Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Bicycle Mechanics Broken bottom bracket? Tacoed wheel? If you're having problems with your bicycle, or just need help fixing a flat, drop in here for the latest on bicycle mechanics & bicycle maintenance.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12-24-08, 11:49 AM   #1
rankinesoccer
Banned
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Bikes: 2007 red Trek Fuel EX 6, c. 1990 Diamondback Centurion Master TG
Posts: 49
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
How to install rims?

I have a 1990 Diamondback Centurion Master TG. It is 700c and 36 hole. The rims are cracking. I am low on money, but want to ride the bike. So, instead of spending multiple hundreds of $ on new wheels, I figured that I'd buy new rims. Are they easy to install, if so, HOW?
rankinesoccer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-08, 12:01 PM   #2
reptilezs
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: boston, ma
Bikes:
Posts: 2,852
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
http://www.miketechinfo.com/new-tech-wheels-tires.htm might as well buy a new or used set of wheels if you dont want to learn how to build wheels. you are going to need new spokes too
reptilezs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-08, 12:02 PM   #3
defjack
Senior Member
 
defjack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Santa Monica,San Diego
Bikes: Cruzbike Silvio 1.0 Silvio 2.1
Posts: 75
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
See if you can find a bicycle co-op in your area.They will have all the tools and advice you need . Jack
defjack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-08, 12:11 PM   #4
Sturmcrow
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 349
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
It's not too difficult to do. Get yourself a rim with the same (or nearly the same) ERD so that you can reuse the spokes. Tape the new rim to the old one with the spoke holes lined up (i.e. the holes are not centered, so line them up so that the offset is the same). Screw off the spoke nipples and transfer the spokes to the new rim one by one. True it up and you're ready to ride. Don't forget the rim tape.

The hardest part is truing up the wheel once you get the spokes switched over. With time and luck, you can use your brake pads as a guide to get the wheels fairly true. You could get them pretty close and just bring them in to the LBS for the final fitting.
Sturmcrow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-08, 12:30 PM   #5
z415
Senior Member
 
z415's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Gainesville/Tampa, FL
Bikes: Trek 1000, two mtbs and working on a fixie for commuting.
Posts: 2,343
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I think getting a new wheelset, which can be had for less than $100, would be easier than just replacing the rims unless you really have a lot of spare time on your hands. You'd also need some bike specific tools. In the end, it might end up costing the same.
z415 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-08, 12:51 PM   #6
Panthers007
Great State of Varmint
 
Panthers007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Dante's Third Ring
Bikes:
Posts: 7,479
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Or you could take the time to learn to build wheels. Then you'd have the ineffable feeling of riding on something you built, and a usable skill that could make you some money down the road.
Panthers007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-08, 01:19 PM   #7
keisatsu
Eternal n00b
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Spokane WA
Bikes: Giant OCR3, Marin Mount Vision, '94 Bontrager Racelite, Mirraco Blink
Posts: 914
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Sheldon Browns site will tell you how to build wheels, I used it to build up a new rear wheel that came out nicely.

If you are having some trouble finding the correct length of spoke for your new rims, take the hub and rim to you LBS, they will be able to calculate the correct length (usually for a small fee) if you do not feel confident enough to do it yourself.

When you lace the new wheel, using the old hub, lace it exactly like it was laced on the old wheel, or you could potentially have problems with hub flange failure.

Have fun and don't forget, there are plenty of people on this site, or at your LBS that have built their own wheels that can help if you get stuck.
keisatsu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-08, 05:45 PM   #8
ultraman6970
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Bikes:
Posts: 7,860
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
If you live in DC metro area just give me the wheels, the new rims (same brand and model) and i'll hook you up with the lacing and truing.
ultraman6970 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-08, 06:04 PM   #9
krems81
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Chicago, IL
Bikes: Vintage Miele
Posts: 714
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
If you're money conscious and your old spokes are still in decent shape, you can reuse them. You'll just have to get the same rims, or rims with the same erd (effective rim diameter). Wheelbuilding can get pretty complicated, but sheldon brown's page will help: http://sheldonbrown.com/wheelbuild.html

and Damon Rinard's spocalc will help you make sure your spokes fit, or help you find the new length of spokes you'll need: http://sheldonbrown.com/rinard/spocalc.htm

Go over these pages carefully. Scroll down past download section of Rinard's page for details on how to take hub and rim measurements, and how to enter them into the spreadsheet.

