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  1. #1
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    Horizontal drop-outs prob

    Hi all,

    My Fuji Touring has horizontal drop-outs at the rear that causes the wheel to become unaligned running more towards the non-driveside side. My LBS told me basically to just do it up as tight as i can and suck it up, but it always moves until it gets to an off-centre point that it's happy with.

    Is there any other solution other than sucking it up?

    Cheers,

    Damo

  2. #2
    NeoRetroGrouch
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    Get a good, steel, old-style quick release with the cam on the inside. - TF

  3. #3
    Fred-ish rogerstg's Avatar
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    1. Make sure the exposed axle is shorter than the thickness of the dropout material.
    2. Find another LBS

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by rogerstg View Post
    1. Make sure the exposed axle is shorter than the thickness of the dropout material.
    2. Find another LBS
    +2. And, as noted above, be sure to use a good quality (Shimano or Campy are the best) internal cam qr with a steel axle. If you have one of the boutique external cam skewers that is probably your problem. Also, clean up the dropout faces and be sure they are dry and free of grease or oil.

    I have an older Trek with horizontal dropouts and the rear wheel NEVER moves. But, it has a Shimano qr skewer thghtened firmly and the axle is short enough to be completely inside the dropout faces.

  5. #5
    Senior Member anti.team's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HillRider View Post
    +2. And, as noted above, be sure to use a good quality (Shimano or Campy are the best) internal cam qr with a steel axle. If you have one of the boutique external cam skewers that is probably your problem. Also, clean up the dropout faces and be sure they are dry and free of grease or oil.

    I have an older Trek with horizontal dropouts and the rear wheel NEVER moves. But, it has a Shimano qr skewer thghtened firmly and the axle is short enough to be completely inside the dropout faces.
    I have an older Trek too, and I was just having this problem yesterday. Discovered the wheel had shifted, so I stopped, realigned it, tightened it up and went. About 100 feet later it had already moved so I took the wheel out, and cleaned all the crap off the dropout (previous ride was in the rain, lots of dirt) and off the QR nut. Things were fine after that.

    I agree with the other posters though, check the condition/style of your skewer. If the skewer body isn't steel or the QR Nut doesn't have steel teeth, replace it.
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  6. #6
    Senior Member BCRider's Avatar
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    Check the inside surface of the dropouts for chewing of the metal. If the axle nut has cut a divot out of the metal it may be that it will tend to fall forward into that relief more easily now.

    I used to get a little bit of shifting on my single so I finally changed to a solid axle with nuts. No more slipping now.
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  7. #7
    is slower than you Peek the Geek's Avatar
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  8. #8
    Member lamberticus's Avatar
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    I am having similar problems the horizontal dropouts on my roadbike. It sounds like people are mostly agreeing that a steel Shimano or Campy internal cam QR is the way to go here. I am wondering if it is worth buying something like a Shimano Dura-Ace 7800 rear skewer, or if something cheaper will more than suffice. I have seen something called "Shimano Steel Skewers" at Universal cycles for about $11, versus the 7800 for $44. A little added weight isn't really an issue for me.

  9. #9
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    ANY Shimano or Campy skewer will be fine. The DA weight difference is minor.

  10. #10
    Senior Member cman's Avatar
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    As always.....Sheldon has written about it
    http://www.sheldonbrown.com/skewers.html

  11. #11
    Member lamberticus's Avatar
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    I picked up a used steel Sakae QR for like $6 that hopefully will work well on my horizontal drops. Thanks folks.

  12. #12
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    Hey Peek! What is that gadget, how does it work, and where can it be purchased?

    Regards,
    Bob P.

  13. #13
    You Know!? For Kids! jsharr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Pringle View Post
    Hey Peek! What is that gadget, how does it work, and where can it be purchased?

    Regards,
    Bob P.
    http://www.surlybikes.com/parts/tuggnut_pop.html

    http://www.63xc.com/rickc/tuggnuts.htm
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  14. #14
    is slower than you Peek the Geek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Pringle View Post
    Hey Peek! What is that gadget, how does it work, and where can it be purchased?

    Regards,
    Bob P.
    It's a chain tensioner (the one pictured above is made by Surly and called the Tuggnut). They keep the chain from pulling the axle forward in the dropout. When installed, it looks like this:



    Usually you only need one for the drive side. Various online retailers sell the Tuggnut, but like everything else Surly it is overpriced because of the brand name. Basic tensioners are regularly used on BMX bikes, so any bike shop that stocks BMX stuff should be able to sell you one for 10 bucks or so (though you'll want to make sure it fits your specific bike).

