building wheels
HI.
i am a first timer wheel builder . i have a book ( this one ) and a few wheels laying for reference . I have several questions , but i'll start with this . im like merckx i guess , it has to be perfect or forget it . so with that said . i have laced up the front rim .but i dont think it's correct - i started with all the spoke heads on the outside of the flange on the left side on the rim . i placed the i placed the key spoke to the lef tof the valve stem hole . then every 4th hole i went clock wise .until those were done . then i started on the right side of the rim .and the spoke that is on the left of the vale stem hole , that spokes head is on the inside of the flange. this sint correct is it . the pictures are drawing so no real detail , but if i compare to the other rims i have , one side looks correct and the other side looks correct . as far as spoke placement , but theh heads of the spokes are wrong . while i am typing this i tihnk i just need to rotate the spoke heads on the left side of the rim . Oh my i love this stuff- |
ok well im sry about the post . i re read the book , and it says that symetrical or asymetrical , so what i did was asymetrical , and it didnt look correct but it deosnt matter which 1 you use , i guess then it depends on what you want ,.
i like symetrical |
You don't need a book to learn to build wheels. It's pretty simple really. Some math skills and reading Sheldon's wheelbuilding how-to is all you need.
|
Originally Posted by bellweatherman
(Post 6876960)
You don't need a book to learn to build wheels. It's pretty simple really. Some math skills and reading Sheldon's wheelbuilding how-to is all you need.
|
Originally Posted by Retro Grouch
(Post 6877326)
Math skills? What do you need math skills for?
|
I am not impressed with either the author nor the sentence construction (proof read by D T SWISS)
of the book that you mention; THE BICYCLE WHEEL, BY Jobst Brandt, is IMhO, much superior. Regards, J T |
Originally Posted by soderbiker
(Post 6876909)
ok well im sry about the post . i re read the book , and it says that symetrical or asymetrical , so what i did was asymetrical , and it didnt look correct but it deosnt matter which 1 you use , i guess then it depends on what you want ,.
i like symetrical The best article...and the one I still use...on wheel building is this series. It's easy to follow (the first one in the series is very dated) and results in strong, symmetrical wheels. |
Originally Posted by Retro Grouch
(Post 6877326)
Math skills? What do you need math skills for?
|
Originally Posted by Tabor
(Post 6877817)
There is a tiny bit of geometry/trig (at least conceptually) when you lace different patters on different sides.
|
Originally Posted by urbanknight
(Post 6877870)
I'd say that's more for the planning, i.e. deciding on which lacing pattern for given hubs diameters, rim ERDs, and spoke counts. The rest is just counting, really.
1. Assume a 36h rim, being laced to a geared rear wheel (3x/2x). 2. Lace the 9 trailing spokes on the drive side. 3. Lace the 9 trailing spokes on the non-drive side. Crap, how do you figure out which hole in the hub to put the first spoke through in the non-drive side? You know which hole you want it in on the rim, but now you need to figure out which hole to put it through on the hub! Conceptually, this is trigonometry. |
thanks , much appreciated .
2 rims are now laced properly thanks all for the help !! //t
Originally Posted by cyccommute
(Post 6877476)
Asymmetrical is the easiest way to build wheels and it's the way a lot of machine built wheels are done. There's nothing really wrong with it although I have read stuff in the very distant past which implied that the wheel is weaker when built asymmetrically. The wheel is more susceptible to taco'ing because the forces at the spoke head aren't as well balanced. Whether or not that is true, I haven't had a wheel taco on me since I started building them and I've done dozens.
The best article...and the one I still use...on wheel building is this series. It's easy to follow (the first one in the series is very dated) and results in strong, symmetrical wheels. |
Originally Posted by Tabor
(Post 6877817)
There is a tiny bit of geometry/trig (at least conceptually) when you lace different patters on different sides.
I don't do stuff like that. |
Originally Posted by soderbiker
(Post 6876743)
Oh my i love this stuff-
|
Originally Posted by Tabor
(Post 6877897)
Umm kindof, except for this step:
1. Assume a 36h rim, being laced to a geared rear wheel (3x/2x). 2. Lace the 9 trailing spokes on the drive side. 3. Lace the 9 trailing spokes on the non-drive side. Crap, how do you figure out which hole in the hub to put the first spoke through in the non-drive side? You know which hole you want it in on the rim, but now you need to figure out which hole to put it through on the hub! Conceptually, this is trigonometry. |
Originally Posted by Retro Grouch
(Post 6878140)
A couple of times a year we get somebody who wants to lace a 32 hole rim onto a 28 hole hub or something like that. Somebody always posts they've done it.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...amhjul-nav.jpg and a 32H rim to a 36H hub for a rear, http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...jul-detalj.jpg Both in 3X.