Make sure you have access to a truing stand. You can lace the wheel any old place, but you'll need a truing stand to tension and dish the wheel properly.

Prep the spoke threads somehow. You can get some boiled linseed oil and dip the spoke threads in it before lacing. This will help the spoke nipples stiffen their hold on threads, so they don't turn as easily. It will also prevent corrosion.

Also, it is very important to get the wheel up to tension. This may not always be stressed, but its key. Don't just worry about whether the wheel is true laterally and radially. It must also have about 100 pounds of tension on drive side of rear wheel, and both sides of front wheel, and then whatever tension you need on non-drive rear to get the wheel true. After a while you get a feel for this, and you don't really need a tension gauge, but at first I'd recommend using one.

Things you'll need (access to):
Spoke prep, or linseed oil
Spoke wrench
Truing Stand
New rims with same erd or new rims and spokes
Tension gauge
Dishing tool


If there's a community bike shop with open shop hours near you, you may be able to do all this there, as long as you bring your new rims and spokes, and they will probably help you get started, and give you tips along the way. But as you can see, time and expense add up, and financially you might do almost as well buying a new wheelset. I, personally, hope you rebuild. Good luck.

Last edited by krems81; 12-24-08 at 06:09 PM.
krems81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-24-08, 08:28 PM   #10
oldster
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Denver, Co.
Bikes:
Posts: 699
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Hopeing Not to hijack the thread , but , where do you find the ERD??...
I have a similar situation with a 25 year old set of wienman(sp) 700 concave rims that have a problem with modern tires staying seated. since I built the original wheels , how do I find a rim that is the same as the originals??? any info would be appreciated...
Bud
oldster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-08, 09:07 PM   #11
rankinesoccer
Banned
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Bikes: 2007 red Trek Fuel EX 6, c. 1990 Diamondback Centurion Master TG
Posts: 49
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
sorry... no luck

i'm across the country! But thanks for the offer
rankinesoccer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-08, 09:28 PM   #12
fearfeasog
Gaeilgeoir
 
fearfeasog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Holyoke, MA
Bikes: 2003 Giant Iguana (ONCE yellow), '86 Team Fuji (Blue/Yellow), '87 Schwinn Le Tour (Frost White)
Posts: 264
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
build the wheels. or if you DO get new wheels, recycle your old hubs and spokes on the forum, or through freecycle or craig's list's "free" section. no sense in needlessly throwing useable stuff in the trash.
fearfeasog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-08, 11:13 PM   #13
jccaclimber
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Terre Haute, Lafayette, or Indianapolis, IN, depending on the day
Bikes: n, I would like n+1
Posts: 1,917
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
If you're really strapped for cash the 700c wheels on a $30 garage sale road bike will probably do the trick for now, although they may not be the best long term solution.
jccaclimber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-29-08, 06:57 AM   #14
krems81
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Chicago, IL
Bikes: Vintage Miele
Posts: 714
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldster View Post
Hopeing Not to hijack the thread , but , where do you find the ERD??...
I have a similar situation with a 25 year old set of wienman(sp) 700 concave rims that have a problem with modern tires staying seated. since I built the original wheels , how do I find a rim that is the same as the originals??? any info would be appreciated...
Bud
Download spocalc: http://www.sheldonbrown.com/rinard/spocalc.htm. Theres a rim database there. If you can find your rim, just look for others with same erd. If not, there are instructions for measuring erd if you scroll down the download page I linked you to.

