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Old 05-28-08, 09:17 AM   #1
grinderbob
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How to remove "flushed" BB? no teeth on cups

I got an early 90 bike and it came with a shimano square-tapered compatible BB (marked Taiwan).
The BB is flushed on both side of the BB shell, and there are no teeth on either side of the cup.
How to remove this type of BB from the frame? thanks.
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Old 05-28-08, 09:30 AM   #2
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Can you post a picture?
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Old 05-28-08, 10:02 AM   #3
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without a pic, it's hard to say.

that said, you might wanna look to sheldon's site, specifically, this page, for more info.

he's even got a diy solution that costs a few bucks that takes the place of a specialized (and more expensive) tool.
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Old 05-28-08, 10:13 AM   #4
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Maybe it's a cartridge unit

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/bbsize.html#shimano

does it look like the one on the left?


I went out to buy a hook spanner to fix my old bike once, and when I got back, I found out that it didn't need one, and had a cartirdge unit... silly mistakes I guess
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Old 05-28-08, 10:55 AM   #5
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Scroll down on this page and find the do it yourself tool :
http://sheldonbrown.com/tooltips/bbcups.html

em
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Old 05-28-08, 10:57 AM   #6
grinderbob
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Thanks guys, pictures here.


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Old 05-28-08, 11:15 AM   #7
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Maybe the orange ring pops out? See if you can read the writing on it.

Pics of the other side, please.
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Old 05-28-08, 11:15 AM   #8
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It is a Phil Wood. Are you sure you need to remove it?
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Old 05-28-08, 11:18 AM   #9
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Both sides look the same. The red/orange rings seem to be a rubber seal, but not sure. I tried to extract any reading from the ring, but only found Taiwan on it. I want to switch everything to campy.
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Old 05-28-08, 11:26 AM   #10
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Doesn't look like it's a threaded BB at all. Odd.
It looks more like the bearings are pressed into the BB shell w/ out cups. This is how many current BMX bikes work (look up Spanish or Mid BB).
How us BMXers remove such BBs is this: Tap out the spindle w/ a rubber mallet. Then work some kind of punch into the bb, against the inside of one of the bearings & tap it out. I use an old socket extension for this as it doesn't have a sharp edge to damage the bearings.
Of course, if it ISN'T just the BB pressed into the BB shell, don't do that!
-Bill
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Old 05-28-08, 12:16 PM   #11
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how can I tell it is a press-fit BB? The spindle fits shimano square taper crankset.
Would a good bike mechanic be able to remove it?
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Old 05-28-08, 02:03 PM   #12
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Is that a Klein or Merlin frame? Its my understanding they came with Phil Wood press-in type bottom bracket. Here is a link to Phil Wood....scroll down to the FAQ and there are 2 additional links: One for Klein and one for Merlin frames. Each PDF has details for removing the bearings from what appears to me at least, your type of bottom bracket. It also appears to require special tools. If it were me, I think I'd let a shop handle this one....you sure don't want to make a mistake and screw up the threads.....or maybe the threads are already screwed and thats why the press-in is in there????

All this said, I'm not positive about this, just something you might want to check out. Anyways, good luck.

http://www.philwood.com/ptechinfo.htm
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Old 05-28-08, 03:32 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grinderbob View Post
how can I tell it is a press-fit BB? The spindle fits shimano square taper crankset.
Would a good bike mechanic be able to remove it?
It's a press fit BB. Sure looks like a Klein, should be #6003 bearings in there, which should last just short of forever. Why do you want to take it out?

You are pretty much stuck with square taper cranks, so the only reason to remove it would be to change to a crank that requires a different length spindle or to replace a bearing gone wrong. Your pics look too clean for the bearings to have gone bad.

FInd an old (pre TREK) Klein dealer if you want anything done. They should have the proper tools and may have alternate spindles available. It can be faked, but if you didn't know what you had there, I'm not going to be able to explain the procedure to you.

Good luck

Mel
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Old 05-28-08, 04:15 PM   #14
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Could be a Viscount, too. Those are pressed-in bearings, and there should be little C-clips in there somewhere. Tap one side of the spindle with a dead-blow hammer, and it'll start coming out the other side.
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Old 05-28-08, 05:04 PM   #15
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You guys are good, how did you guys know it's a Klein just by looking at the BB shell?
This square taper spindle is for older shimano crankset (7400 dura ace to be exact).
I plan to switch to campy, that's why I want to take the BB out, and put a campy BB
in there.