    I use these on my singlespeed mountain bike, and I bought them at my LBS:


  15. #15
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    Thanks for the info, Peek and Jsharr! I doubt that these would work on my old Schwinn 12-speed (converted to 9-speed with a quick-release hub) but they provide grist for my imagination.

    Regards,
    Bob P.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by lamberticus View Post
    I picked up a used steel Sakae QR for like $6 that hopefully will work well on my horizontal drops. Thanks folks.
    You could've bought a new Shimano AL QR of the highest quality for $6.
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  17. #17
    cab horn
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peek the Geek View Post
    It's a chain tensioner (the one pictured above is made by Surly and called the Tuggnut). They keep the chain from pulling the axle forward in the dropout. When installed, it looks like this:



    Usually you only need one for the drive side. Various online retailers sell the Tuggnut, but like everything else Surly it is overpriced because of the brand name. Basic tensioners are regularly used on BMX bikes, so any bike shop that stocks BMX stuff should be able to sell you one for 10 bucks or so (though you'll want to make sure it fits your specific bike).

    I use these on my singlespeed mountain bike, and I bought them at my LBS:

    The OP has horizontal dropouts, not track ends. The Surly tugnut will not work.

    Tugnuts are not meant to "keep the chain from pulling the axle forward", that's the job of the tracknut/qr. It just so happens to prevent the axle from slipping forward in the odd time that it slips because you didn't tighten the nut enough.
    Mes compaingnons cui j'amoie et cui j'aim,... Me di, chanson.

  18. #18
    is slower than you Peek the Geek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by operator View Post
    The OP has horizontal dropouts, not track ends. The Surly tugnut will not work.
    You're right. I misinterpreted the initial post as referring to track ends. My bad.

    Quote Originally Posted by operator View Post
    to prevent the axle from slipping forward in the odd time that it slips because you didn't tighten the nut enough.
    In which case, the Tugnut [sic] would indeed keep the chain from pulling the axle forward.

    EDIT: And while it is the job of the nut/QR to keep the axle in place, I'm sure you're aware that it's not totally uncommon for axles on some bikes to slip despite the nut being tightened. But we're just splitting hairs, aren't we.
    Last edited by Peek the Geek; 03-19-08 at 06:43 PM.

  19. #19
    cab horn
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peek the Geek View Post

    EDIT: And while it is the job of the nut/QR to keep the axle in place, I'm sure you're aware that it's not totally uncommon for axles on some bikes to slip despite the nut being tightened. But we're just splitting hairs, aren't we.
    The distincition is subtle, but crucial.
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  20. #20
    Carpe Diem bdcheung's Avatar
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    So is there any solution? I've got a Surly Crosscheck with front-facing semi-horizontal drops and I've slipped my wheel quite a few times...
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  21. #21
    GATC
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Pringle View Post
    Thanks for the info, Peek and Jsharr! I doubt that these would work on my old Schwinn 12-speed (converted to 9-speed with a quick-release hub) but they provide grist for my imagination.

    Regards,
    Bob P.
    Tuggnut won't work w/ those dropouts, as has been mentioned. For my wife's 12-spd Schwinn, I just tighten the bejeezus out of the QR nut before flipping the skewer. I wonder a teeny bit about squeezing the hub ends, but it keeps working so far.

    It is a non-Shimano skewer but the cam is internal to the overall mechanism. A real-live Shimano one might work better, tough to say.

  22. #22
    Low car diet JiveTurkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdcheung View Post
    So is there any solution? I've got a Surly Crosscheck with front-facing semi-horizontal drops and I've slipped my wheel quite a few times...
    See the first three replies to the original post.
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  23. #23
    Carpe Diem bdcheung's Avatar
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    a beefier QR huh... I guess I was hoping for something more complicated.
    "When you are chewing the bars at the business end of a 90 mile road race you really dont care what gear you have hanging from your bike so long as it works."
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  24. #24
    Senior Member Steev's Avatar
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    Cleaning the cam end of the quick release and a light oil on the cam part (not the clamping faces) makes a big difference. Way better clamping pressure with less lever force. I clean mine by swirling it around in a bath of mineral spirits, being sure to drain the dissolved gunk out.

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