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Old 08-19-08, 09:00 AM   #1
Kefalonia
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Upgrading Raleigh Touriste (1984)

I have a wonderful touring bike called a Raleigh Touriste, it is 24 years & still looks like a youngster. I want to keep it that way, so i've decided to knuckle down & repair/upgrade it.
In the last 24 years cycling technology has changed beyond all recognition.
I am unsure of what upgrade path to take to bring this bike back to its best.
I need the venerable knowledge of a cycling sage
My Raleigh Touriste needs a new 700c rear wheel /cassette / sprocket combination as the old wheel has met the grim reaper. The original sprocket was 6 speed, attached via an early cassette mechanism.
The inner distance between the rear frame forks is 128mm, the outer approx 140mm.
Replacing the 700c rear wheel and sprocket led me to the question:
What 700c rear wheel and sprocket combination should I upgrade to for this touring bike?
I want a durable wheel (55 or less) that can be installed in a frame with 128mm between the rear forks.
The front and rear deraillers also need replacing to be compatible with the new chain & sprocket.
Previous components:
Front Derailler: Shimano FD M350
Rear Derailleur: Shimano RD M350
Sprocket: 6 speed attached to wheel via early Shimano metal Cassette
Chainring: Biopace Exage Trail Triple 48-36-28 with FC M350 cranks- In decent condition.
Gears are SIS Indexed and are adjusted by Shimano SL-1050 Gear Levers, the left has 5 or 6 clicks and accomodates only 6 speed gears.
Brake levers are Weinmann- brake lines fed vertically through Weinmann black rubber brake hoods which have perished (Cane Creek and Dia Compe sell comparable replacement brake hoods but I cant find them in the UK).

What Shimano groupset of components should I choose for this upgrade that are suitable & compatible for this touring bike?
What Chain would be ideal with this groupset?
Is it possible to buy downshifting gear levers like the Shimano SL-1050's that accomodate 8 or 9 speed sprockets?
If so what are they called?
Is it desirable to keep straight gear shifting levers on the diagonal cross bar , or move to gearshifters incorporated into the break levers.
Is it better to upgrade to an 8, 9 or 10 speed sprocket.
Can a 8, 9 or 10 speed sprocket fit in an old frame with 700c wheel and 128mm between the rear forks.
I have tried hard to find answers to some of these questions but so much has changed- I lack experience of some of these new technologies so I would appreciate any constructive suggestions fellow bike forum users could give.
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Old 08-19-08, 09:33 AM   #2
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The first obvious problem is the rear hub spacing. All modern touring setups are spaced 135mm to accommodate mountain-style hubs. Shimano Deore and Deore LX are the value hubs in this area and are solid for touring. You can get them in 32 and 36 holes. Since your bike is not spaced for these hubs, you will need to spread it (Cold Set) or stay with hubs made for 126mm, which is not friendly for the kind of touring cassettes you're likely to pursue.

Spreading your frame is not hard to do, info on Sheldon's site here: http://sheldonbrown.com/gloss_cn-z.html#coldset and http://sheldonbrown.com/frame-spacing.html

Your decision here will determine your upgrade path.
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Old 08-19-08, 10:05 AM   #3
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Your bike will accept modern 130 mm (road) rear hubs and they take 8, 9 or 10-speed cassettes or 7-speed cassettes with a 4.5 mm spacer. Thess hubs in 32 or 36 hole form can provide wheels plenty strong enough for anything but the most extreme loaded touring in the worst of conditions.

Depending on how much money you are willing to pour into this project, your choice of component groups is very wide.
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Old 08-19-08, 10:30 AM   #4
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I was contemplating buying a new rear wheel, chain and sprocket from various suppliers on the internet and then sourcing the remainder of the components via ebay uk. I thought of sourcing a Shimano Groupset of components so that I could get a set to replace those on the bike, but I wasnt sure what would be compatible on a reasonable budget.
I hope to spend 150 on the project.

Last edited by Kefalonia; 08-21-08 at 12:41 PM.
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Old 08-19-08, 10:39 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kefalonia View Post
I hope to spend 150 on the project.
Not a chance. Even the lowest road group upgrade, even if you stay with downtube shifters, plus a rear wheel, etc. will go way over that amount.

Last edited by HillRider; 08-19-08 at 10:43 AM.
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Old 08-19-08, 10:57 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by HillRider View Post
Not a chance. Even the lowest road group upgrade, even if you stay with downtube shifters, plus a rear wheel, etc. will go way over that amount.
I dunno. It sounds like the OP really *needs* just a rear wheel- 120 bux US for a good Ultegra/Mavic OP rear wheel with 32 stainless butted spokes- that's only about 25 pounds these days (just kidding- more like 60 pounds). Then a 7 or 8 speed cassette of choice, and (if indexing is imperative) a right-side 8-speed indexing downtube shifter (7 and 8 speed have nearly the same cable pull per click) from E-Bay, a new chain and maybe a new rear derailleur of Sora or Tiagra level (the original der will likely work fine if not too worn out), that's probably about 150 pounds. If friction mode is fine, then new shifters aren't required.