Even easier is to choose the rim you want, and then buy spokes to fit it. Plus, you get to take measurements and use spocalc, which is fun and educational.
krems81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-29-08, 10:02 AM   #15
bikeman715
Senior Member
 
bikeman715's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Salinas , Ca.
Bikes: Bike Nashbar AL-1 ,Raligh M50 , Schwinn Traveler , and others
Posts: 2,402
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
to oldster, check your old rim near the value hole, or a sticker somewhere on the rim (if there is one ) and the information should be there. it usually stated with the tire size.
bikeman715 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-29-08, 10:12 AM   #16
oldbobcat
Senior Member
 
oldbobcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Boulder County, CO
Bikes: '79 Gios, '80 Masi, '06 Felt, early '60s Frejus
Posts: 2,926
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldster View Post
Hopeing Not to hijack the thread , but , where do you find the ERD??...
I have a similar situation with a 25 year old set of wienman(sp) 700 concave rims
Bud
All modern rim manufacturers show the ERD imprinted directly on the rim or in the marketing literature.

You don't want a new rim that's just like your old concave Weinmanns. The new ones are better in every respect. You can never go wrong with Mavic Open Sports for durability, but if you're on a limited budget you can do well with non-aero or semi-aero rims from Velocity, Sun-Ringle, and Alex. DT also makes fine alloy rims, but they tend to be pricey.
oldbobcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-09, 11:07 PM   #17
krems81
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Chicago, IL
Bikes: Vintage Miele
Posts: 714
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldster View Post
Hopeing Not to hijack the thread , but , where do you find the ERD??...
I have a similar situation with a 25 year old set of wienman(sp) 700 concave rims that have a problem with modern tires staying seated. since I built the original wheels , how do I find a rim that is the same as the originals??? any info would be appreciated...
Bud
you're not likely to find a good double wall rim with the same erd as your weinmann concave. The concave shape puts spoke nipple seat further from hub than rims that are rounded outward, which is every other rim on the market. so get whatever rim you want and buy new spokes.

strongly recommend butted spokes. they're more elastic and reduce accute stress on the rim from impact. It will be a more comfortable wheel, and will last longer, for maybe an extra $8-10 per wheel
krems81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-09, 11:16 PM   #18
krems81
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Chicago, IL
Bikes: Vintage Miele
Posts: 714
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
the ebay seller dave_ornee usually has quality double butted spokes for sale at a very good price, $38 for 72 sapim db 14/15 gauge 2.0/1.8mm spokes of any length or combination of lengths, with sapim brass nipples. $45 w/ shipping. He doesn't appear to have any spokes listed right now, but I'll bet he has them. you can contact him to find out. He's a wheelbuilder in the chicao area. I've met him, good guy.
krems81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-09, 06:14 AM   #19
Bikedued
Senior Member
 
Bikedued's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 10,624
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 20 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldbobcat View Post
You don't want a new rim that's just like your old concave Weinmanns. The new ones are better in every respect.

Old concave Weinmann rims came in two types. Single wall junk with no eyelets, and double wall with eyelets. I don't see how a modern double wall eyelet rim could be a whole lot better than an old one of the same type. Maybe an advance in metalurgy, but overall not much difference. Back then there was probably a little less price point manufacturing, so it's probably a toss up which one is actually better. Actually, I just looked over my 1980 Weinmanns, and found no pinned/glued gap anywhere. That means they actually spent time welding, finishing, and polishing these. A pretty nice product, if I'm still able to ride them 29 years after they were made? I don't imagine any of the rims made now will still be ridable in 2038. Well, maybe the Mavics will?,,,,BD
Bikedued is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-09, 06:52 AM   #20
dabac
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 5,360
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sturmcrow View Post
Get yourself a rim with the same (or nearly the same) ERD so that you can reuse the spokes.
Some tweaking can be done by going to another number of crosses. Going from 3X to 4X can very well be enough to compensate for the switch from single wall to double wall. It'll be quite a bit harder than replacing with a matched rim though.
dabac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-09, 07:40 AM   #21
HillRider 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Bikes: '''96 Litespeed Catalyst, '05 Litespeed Firenze, '06 Litespeed Tuscany, '12 Surly Pacer, All are 3x8,9 or 10. It is hilly around here!
Posts: 28,776
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 36 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldbobcat View Post
All modern rim manufacturers show the ERD imprinted directly on the rim or in the marketing literature.
The ERD may be given in the product literature but it's not printed or engraved on any rim I can find. I just looked carefully at sets of Mavic CXP-33, Sun Mistral, Matrix (Trek's house brand) road and Matrix MTB and none of them have ERD values on either the labels or on the rim itself.