Originally Posted by Retro Grouch
(Post 6878140)
.. That would probably take some math skills to figure the spoke lengths.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...excelkladd.jpg
Originally Posted by Retro Grouch
(Post 6878140)
..I've always put those projects in the category of "Look at the goofy thing that I'm able to do" .
Originally Posted by Retro Grouch
(Post 6878140)
..rather than serious wheel building.
But from a pure build perspective a mismatched wheel certainly requires more attention from the builder to come out straight and true and evenly tensioned than a matched wheel would. So from a difficulty standpoint I'd say building mismatched wheels are more serious than matched wheels.
Originally Posted by Retro Grouch
(Post 6878140)
.. I don't do stuff like that.
|
Another good tip to having true wheels last is to avoid spoke twist at all cost. Often, once you get up to higher tensions when you finish building your wheel, you will turn the spoke wrench, but the spoke actually won't tighten on the threads because it twists in the middle. When you get out on the road to ride for the first couple weeks, you start noticing your wheels going out of true often. So avoid spoke twist!
One good method, once you get to higher tensions, is to overtighten the tension on the spoke wrench, then back it off. That is, overtighten the spoke, then loosen it all the while making sure you have roundness and lateral true. |
Originally Posted by bellweatherman
(Post 6882685)
Another good tip to having true wheels last is to avoid spoke twist at all cost. Often, once you get up to higher tensions when you finish building your wheel, you will turn the spoke wrench, but the spoke actually won't tighten on the threads because it twists in the middle. When you get out on the road to ride for the first couple weeks, you start noticing your wheels going out of true often. So avoid spoke twist!
One good method, once you get to higher tensions, is to overtighten the tension on the spoke wrench, then back it off. That is, overtighten the spoke, then loosen it all the while making sure you have roundness and lateral true. |
Originally Posted by operator
(Post 6883193)
The lesson is to stress relieve and to practice good spoke tightening (tighten more than back off), not avoiding it. You can only avoid it for so long.
|
Originally Posted by cyccommute
(Post 6883316)
I always hold the spoke between my thumb and forefinger to feel for twist. That will give you an indication of how much to back off. And stress relieving prior to putting any tension on the spokesis key. Do not do the old bend-the-rim-on-the-ground thing. That's a very poor way of stress relieving.
|
@cycpcommute..
I have laced up the rear wheel . i have a campy victory hub small ( low ) flange hub & Mavic GP4 rim 36 hole . i have 298 length spokes on the drive side ( right ) and 300 length spokes on the left side . i went into the shop and specifically asked for the correct spoke lengths , they said you need what i just posted . well i have extremely low tension and the spoke threads are at the top of the nipple . menaing you could not put a flat blade screw driver onto the top of the nipple and turn it . so this is incorrect spokes for bother sides or have i missed something here ? thanks for the help . Timo |
Although it's more aesthetically pleasing to have the spoke ends stop just right at the nipple flange it's by no means structurally required.
If it's a double-walled rim a few mm of overshoot won't mean a thing as long as you're able to get the wheel up to tension before the nipples bottom out on the threads. You may release one spoke from the rim in order to test how much overshoot you can get before running out of thread. They might not be the perfect spokes for the wheel, but they can still be close enough. A small offset like that can't be explained by a 2X/3X mix-up so I don't think you're missing anything. Maybe the shop simply misread a chart or a label somewhere before picking out your stuff. |
Originally Posted by dabac
(Post 6884169)
Although it's more aesthetically pleasing to have the spoke ends stop just right at the nipple flange it's by no means structurally required.
If it's a double-walled rim a few mm of overshoot won't mean a thing as long as you're able to get the wheel up to tension before the nipples bottom out on the threads. You may release one spoke from the rim in order to test how much overshoot you can get before running out of thread. They might not be the perfect spokes for the wheel, but they can still be close enough. A small offset like that can't be explained by a 2X/3X mix-up so I don't think you're missing anything. Maybe the shop simply misread a chart or a label somewhere before picking out your stuff. |
Originally Posted by Tabor
(Post 6877817)
There is a tiny bit of geometry/trig (at least conceptually) when you lace different patters on different sides.
Originally Posted by dabac
Although it's more aesthetically pleasing to have the spoke ends stop just right at the nipple flange it's by no means structurally required.
|
Originally Posted by cyccommute
(Post 6883316)
Do not[/U] do the old bend-the-rim-on-the-ground thing. That's a very poor way of stress relieving.
Brown's method works for me. |
I've been told that the ground method can damage cartridge bearings, so I use the hand method.
|
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:24 AM. |
Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.