I guess the most important question is, is BB shell on the frame threaded for
regular BB, english/italian?



Quote:
Originally Posted by melville View Post
It's a press fit BB. Sure looks like a Klein, should be #6003 bearings in there, which should last just short of forever. Why do you want to take it out?

You are pretty much stuck with square taper cranks, so the only reason to remove it would be to change to a crank that requires a different length spindle or to replace a bearing gone wrong. Your pics look too clean for the bearings to have gone bad.

FInd an old (pre TREK) Klein dealer if you want anything done. They should have the proper tools and may have alternate spindles available. It can be faked, but if you didn't know what you had there, I'm not going to be able to explain the procedure to you.

Good luck

Mel

Last edited by grinderbob; 05-28-08 at 05:13 PM.
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Old 05-28-08, 05:37 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grinderbob View Post
You guys are good, how did you guys know it's a Klein just by looking at the BB shell?
This square taper spindle is for older shimano crankset (7400 dura ace to be exact).
I plan to switch to campy, that's why I want to take the BB out, and put a campy BB
in there.

I guess the most important question is, is BB shell on the frame threaded for
regular BB, english/italian?
Given that it's (most likely a) Phil, why not simply swap the spindle but keep the Phil setup?
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Old 05-28-08, 06:19 PM   #17
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I'll take it to a bike shop. If it indeed is a philwood setup, I'll just get a new spindle to outfit
the campy crankset. or whichever is easier to make the campy switch.
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Old 05-28-08, 06:23 PM   #18
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press fit, no threads.

http://blackmountaincycles.blogspot....sarah-and.html

reset racing makes a klein/octalink bb, serious coin!

http://www.reset-racing.de/reset/innenlager_index1.htm

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Old 05-28-08, 06:34 PM   #19
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you guys are funny. just cause the seals are orange, does _not_ mean it's a phil wood.


by the way, it's NOT a phil wood. phil brackets don't come with bearings made in Taiwan.



grinderbob, the simple answer is this: if the bearings are in good condition then leave the bracket in there. remount the crankset and ride the bike.

if you want to use another crankset that needs a shorter spindle, you'll need to replace the spindle. good luck finding one since these haven't been made since the early 90's if you have the sort of time and money that would allow you to hunt for one, have fun.

lastly, the shell has no threads. clearly. you can tell because the bearings are _pressed_ into the frame.

even if you did remove it, you can't thread the shell cause it's not the right size for any modern brackets sold these days.
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Old 05-28-08, 06:49 PM   #20
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if you want to use another crankset that needs a shorter spindle, you'll need to replace the spindle. good luck finding one since these haven't been made since the early 90's if you have the sort of time and money that would allow you to hunt for one, have fun.
http://www.philwood.com/crank%20axles.htm

For Klein, Merlin, Spectrum, Fat Chance and Fisher Press-fit Bottom Brackets.
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Old 05-28-08, 07:16 PM   #21
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money: $100 for a steel phil wood spindle to put on a bike that's probably worth less than $200?
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Old 05-28-08, 07:55 PM   #22
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money

his money, not yours.
his sense of worth, not yours.

spindle is $79
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Old 05-28-08, 07:59 PM   #23
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I extracted more reading from the red ring: 6003UL, so it is for sure a bearing.
actually philwood is like 3 miles away from me. I'll bring it to them and see whether it is in fact a philwood,
and see how much. worst case is I'll keep the shimano crankset, not the end of the world.

Last edited by grinderbob; 05-28-08 at 10:08 PM.
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Old 05-28-08, 10:02 PM   #24
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Wow, someone reads what I wrote. I've installed a lot of press fit bottom brackets. If you have questions, post 'em and I should be able to help.

And a Klein is usually worth more than a couple hundred bucks.
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Old 05-28-08, 10:45 PM   #25
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actually I would need to have the spindle taken out, I found that the non-drive side is sticking out about 3mm more. I bet whoever put it on had it reversed. The drive side should be 3mm longer.

Anyone know of a cheaper spindle? The 6003 bearings are pretty inexpensive.
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