Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Bicycle Mechanics Broken bottom bracket? Tacoed wheel? If you're having problems with your bicycle, or just need help fixing a flat, drop in here for the latest on bicycle mechanics & bicycle maintenance.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-11-08, 08:57 AM   #1
wharfrat
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
wharfrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Bikes: LeMond Etape, Specialized Allez
Posts: 258
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
1" threaded to 1 1/8" threadless

I have an older mountain bike that appears to have a 1" threaded headset set-up ( designed to look like a 1 1/8 style ) and I'd like to convert to 1 1/8 threadless. I have a Surly 1 X 1 rigid fork, Cane Creek headset, all the spacer hardware, and an Easton EA50 stem ... and would like to use them on this older (early 90's) bike. Are they interchangeable or are the headseat sizes (dia) different (<---always)? If it wasn't so cold out right now, I'd go out and start removing a few things and putting the calipers and ruler to it... It's about 5 above out right now and the garage is mighty frosty to work comfortably. Any ideas about this? Thanks...

Edit: The old bike headset (frame) measures dang close to the outside dia of a newer bike with a 1 1/8 arrangement SO...I was wondering if it is not gonna work in ALL cases? Probably so but, just curious.

Last edited by wharfrat; 02-11-08 at 10:02 AM.
wharfrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 09:32 AM   #2
rhenning
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 2,555
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 34 Post(s)
You are stuck with 1" size unless you modify the the frame of your bike by replacing the head tube. As a retired shop teacher 1" and 1 1/8" are not the same size. Roger
rhenning is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 09:54 AM   #3
wharfrat
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
wharfrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Bikes: LeMond Etape, Specialized Allez
Posts: 258
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhenning View Post
You are stuck with 1" size unless you modify the the frame of your bike by replacing the head tube. As a retired shop teacher 1" and 1 1/8" are not the same size. Roger
Are you implying that's a dumb a** question? LOL (kidding) As an engineer I'd have to concur...generally speaking. What I wasn't sure of is if the headset arrangement/lock rings/etc. somehow necked down the opening the extra dia. allowing for a 1" headset...AND, if removed, would the opening in fact be larger to accomodate a 1 1/8" threadless fork/set. I haven't had it apart *AND* if you just do a quick-and-dirty test and put the old Mitoya digital caliper on the headset (frame tube body) of the old bike and compare it to a 2007 Motobacane frame that has a 1 1/8 set-up... They are approx. the same dia. +/- .004. I don't understand that and that is what peaked my curiosity (without putting tools to it and finding out with a true inside dia. read. If you could see the headset, it doesn't look like say....an old 1" quill stem headset. I wasn't sure if this would apply in all circumstances. I take it it does by your response. Thanks!


B.S. CEE 1990
M.S. CS 1992
Ph.D CS 2001
wharfrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 10:17 AM   #4
Retro Grouch 
Senior Member
 
Retro Grouch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: St Peters, Missouri
Bikes: Catrike 559 I own some others but they don't get ridden very much.
Posts: 26,912
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 212 Post(s)
It sounds to me like you've done the preliminaries. I think that you're going to have to take it apart for an internal measurement or trial fit to know for sure.
Retro Grouch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 10:34 AM   #5
wharfrat
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
wharfrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Bikes: LeMond Etape, Specialized Allez
Posts: 258
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retro Grouch View Post
It sounds to me like you've done the preliminaries. I think that you're going to have to take it apart for an internal measurement or trial fit to know for sure.

I think you are absolutely right. Strange. Until I came across this situation, I would have thought ( as was sugested to me above ) that each were distinctive sizes. This got me to thinking I could be wrong in some circumstances so, I put it out there. Thanks to all again.

Last edited by wharfrat; 02-11-08 at 11:03 AM.
wharfrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 11:12 AM   #6
SweetLou
Senior Member
 
SweetLou's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 2,114
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Are you sure the quill stem is a 1"? A 1 1/8" quill stem was also made, not very common, but made.
SweetLou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 11:33 AM   #7
Retro Grouch 
Senior Member
 
Retro Grouch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: St Peters, Missouri
Bikes: Catrike 559 I own some others but they don't get ridden very much.
Posts: 26,912
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 212 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by SweetLou View Post
Are you sure the quill stem is a 1"? A 1 1/8" quill stem was also made, not very common, but made.
Yeah. I'm also thinking there used to be a "devaluation" headset to adapt a 1" fork onto an 1 1/8" frame.
Retro Grouch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 11:43 AM   #8
cman
Senior Member
 
cman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Boise,ID
Bikes:
Posts: 517
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retro Grouch View Post
Yeah. I'm also thinking there used to be a "devaluation" headset to adapt a 1" fork onto an 1 1/8" frame.
http://www.chrisking.com/headsets/hds_devo.html
or this for alot cheaper
http://www.choppersus.com/store/prod...1-1-8-to-1%22/
cman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 11:49 AM   #9
wharfrat
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
wharfrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Bikes: LeMond Etape, Specialized Allez
Posts: 258
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retro Grouch View Post
Yeah. I'm also thinking there used to be a "devaluation" headset to adapt a 1" fork onto an 1 1/8" frame.
It sure looks like it's just 1". I haven't taken it out and measured it. However, I did put the calipers on it right at the uppermost lock ring and got 0.998 so I figured it was. Probably the only way to take the guesswork out of it is just rip 'er apart and go to town measuring the inside dia. of the head tube.. I would have already if it wasn't so cold out. I'm being a sis and staying in where it's warm. (Floridain transplanted to midwest..not used to below zero wind chill and 10 degree garage temps) This was helpful info though. It makes it worth exploring further. I just took an uneducated guess that maybe there was some kind of adapting going on since the outside head tube actually measures the same as one w/ 1 1/8 fork. Just knowing it's a possibility.....
wharfrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 11:57 AM   #10
go1dens4
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 87
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quil adaptor