I'd probably stay with 8-speed or 7-speed. The crank might need upgrading to go to 9-speed because of the narrower chain.

Last edited by Squeazel; 08-19-08 at 11:00 AM.
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Old 08-19-08, 11:24 AM   #7
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Might as well go to 9-speed. 9-speed chains and cassettes aren't any more expensive and 9-speed dt shifters are more available than 7 or 8 these days. Any Shimano rear derailleur from "7-speed era" on will work (except pre-9-speed Dura Ace) and a suitable Sora or Tiagra fd is cheap.

The crank (Biopace for heaven sake) will work with a 9-speed chain if the OP doesn't shift under a big load.
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Old 08-21-08, 01:34 PM   #8
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Im going to get the frame cold set to install a 135mm overlock nut distanced wheel.

I've chosen the following components so far:

M:Wheel Shimano Deore/Mavic A319 Rear Wheel

http://www.wiggle.co.uk/p/Cycle/7/MW...el/5360035959/

43.19 (when you spend over 50 with free delivery).

Shimano IG70 8 Speed Chain: An IG Chain to complement the IG Shimano Cassette.

http://www.wiggle.co.uk/p/Cycle/7/Sh...in/4000000803/

12.14 (When 50 Spent On Order).

Shimano Exage Trail 8speed Rear Derailleur

An excellent retro rear derailleur in mint condition that was similar to the original but 8 speed- that needed replacing.

2.19 Off Ebay plus 4.50 postage = 6.69 (In Mint Condition)

Shimano Deore LX 8 Speed Mountain Bike Cassette 11/28 CSHG70

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Shimano-Deore-...Z120205442962Q

14.99 plus 3.95 postage = 18.94

Dia Compe Brake Lever Hoods Set, Non Aero, Pair, Brown

4.68 plus 4.30 postage = 9.98

To bring my old perished brake hoods back to life.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Dia-Compe-Brak...713.m153.l1262

SHIMANO 500 EXAGE CX FRONT BIKE GEAR MECH

0.99 Plus 1.99 postage = 2.98

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/BANKRUPT-SHIMA...713.m153.l1262

Will the above Front Derailleur work on this setup?
* BAND SIZE: 34.9
* SUITABLE FOR HYBRIDS OR MTB

The vertical frame tube that this will be attatched to is 28.6, but the above derailleur i've bought is 34.9.
As this is a hybrid front mech is it possible that this will work with this setup or should I go for an LX Deore Front Mech or Sora or Tiagra?

Is it possible to adjust this Derailleur to fit my narrower frame?

If so what component could I use to attach this wider connecting derailleur to the frame?

Spent So Far: 93.92

Anticipated budget: 150 max.

Any thoughts from the venerable readers of bikeforums.net?

Constructive opinions welcome.

Thankyou to Scudiac, Hillrider & Squeazel -your input has helped me progress, when I was lost.

Keep up the good work.
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Old 08-21-08, 02:38 PM   #9
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The wheels look good and should be strong and durable if they are tensioned properly. You might keep a couple of 's available to pay a good local shop go over them for true and tension. Many machine built wheels are lacking somewhat but can be very reliable if touched up before they are put into service. Going to 135 mm OLD is a bit of overkill but can't hurt.

The chain, cassette, and rear derailleurs are also good choices, particularly at those attractive prices. I assume equivalent 9-speed items would have been significantly more money.

There are shims that will allow a 35 mm clamp-on front derailleur to fit on a 28.6 mm seat tube but they are a kludge and may interfer with the shifting. Front derailleurs, even good ones, are realtively cheap so get one with the right size clamp. You can either buy a clamp-on fd with a 28.6 mm clamp or a braze-on fd and a proper diameter adapter clamp. At worst, you now have a 0.99 paper weight.

You didn't mention shifters. What did you decide to do about them? 8-speed bar end or downtube shifters should still be available and at reasonably low cost. 8-speed STI (integtated brake/shift levers) are also available but are significantly more costly.
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Old 08-21-08, 04:17 PM   #10
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I chose an 8 speed cassette in preference to 9, after advice from a good local bicycle mechanic.
He thought that converting my bike to 8 speed against 9 was more straightforward and cost effective.
He thought 9 speed is a want, in preference to a need for most peoples intended cycling.

