    My Bikes
    1959 Capo; 1980 Peugeot PKN-10; 1981 Bianchi; 1988 Schwinn KOM-10;
    Posts
    14,357
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I use Prestas almost exclusively. I suppose Presta caps offer a small amount of protection, but I tend not to use them, because a cap can cause a slightly bent valve stem to leak.
    "Early to bed, early to rise. Work like hell, and advertise." -- George Stahlman
    Capo [dschaw'-poe]: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger, S/N 42624
    Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
    Bianchi: 1981 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
    Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    St Louis, Missouri
    Posts
    91
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I used to sponsor a pretty good mountain bike racer who raced expert class. Before tubeless tires, he would average one pinch flat per race. Fortunately, his competition was plagued with the same issue. The time that it took him to repair the flat basically determined his whole race result. No pinch flat = good result, pinch flat = bad result.

    Tubeless tires overnight made a huge change in expert class mountain bike raceing. Suddenly there were no pinch flats because there were no tubes to pinch. If you wanted to be competitive, you had to have them.

    On the other hand, they don't affect my personal riding one little bit. I use somewhat higher air pressures on my mountain bike than the experts use and I don't hit the bumps anywhere near as hard and fast as they do. Consequently, I don't get pinch flats very often anyway.

    I find tubeless tires to be a serious pain in the neck to install. If you ride as hard and fast as the expert class racers do, they are an obvious unfair advantage that you can't afford to do without. For guys like me, I don't think they are worth the trouble.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •