Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Bicycle Mechanics Broken bottom bracket? Tacoed wheel? If you're having problems with your bicycle, or just need help fixing a flat, drop in here for the latest on bicycle mechanics & bicycle maintenance.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 05-22-08, 11:36 PM   #1
Jacjetlag
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: May 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
@008 Trek Madone Bottom Bracket Update...

Hi all...

My first post this forum, but I searched to see if this has been talked about much.

I'm building a new Madone that is coming as a bare frame. The "bottom bracket" no longer exists , per se.
There are bearing sockets integral to the frame itself. The outside diameter of any bearing used must be 37mm to fit in the socket. The inside diameter will vary with the crankset used. It turns out Trek sells washer/bushing kits for the bigger group manufacturers like Shimano , Campy ,Sram and of course Bontrager. The others BB kits aren't spec'd out or available just yet. FSA is working on ther own "BB90" (90mm wide)kit that will be available in a "few weeks". There are some ceramic bearing manufacturers like Boca , Enduro, et al, who sell cartridge bearings ($60 ish) that will work ,37mm(OD) x 24 or 25(ID) x 6 or 7 deep.The install kits Trek sells must have a tube of socket primer and lock-tite to keep the bearing from spinning in the socket. It seems simple but still has to be done correctly.

I called Trek, FSA , the bearing guys, and spent waaay too much time on the internet. I think I found out what I needed to know ,so I bought a Campy Ultra Torque crank (it has to have an axle like the newer 2 piece cranks do that take outboard bearings) and some ceramic bearings.

If I'm off base about any of this, please set the record straight so we can all share accurate information.
Hopefully it will save somebody the time to research all this stuff.
Jacjetlag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-08, 02:37 AM   #2
Matt Gaunt
Senior Member
 
Matt Gaunt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: London, UK
Bikes:
Posts: 2,245
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Someone educate me on this subject - do Trek make proprietary sized BB shells nowadays? Surely not.

Is the OP's problem that he/she needs a crank that has an axle long enough to accommodate the 90mm shell?

Not for the first time on BF, I'm lost.
__________________
Matt
2010 Kinesis Decade Convert2 Alloy fixie, Miche, Sora Pics soon...
2008 Kinesis RC2 Scandium/Carbon Road, Ultegra, Ksyrium Elites Pics
2007 Kinesis Pha5e Scandium hardtail, XT, Revelations, Rockets, M4s, Mavics Pics
2005 Kinesis RC Scandium/Carbon Road, Ultegra, Ksyrium SLs Pics
1996 Raleigh Max Steel, Deore XT, SRAM Attack shifters, homemade wheels Pics
Matt Gaunt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-08, 06:13 AM   #3
HillRider 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Bikes: '''96 Litespeed Catalyst, '05 Litespeed Firenze, '06 Litespeed Tuscany, '12 Surly Pacer, All are 3x8,9 or 10. It is hilly around here!
Posts: 28,918
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 96 Post(s)
The '08 Trek Madone has a large diameter, wider bottom bracket shell that uses the same bearings as "external bearing" bottom brackets (Shimano Hollowtech II, Campy UT, etc.) but dispenses with the threaded-in cups and accepts the bearing cartridges directly into molded recesses in the shell itself. It's semi-proprietary as it uses the same bearings as the crank makers but doesn't need the bearing cups.
HillRider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-08, 09:50 PM   #4
Jacjetlag
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: May 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The thing that has changed is what the bearings actually sit upon. They are not housed within a bottom bracket that is screwed into the frame. Trek calls them "precision fit sockets" on the frame surface itself.

You can use the regular bearings that came with the newer two piece cranks , but Trek really dings you for the primer($15) and the loc-tite ($20) as well as a bushing kit for another 20 bucks. Those few trivial install bits add up to guess what?
Nearly the cost of a bottom bracket............brilliant!
Jacjetlag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-19-08, 08:31 AM   #5
synergy08
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 2
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
so what did you end up getting? I just picked up a 08 Madone 6.9 and want ceramic bearings. I am also running Campy Groupo. (currently have the botrager cranks on until I get the ceramics for the campy)
What size did you end up ordering? 37mm x 25? 6 or 7 mm deep? Did you still need the trek shim/spacer kit? Please help! Thanks
synergy08 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-19-08, 08:46 AM   #6
fosmith
my brain hurts!
 
fosmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Oak Knoll
Bikes: Numerous bicycles.
Posts: 680
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
you WILL need the kit from Trek. for ultra torque, you need to loctite the aluminum rings into the shell and then have the spacers inboard of the bearings. wavy spring washer goes on non-drive crank arm. you will need Loctite 638 and the primer. should be able to find that somewhere else, if needed. be sure to let the rings cure for 24 hours before riding.
fosmith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-08, 10:03 AM   #7
Jacjetlag
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: May 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
FO.....