if you want to use a 1 1/8 stem on a 1' quil you can get an adaptor part at nashbar and many other sites just search it, i know one of my friends did that when i sold him some OS bars because they dont make too many quil stems with OS clamps. But the adaptor will deff work if this is all you are looking for
go1dens4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 11:58 AM   #11
thehammerdog
Senior Member
 
thehammerdog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: NWNJ
Bikes: Road bike is a Carbon Bianchi C2C & Grandis (1980's), Gary Fisher Mt Bike, Trek Tandem & Mongoose SS MTB circa 1992.
Posts: 2,100
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 11 Post(s)
It is an East $10 repair

you can buy a 1" to 1/18 converter thingy. Slide it into the 1" threaded tighten down now you have a1 1/8 thread less. Go on line to any mail oprder bike parts company they cost about $10-20. I got on last year for an old bike. works great but heavy
thehammerdog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 12:00 PM   #12
rlaliberty
doooooom
 
rlaliberty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Keene, NH
Bikes:
Posts: 83
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
+1 on an adapter. granted, i do prefer threadless but its a far easier solution than a new headtube.
rlaliberty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 12:11 PM   #13
Rustyspokes
Newbie
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Nottingham, UK
Bikes:
Posts: 3
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
If you measured the outside diameter of your quill stem and it was 1", then you already have a 1 1/8 headset. A 1" headset would have had a 7/8" stem dia. You didn't say exactly what it was that you measured, but if you were using calipers just above the lockring, I can't see what else you could have been applying them to!

Last edited by Rustyspokes; 02-11-08 at 12:45 PM.
Rustyspokes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 01:18 PM   #14
rogerstg
Fred-ish
 
rogerstg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Rhode Island
Bikes:
Posts: 1,800
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rustyspokes View Post
If you measured the outside diameter of your quill stem and it was 1", then you already have a 1 1/8 headset. A 1" headset would have had a 7/8" stem dia. You didn't say exactly what it was that you measured, but if you were using calipers just above the lockring, I can't see what else you could have been applying them to!
+1
That's what I was thinking while going through the thread.

The OP can still get an adapter to convert to threadless. He just needs the 1 1/8" instead of the 1".
rogerstg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 01:41 PM   #15
Little Darwin
The Improbable Bulk
 
Little Darwin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Wilkes-Barre, PA
Bikes: Many
Posts: 8,402
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
I would concur that whatever the OP measured makes a big difference.

My 2003 Giant Sedona DX had 1 - 1/8 threaded, with a quill stem. I replaced the fork and headeet, and now run 1 - 1/8 threadless.

I am ambivalent in the threaded vs threadless question. However, in choosing a rigid fork, I didn't have to be picky about steerer tube length, which is why I made the change to threadless when I replaaced the fork.
Little Darwin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 02:41 PM   #16
dobber
Perineal Pressurized
 
dobber's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: In Ebritated
Bikes:
Posts: 6,557
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Don't confuse the 1 1/8" threadless stem with a quill stem for a 1 1/8" steerer. Two different beasts.

A 1 1/8" quill stem has an outside diameter of 25.4mm (1"), it fits inside the steerer with will measure 1 1/8" on the outside. If this is what you have then your bike is a candidate for replacing the current setup with a threadless 1 1/8" setup.

AASHTA (http://sheldonbrown.com/harris/stems/1-1-8-quill.html)
__________________
This is Africa, 1943. War spits out its violence overhead and the sandy graveyard swallows it up. Her name is King Nine, B-25, medium bomber, Twelfth Air Force. On a hot, still morning she took off from Tunisia to bomb the southern tip of Italy. An errant piece of flak tore a hole in a wing tank and, like a wounded bird, this is where she landed, not to return on this day, or any other day.
dobber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 02:48 PM   #17
Svr
Senior Member
 
Svr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 1,223
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by wharfrat View Post
It sure looks like it's just 1". I haven't taken it out and measured it. However, I did put the calipers on it right at the uppermost lock ring and got 0.998 so I figured it was.
Measure the flats on the top hex nut. 30/32mm = 1" , 35/36mm = 1 1/8" , 40mm = 1 1/4"
Svr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-08, 04:33 PM   #18
SweetLou
Senior Member
 
SweetLou's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 2,114
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I agree with the above, if you measured .998" then you have a 1 1/8" stem. The measurement for a quill stem is the outside diameter of the steerer tube, not the actual size of the quill stem. As mentioned above, my 1" quill stems actually measure 7/8". This sometimes causes confusion when buying a new quill.

You should be good to go with your conversion.
SweetLou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-08, 07:14 AM   #19
wharfrat
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
wharfrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Bikes: LeMond Etape, Specialized Allez
Posts: 258
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by dobber View Post
Don't confuse the 1 1/8" threadless stem with a quill stem for a 1 1/8" steerer. Two different beasts.

A 1 1/8" quill stem has an outside diameter of 25.4mm (1"), it fits inside the steerer with will measure 1 1/8" on the outside. If this is what you have then your bike is a candidate for replacing the current setup with a threadless 1 1/8" setup.

AASHTA (http://sheldonbrown.com/harris/stems/1-1-8-quill.html)
Thanks a million for pointing that out and for the ref. to the link. Once again...Sheldon's site has exactly the info I was looking for. He sure will be missed.
wharfrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:27 AM.