Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Bicycle Mechanics Broken bottom bracket? Tacoed wheel? If you're having problems with your bicycle, or just need help fixing a flat, drop in here for the latest on bicycle mechanics & bicycle maintenance.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 05-25-08, 11:51 AM   #1
bellweatherman
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
bellweatherman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Austin
Bikes: Too many to count
Posts: 2,103
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Having an incredibly hard time removing old-style cup-and-cone bottom bracket.

I am having one hell of a time removing the bottom bracket from an old 1980s Trek frame. The bottom bracket is an older style cup-and-cone bottom bracket. I have tried everything, and I'm not sure if the bottom bracket isn't just rusted or seized into the frame. Even the bb spindle won't rotate.

I am using a Hozan lockring spanner wrench, and I have tried to remove the left-side lockring, but it just will not loosen. I am turning the non-drive lockring counterclockwise to try and loosen, but it won't budge. It's been awhile since I've worked on these and my understanding is to remove completely the left (non-drive) lockring and cup first before proceeding to the removal of the drive-side lockring and cup. Any ideas???


bellweatherman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-08, 02:10 PM   #2
ridingdirty
Junior Member
 
ridingdirty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Eugene, OR
Bikes: '90 Specialized Rockhopper, '94 Giant Rincon, Miyata 1000
Posts: 12
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Try using a screw driver and a hammer to loosen the lock ring. From there, you should be able to remove the adjustable cup. If it is being difficult, try tapping it to free up the rust that may be holding it in place. Remove the fixed cup by rotating clockwise.
ridingdirty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-08, 02:39 PM   #3
wayne pattee
NadaKid
 
wayne pattee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Port Huron, Michigan
Bikes: Schwinn Traveler, Giant Cypress
Posts: 310
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Same here. the adjusting cup on my 90 Schwinn Traveler was froze when I bought it off a guy who had it hung up in his barn for who knows how many years.
Bent the cheap spanner wrench I had so I took it to the LBS and they got it but when I picked it up they were too busy to ask them how they freed it up.
Good luck
wayne pattee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-08, 03:08 PM   #4
Navy_Chief
Gitane GranTour
 
Navy_Chief's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Waynesboro, PA
Bikes:
Posts: 139
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Try some PB Blaster to break any rust and crud loose.
Navy_Chief is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-08, 03:22 PM   #5
Ex Pres
#39
 
Ex Pres's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: the 35223 (AL)
Bikes:
Posts: 6,336
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 48 Post(s)
Your picture shows you loosening it CW, not CCW
Ex Pres is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-08, 03:25 PM   #6
U.V.
it cant rain all the time
 
U.V.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hythe, Kent, England
Bikes: 1 mountain bike, 1 commuter bike, 1 road bike
Posts: 103
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
extreme heat normaly works for me [blow torch]


just be careful....
U.V. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-08, 03:43 PM   #7
kycycler
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Louisville, KY
Bikes: Trek Madone 5.5, Klein Q Pro Elite, Surley LHT
Posts: 469
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Barker View Post
Your picture shows you loosening it CW, not CCW
Looks like that to me also. DO NOT use a screw driver. You will cause more damage than you want. A good penetrating oil and a punch will work. Only use the punch and hammer if absolutely necessary
kycycler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-08, 04:42 PM   #8
cudak888 
www.theheadbadge.com
 
cudak888's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Southern Florida
Bikes: http://www.theheadbadge.com
Posts: 22,746
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
I'll second what has been said here - your photo shows you tightening the lockring, not loosening it.

-Kurt "when in doubt, spin it the other way" K.
__________________
cudak888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-08, 12:55 AM   #9
bellweatherman
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
bellweatherman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Austin
Bikes: Too many to count
Posts: 2,103
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Barker View Post
Your picture shows you loosening it CW, not CCW


Actually, I am trying to loosen the left (non-drive) lockring by turning the Hozan wrench counterclockwise. I know. The pic is deceiving. It's not actually my picture anyway. I just linked to it from Sheldon Brown's website, so that people would have an idea of what style of bb I am trying to remove. Man, my hands hurt so much trying to remove the darn thing and I still can't get it to budge.
bellweatherman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-08, 12:57 AM   #10
bellweatherman
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
bellweatherman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Austin
Bikes: Too many to count
Posts: 2,103
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by kycycler View Post
Looks like that to me also. DO NOT use a screw driver. You will cause more damage than you want. A good penetrating oil and a punch will work. Only use the punch and hammer if absolutely necessary

Ahh! Penetrating oil. Good idea. I think I may give this one a try. Anyone know any good type of penetrating oil besides KY Jelly or Astroglide? The bike shop doesn't seem to stock this stuff, so I may try down at the Home Depot.
bellweatherman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-08, 01:08 AM   #11
StephenH
Uber Goober
 
StephenH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Dallas area, Texas
Bikes:
Posts: 11,324
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
WD 40 is the common brand, sold at Walmart and other fine hardware establishments.

