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Old 12-26-07, 03:21 PM   #1
MichelleMachete
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Whats up with these rims?

A customer at my shop bought a new road bike from us 2 month ago, since then he's been coming in for routine check ups, we've been finding particles of aluminum in his brake shoes and pick em out we also have to sand the hell out of the rims braking surface(front and rear) this costing us a lot in labor. Any suggestions?
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Old 12-26-07, 03:28 PM   #2
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make a model of rim, brake, and brake shoes please

could be ceramic pads on non ceramic rims for all we know
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Old 12-26-07, 03:39 PM   #3
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A customer at my shop bought a new road bike from us 2 month ago, since then he's been coming in for routine check ups, we've been finding particles of aluminum in his brake shoes and pick em out we also have to sand the hell out of the rims braking surface(front and rear) this costing us a lot in labor. Any suggestions?
Either cheap pads or what #2 said.
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Old 12-26-07, 04:07 PM   #4
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Sounds to me like there's something embedded in the pads (sand?).

Try swapping them out; you must have a set of "take-offs" lying around the shop somewhere.
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Old 12-26-07, 05:08 PM   #5
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reynolds alta comp aero, shimano 105 cartridge brake shoes.
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Old 12-26-07, 05:12 PM   #6
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Yeah I already swapped the shoes last weekend, same thing happened.
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Old 12-26-07, 07:05 PM   #7
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Yeah I already swapped the shoes last weekend, same thing happened.
Swap for something other than those...?
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Old 12-26-07, 07:41 PM   #8
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I had bits of aluminum in the brake pads that came on my Tektro caliper. It was weird and none of the mechanics I showed them to knew what was up. Rim is a Mavic CXP-22. Think maybe the groove in the brake surface is the cause? Does your customer have a groove in their rim?
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Old 12-26-07, 07:43 PM   #9
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I had bits of aluminum in the brake pads that came on my Tektro caliper. It was weird and none of the mechanics I showed them to knew what was up. Rim is a Mavic CXP-22. Think maybe the groove in the brake surface is the cause? Does your customer have a groove in their rim?
99.9% of the problem with tektro calieprs and problems like described above is due to the 100% crap pads they come with.
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Old 12-26-07, 07:47 PM   #10
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I remember hearing about a lot of versions/models of Shimano pads that were eating rims and had poor to no braking power in wet conditions. Changing to Kool Stop pads solved the problem...the Salmon versions are probably the best all purpose pads even though they are marketed for wet conditions. Even the el cheapo Bell brake pads don't eat rims...just marks them up with black residue.
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Old 12-26-07, 07:55 PM   #11
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Crap pads as operator said. I run CXP-22s with Ultegra brakes and pads and don't have this problem.
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Old 12-26-07, 09:26 PM   #12
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I remember hearing about a lot of versions/models of Shimano pads that were eating rims and had poor to no braking power in wet conditions.
That was years ago when ceramic rims first came out and Shimano Dura Ace brakes came with ceramic-specific brake pads. These, as you noted, ate aluminum rims quickly and Shimano replaced them almost at once with aluminum compatible pads. The problem went away a long time ago.

To the OP: where is your customer riding? I wonder if he/she is doing a lot of off-road or gravel path riding and the grit from the "road" is what is doing the damage.
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Old 12-26-07, 10:16 PM   #13
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That was years ago when ceramic rims first came out and Shimano Dura Ace brakes came with ceramic-specific brake pads. These, as you noted, ate aluminum rims quickly and Shimano replaced them almost at once with aluminum compatible pads. The problem went away a long time ago.

Dura Ace with ceramic-specific pads weren't the only Shimano pads that caused this problem. The last Shimano pads I used were XT v-brake pads, with standard pads for aluminum rims, and they were absolutely eating up my Mavic rims. I asked a bike shop guy I trust about it and he told me that Shimano was saying these pads needed to be used with Shimano rims with machined brake surfaces or the pads could damage the rims. This made no sense to me, but the guy seemed very sure of what Shimano was saying at the time about the pads. Whatever the case, these were definitely not ceramic-specific pads and they were definitely eating my rims to the point that if I had ridden them more than a few rides I think the rims would have been toast. Needless to say, I got rid of them ASAP.

This was six or seven years ago, I think, and as I said I haven't used Shimano pads since then so I don't know what the XT pads are like now. But I vote Kool Stop for rim friendly pads, with the salmons being the best among the Kool Stop compounds-

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Old 12-26-07, 10:57 PM   #14
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I too have run into this, actually many times with various brake/rim combos. Soft aluminum + hard, abrasive brake pads can cause small bits of aluminum to catch. I rarely had the problem after I first switched to the then new Mavic S.U.P welded rims, as there was no seam anymore, however if it was gritty enough out it would happen occasionally on high speed descents. I just flicked the bits out with a file or a metal scribe or the like and went about my riding. Honestly, your customer could be educated that this does "just happen" sometimes, and then teach him/her how to maintain the rims and pads. There is a limit to just how much "free service" a shop needs to put out, simple maintenance is the owners responsibility, in my opinion at least.
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Old 12-26-07, 11:11 PM   #15
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time for Koolstop Salmon.
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Old 12-26-07, 11:16 PM   #16
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Original brakes on my Trek were picking up chunks of the Alex rims. I switched over to DuraAce pads, no more aluminum in the pads, and stopping power is much better.
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Old 12-27-07, 06:07 AM   #17
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Sounds like the pads are harder than the rim which is bassackwards.

I'd vote Kool-Stop, which I've been using for several years now. But at the risk of offending "Style-Man", I use the Salmon (wet weather) pads in the front, and the Black (all-purpose) in the back. The colors may not match, but I'm covered no matter what the weather brings. The Black are definitely softer than the Salmon, though.

Bob
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Old 12-27-07, 07:06 AM   #18
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Sounds like the pads are harder than the rim which is bassackwards.

I'd vote Kool-Stop, which I've been using for several years now. But at the risk of offending "Style-Man", I use the Salmon (wet weather) pads in the front, and the Black (all-purpose) in the back. The colors may not match, but I'm covered no matter what the weather brings. The Black are definitely softer than the Salmon, though.

Bob
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Old 12-27-07, 01:05 PM   #19
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Dura Ace with ceramic-specific pads weren't the only Shimano pads that caused this problem. The last Shimano pads I used were XT v-brake pads, with standard pads for aluminum rims, and they were absolutely eating up my Mavic rims. I asked a bike shop guy I trust about it and he told me that Shimano was saying these pads needed to be used with Shimano rims with machined brake surfaces or the pads could damage the rims. This made no sense to me, but the guy seemed very sure of what Shimano was saying at the time about the pads. Whatever the case, these were definitely not ceramic-specific pads and they were definitely eating my rims to the point that if I had ridden them more than a few rides I think the rims would have been toast. Needless to say, I got rid of them ASAP.

This was six or seven years ago, I think, and as I said I haven't used Shimano pads since then so I don't know what the XT pads are like now. But I vote Kool Stop for rim friendly pads, with the salmons being the best among the Kool Stop compounds-
This is the first I've heard that Shimano pads, other than the ceramic-specific Dura Ace, causing problems. I wonder if the same compound made it into their early V-brake pads?

I've used regular Dura Ace and Ultegra road pads for years with out problems on Mavic and Sun Metal rims so I can't say my experience has been bad with them. I do use Kool-Stop Salmons now but not because the Shimano pads were damaging.
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Old 12-27-07, 01:10 PM   #20
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I'll try the Salmons, and check with ya'll later about them.

Cheers,
Michelle
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