The only dimensions on these rims are 622 x XX or 559 x XX, which are the ISO bead seat diameter and interior width, not the ERD.
HillRider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-09, 11:42 AM   #22
oldster
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Denver, Co.
Bikes:
Posts: 699
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bikedued View Post
Old concave Weinmann rims came in two types. Single wall junk with no eyelets, and double wall with eyelets. I don't see how a modern double wall eyelet rim could be a whole lot better than an old one of the same type. Maybe an advance in metalurgy, but overall not much difference. Back then there was probably a little less price point manufacturing, so it's probably a toss up which one is actually better. Actually, I just looked over my 1980 Weinmanns, and found no pinned/glued gap anywhere. That means they actually spent time welding, finishing, and polishing these. A pretty nice product, if I'm still able to ride them 29 years after they were made? I don't imagine any of the rims made now will still be ridable in 2038. Well, maybe the Mavics will?,,,,BD
These are with eyelets and are still really good preforming units....Only problem is, since I went from 700c/19 michlein tires to some 700/23 vredesteins I cant go over 85 psi without them popping off...
I may will just buy a set of mavics and spokes and re do em.
...OR....go the whole route and get a 10sp casette hub,new casette, 10 sp Der, new chain and 10 sp downtube shifter. Only another $400...(if my ship comes in...) Not sure if its worth it?????
Bud
oldster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-09, 12:04 PM   #23
wrk101
DRF aka Thrifty Bill
 
wrk101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: The NC Mountains
Bikes: 86 Katakura Silk, 87 Prologue, 87 Cimarron, 14 frame school custom, 73 Paramount
Posts: 19,962
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
+1 When you are strapped for cash, find a donor bike. I have bought garage sale and thrift store bikes in the $5 to $20 range.

A good donor is usually a very cost effective way to find spares. Usually, you can just take the parts you need, then ebay or Craigs List the remaining parts, more than covering your cost. Or save the parts for the next project. I have taken hundreds of dollars of parts off of a single $5 donor bike.
wrk101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-09, 12:29 AM   #24
oldbobcat
Senior Member
 
oldbobcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Boulder County, CO
Bikes: '79 Gios, '80 Masi, '06 Felt, early '60s Frejus
Posts: 2,926
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
The workmanship of the old Weinmanns is unimpeachable. After riding an old double-wall Wienmann in the rear for over a year I was ready for change. My objections were weight, softness of the alloy compared to what's now available, negative aerodynamics, and the way dirt accumulates in the channel.

I'm replacing it with a Sun-Ringle M13II. This is a double-walled, eyeleted rim that doesn't weight a lot (470 grams), doesn't cost a lot, and has a traditional box-section appearance. Any local shop that has an account with J&B Importers should be able to get them for you.
oldbobcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-09, 06:01 AM   #25
Bikedued
Senior Member
 
Bikedued's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 10,624
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 20 Post(s)
I put 100psi +/- in the Serfas on my Weinmanns, but of course they're wire bead. No way I would attempt to use a folding bead on a flat sided rim. I went through that with some Continental Ultra Sports on a rim I thought could handle it. (Wolber TX semi aero) Sun M13II's are pretty decent. I have a set on my Prelude. No complaints so far.,,,,BD
Bikedued is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:29 PM.