Shifters:

I don't really know what solutions exist or what will be good- im in the dark and would appreciate suggestions from cyclists more up to date than I. Im 23 years behind the times- cyclewise.
I have a bike that is magic to ride which has 2 levers mounted eitherside on the diagonal crossbar.
One controls the FD and one the RD- The RD is SIS indexed and was used to change a 6 speed sprocket. The 2nd FD lever moved the chain across a triple Biopace chainwheel.
Sentimentally I wish I could magic levers onto the bike that look the same with the 8 speed equivalent (SIS Indexed). Logically it would make sense to upgrade to the latest gear changing mechanisms and be done with the old levers. What would you install if you were me and why?
What options do I have that would complement my new modified Deore LX type setup?.
Once again im in the dark and need a little help.
I would appreciate any advice given....
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Old 08-21-08, 04:28 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kefalonia View Post
Shifters:
I don't really know what solutions exist or what will be good- im in the dark and would appreciate suggestions from cyclists more up to date than I. Im 23 years behind the times- cyclewise.
I have a bike that is magic to ride which has 2 levers mounted eitherside on the diagonal crossbar.
One controls the FD and one the RD- The RD is SIS indexed and was used to change a 6 speed sprocket. The 2nd FD lever moved the chain across a triple Biopace chainwheel.
Sentimentally I wish I could magic levers onto the bike that look the same with the 8 speed equivalent (SIS Indexed). Logically it would make sense to upgrade to the latest gear changing mechanisms and be done with the old levers. What would you install if you were me and why?
What options do I have that would complement my new modified Deore LX type setup?.
Once again im in the dark and need a little help.
I would appreciate any advice given....
The "diagonal crossbar" you referred to is called the "downtube" in bike-speak and you are describing downtube shifters. 8-speed indexed downtube shifters are still easily available and will work wonderfully with your new components. Front shifting will remain friction as it is with all downtube shifters. They are also the least expensive form of shifters.

Integrated brake/shift levers (STI is Shimano's trade name) are extremely convenient and allow shifting when you absolutely cannot take your hands off the bars. They are heaven-sent in very hilly areas. They are also, by far, the most expensive shifter type available and would probably be budget-busters for your project.
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Old 08-21-08, 06:59 PM   #12
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Have you actually purchased this stuff yet? I have quite a few old bikes and one new one. The only reason to "upgrade" is to get a larger gear range (a higher high or a lower low) or the handlebar brake/shifter combo. The "brifters" take a bit of the sting out of difficult rides. Rebuilding your current bike with nicer rims and spokes, a new chain, new cables (new cables are amazing), new brake shoes, maybe a new freewheel, new tires, and away you go with no upgrade hassles. Your bike was great in its day, and most of the new stuff doesn't do a dang thing to your cycling enjoyment. But it is fun to tinker.....
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Old 08-21-08, 07:41 PM   #13
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All your stuff sounds good except the wheel.

I'd stick to a road wheel with a 130mm spread. That means you only need to cold set the frame 2 mm per side. Or if it's not much of a squeeze just spring it it each time as suggested.

While touring bikes these days use the 135mm MTB standard there's no big reason for it. Your Touriste did fine in its day on the 126 mm setup after all. So it'll do fine now with the 130 mm setup.

Get a Shimano road wheel with 32 or 36 spokes and then put on an 8 speed MTB cassette and use an MTB derrailleur. Up front if this is for more casual riding I'd go with an MTB 44 tooth big ring crank set. Or if you think you'll spin that out too easily even on the 11 on the back then go with a 46 or 48 big ring cyclocross crankset.

The happy middle ground for shifters would be indexed 8 speed bar end shifters if you're running drop bars. That would get you up off the downtube and up onto the bars which would be a pleasent upgrade.
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Old 08-22-08, 04:36 AM   #14
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Upgrading Raleigh Touriste (1984)

Yes I have purchased and received most of it.
The upgrade was done to ensure my bike was ready for another 23 years.
I didnt upgrade it out of fashion, but the desire to breathe life back into it.
Sure, I could have gone out and bought another bike with no hassle, but where is the imagination in that?
Bringing this bike back to life has been a journey and a pleasurable one at that.
I've learnt alot about my bike and been inspired by fellow readers on this forum.

Last edited by Kefalonia; 08-22-08 at 03:48 PM.
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Old 08-22-08, 07:31 AM   #15
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Upgrading Raleigh Touriste (1984)

Downshifters Bought!

I've settled for sentimentality and sourced 8 speed downshifters to replace my old ones.

Shimano 8 Speed Down Tube Shift Levers SL-R400

http://www.probikekit.com/display.php?code=K3068

Reduced By 15% to 21.15!!

Enter code: UKRBR to obtain an extra 5% off.

Total Cost: 20.09 including free delivery (specified at checkout).

Spent So far: 93.92+ 20.09 = 114.01

Anticipated Budget= 150

Last edited by Kefalonia; 08-22-08 at 07:37 AM.
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