In a case like this, spray it on/in, let it set a day or two, spray some more on, wait a while...don't get in a hurry unless you just need it fixed now. If you're going to disassemble the whole thing anyway, spray a bunch inside the BB assembly if you can, not just on the threads.
__________________
"be careful this rando stuff is addictive and dan's the 'pusher'."
StephenH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-08, 01:21 AM   #12
MudPie
Senior Member
 
MudPie's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Southern California
Bikes:
Posts: 1,874
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bellweatherman View Post
Ahh! Penetrating oil. Good idea. I think I may give this one a try. Anyone know any good type of penetrating oil besides KY Jelly or Astroglide? The bike shop doesn't seem to stock this stuff, so I may try down at the Home Depot.
I use Liquid Wrench brand of penetrating oil. Some swear by PB Blaster, see Navy_Chief above. An auto store or local hardware store should have a decent selection of penetrating oils.
MudPie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-08, 02:34 AM   #13
dabac
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 5,682
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
If the bb spindle isn't even rotating don't worry too much about damaging stuff, as there isn't anything you can do that'll make the bike any less rideable right now.
And unless there's something very special about that lockring its an easily (and cheaply) replaceable item.
If nothing else seems to work, cut it off.

Then as the others say - patience, penetrating oil, heat, and carefully applied violence.
One thing you might add quite far down on the list of possible actions is to squeeze/hammer the bb shell against the cups. If the cups have seized due to rust development in the threads, then compressing the bb shell against the cups might be enough to break up the rust so that the cups can be unscrewed.

For a classical square taper cup & cone bb you might just as well pull the DS cup first.
Only downside is that the DS cup is usually the one fighting back, often requiring to be clamped in a vise in order for the mech to be able to use the whole frame for leverage. If the NDS cup is giving you trouble already then that doesn't bode well for the DS cup.
The DS cup can be cleaned, inspected and regreased reasonably well in place, so unless it's damaged it's often easier to leave it in place.
dabac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-08, 06:12 AM   #14
100bikes
Industry guy
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Minnesota
Bikes: To many to name - I ride a custom built steel frame.
Posts: 66
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
There is a plier type lockring tool which will grab the lockring on opposing sides at the same time. It will give you a better grip on the offending ring.
100bikes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-08, 06:33 AM   #15
leob1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Middle of the road, NJ
Bikes:
Posts: 2,613
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 33 Post(s)
All of the above, PB blaster, tapping, heat, THEN put the wrench on and hit the end with a dead-blow hammer. The shock is what will loosen it. Or put the frame on he ground and use your body weight on the wrench.
leob1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-08, 06:38 AM   #16
04jtb
Senior Member
 
04jtb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: West Dorset, UK
Bikes: 1983 Dawes Galaxy, 2006 Raleigh Airlite, 1982 Sun Solo (fixed)
Posts: 908
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I have cut off lockrings before with my dremel
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by cc700 View Post
i jam my thumbs up and back into the tubes. this way i can point my fingers straight out in front to split the wind and attain an even more aero profile, and the usual fixed gear - zen - connectedness feeling through the drivetrain is multiplied ten fold because my thumbs become one with the tubing.
A group for all Dawes Galaxy owners to give and recieve information about them
http://flickr.com/groups/dawes_galaxy/
04jtb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-08, 07:34 AM   #17
jgedwa
surly old man
 
jgedwa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Carlisle, PA
Bikes: IRO Mark V, Karate Monkey half fat, Trek 620 IGH, Cannondale 26/24 MTB, Amp Research B3, and more.
Posts: 3,347
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
You don't need to even bother removing the lock ring. Spend more attention removing the cup, and the lockring with come off with it.

Penetrating oil (not WD-40), time, some mild heat, oil, time, heat, oil, time, heat..... Never seen one yet that will not come out.

BTW, not to be the voice of gloom, but if the adjustable cup is this hard, you are in for a lot of fun with the fixed cup. I think you should just sit the entire BB in a tub of pentrating oil and forget about it for a week.

jim
__________________
Cross Check Nexus7, IRO Mark V, Trek 620 Nexus7, Karate Monkey half fat, IRO Model 19 fixed, Amp Research B3, Surly 1x1 half fat fixed, and more...
--------------------------
SB forever
jgedwa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-30-08, 12:36 AM   #18
bellweatherman
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
bellweatherman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Austin
Bikes: Too many to count
Posts: 2,103
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
HOLY CRAP! I just got the bottom bracket to come off! Thanks for all those that gave some great ideas. In the end, I think what did it for me was patience and soaking if with Liquid Wrench.

I didn't have access to a vise, but I got a 3 foot long metal tube that I placed over the wrench. A friend helped me steady it and after a couple tries, I got it out! I soaked the bb in liquid wrench and tried a little every day. I think eventualy the liquidy stuff worked its way in there, and today was my lucky day.

THANKS EVERYONE!
bellweatherman is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:49 PM.