Excellent scoop there. I am still awaiting my kit from Trek. They just shipped 178 Campy kits last week ,alas ,
I am about #200 on the list. By their own admission, they misjudged demand on the upper end where Campy has a niche. Most of the kits went to Europe. I bought the Boca 37X27X6 for Ultra Torque. On the Boca site , they list the 37x27x7 specific to the new Madone , I'm not sure, but I belkieve that is really for Shimano/Bontrager/ SRAM.

One has to wonder about that wavy washer business.....when the tolerances aren't exactly right, does the wavy washer correct things ? Sounds a bit sloppy to me.

FSA will have their "BB90" kit for their cranks out in about 1 week.

Jack
Jacjetlag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-08, 10:06 AM   #8
Jacjetlag
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: May 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
One more thing....Trek sells the primer for $14.99 and the loc-tite for $14.99. YES you can find that elsewhere for a lot less.
Jacjetlag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-30-08, 02:34 PM   #9
vladpop
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Is the primer and locktite required only if fitting in other bearings / cranks or also for regular maintenance of the original Enduro sealed bearings? After riding my 2008 Madone 5.2 for about a year I was able to simply pop it out without much resistance, regrease it and pop it back in. Am I missing something?
vladpop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-30-08, 09:00 PM   #10
z415
Senior Member
 
z415's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Gainesville/Tampa, FL
Bikes: Trek 1000, two mtbs and working on a fixie for commuting.
Posts: 2,343
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by HillRider View Post
The '08 Trek Madone has a large diameter, wider bottom bracket shell that uses the same bearings as "external bearing" bottom brackets (Shimano Hollowtech II, Campy UT, etc.) but dispenses with the threaded-in cups and accepts the bearing cartridges directly into molded recesses in the shell itself. It's semi-proprietary as it uses the same bearings as the crank makers but doesn't need the bearing cups.
Yup, I was fiddling with one at the Tampa Trek Store and it looks sweet. They told me it was proprietary though. Kind of makes it look like the bb shell and the crank are one.
z415 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-31-08, 12:08 PM   #11
HillRider 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Bikes: '''96 Litespeed Catalyst, '05 Litespeed Firenze, '06 Litespeed Tuscany, '12 Surly Pacer, All are 3x8,9 or 10. It is hilly around here!
Posts: 28,918
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 96 Post(s)
Here is Lennard Zinn's description of the various mix-and match for the new crank and bottom bracket types:

http://www.velonews.com/article/8578...k-madone-frame
HillRider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-31-08, 01:29 PM   #12
fosmith
my brain hurts!
 
fosmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Oak Knoll
Bikes: Numerous bicycles.
Posts: 680
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by vladpop View Post
Is the primer and locktite required only if fitting in other bearings / cranks or also for regular maintenance of the original Enduro sealed bearings? After riding my 2008 Madone 5.2 for about a year I was able to simply pop it out without much resistance, regrease it and pop it back in. Am I missing something?
you only need the loctite for the campy adapter rings. Don't loctite the bearings themselves into the frame. not good....
fosmith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-01-09, 08:18 AM   #13
top506
Death fork? Naaaah!!
 
top506's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: The other Maine, north of RT 2
Bikes: '71 Gitane Super Corsa, '73 Atala Giro d'Italia, '73 Schwinn Super Sport, '76 Viscount Aerospace Pro, '81 Miyata 710, '81 Lotus Classique, '84 Ross Signature 290s, '85 Miele Gara, '87 Miyata 512, '89 Centurion Ironman, many more
Posts: 3,761
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacjetlag View Post
The thing that has changed is what the bearings actually sit upon. They are not housed within a bottom bracket that is screwed into the frame. Trek calls them "precision fit sockets" on the frame surface itself.
Isn't this what Lambert/Viscount did 35+ years ago?
Top
__________________
You know it's going to be a good day when the stem and seatpost come right out.
top506 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-09, 06:54 AM   #14
mikyperry
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Bikes:
Posts: 1
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
trek-campy kit

hi .. i am italian and i buy about 3 weeks ago the frame Madone 5.2 and Super Record 11 group but i am still waiting for the BB kit from Comar italia ( italian importer of Trek bikes)
I can find the kit from another way ?????
mikyperry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 05:14 AM   #15
Jacjetlag
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: May 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Miky....

Any Trek dealer in the USA can get one sent to you. The supply problem is solved.


UPDATE: My Trek has been destroyed. It was hit by a drunk driver when I was on it. Two skull fractures and a broken neck. I am all healed up now and lucky to have no permanent disability. A miracle.
Jacjetlag is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:43 AM.