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  1. #1
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    How to install rims?

    I have a 1990 Diamondback Centurion Master TG. It is 700c and 36 hole. The rims are cracking. I am low on money, but want to ride the bike. So, instead of spending multiple hundreds of $ on new wheels, I figured that I'd buy new rims. Are they easy to install, if so, HOW?

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    http://www.miketechinfo.com/new-tech-wheels-tires.htm might as well buy a new or used set of wheels if you dont want to learn how to build wheels. you are going to need new spokes too

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    Senior Member defjack's Avatar
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    See if you can find a bicycle co-op in your area.They will have all the tools and advice you need . Jack
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    It's not too difficult to do. Get yourself a rim with the same (or nearly the same) ERD so that you can reuse the spokes. Tape the new rim to the old one with the spoke holes lined up (i.e. the holes are not centered, so line them up so that the offset is the same). Screw off the spoke nipples and transfer the spokes to the new rim one by one. True it up and you're ready to ride. Don't forget the rim tape.

    The hardest part is truing up the wheel once you get the spokes switched over. With time and luck, you can use your brake pads as a guide to get the wheels fairly true. You could get them pretty close and just bring them in to the LBS for the final fitting.
    The will to win is nothing without the will to prepare. -Juma Ikangaa

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    Senior Member z415's Avatar
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    I think getting a new wheelset, which can be had for less than $100, would be easier than just replacing the rims unless you really have a lot of spare time on your hands. You'd also need some bike specific tools. In the end, it might end up costing the same.
    Falling is learning...[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]...learn to not fall in a box.
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    Great State of Varmint Panthers007's Avatar
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    Or you could take the time to learn to build wheels. Then you'd have the ineffable feeling of riding on something you built, and a usable skill that could make you some money down the road.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cateye View Post
    Only panthers007 is stupid enough to believe that this is a good idea.

  7. #7
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    Sheldon Browns site will tell you how to build wheels, I used it to build up a new rear wheel that came out nicely.

    If you are having some trouble finding the correct length of spoke for your new rims, take the hub and rim to you LBS, they will be able to calculate the correct length (usually for a small fee) if you do not feel confident enough to do it yourself.

    When you lace the new wheel, using the old hub, lace it exactly like it was laced on the old wheel, or you could potentially have problems with hub flange failure.

    Have fun and don't forget, there are plenty of people on this site, or at your LBS that have built their own wheels that can help if you get stuck.
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    If you live in DC metro area just give me the wheels, the new rims (same brand and model) and i'll hook you up with the lacing and truing.

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    If you're money conscious and your old spokes are still in decent shape, you can reuse them. You'll just have to get the same rims, or rims with the same erd (effective rim diameter). Wheelbuilding can get pretty complicated, but sheldon brown's page will help: http://sheldonbrown.com/wheelbuild.html

    and Damon Rinard's spocalc will help you make sure your spokes fit, or help you find the new length of spokes you'll need: http://sheldonbrown.com/rinard/spocalc.htm

    Go over these pages carefully. Scroll down past download section of Rinard's page for details on how to take hub and rim measurements, and how to enter them into the spreadsheet.

    Make sure you have access to a truing stand. You can lace the wheel any old place, but you'll need a truing stand to tension and dish the wheel properly.

    Prep the spoke threads somehow. You can get some boiled linseed oil and dip the spoke threads in it before lacing. This will help the spoke nipples stiffen their hold on threads, so they don't turn as easily. It will also prevent corrosion.

    Also, it is very important to get the wheel up to tension. This may not always be stressed, but its key. Don't just worry about whether the wheel is true laterally and radially. It must also have about 100 pounds of tension on drive side of rear wheel, and both sides of front wheel, and then whatever tension you need on non-drive rear to get the wheel true. After a while you get a feel for this, and you don't really need a tension gauge, but at first I'd recommend using one.

    Things you'll need (access to):
    Spoke prep, or linseed oil
    Spoke wrench
    Truing Stand
    New rims with same erd or new rims and spokes
    Tension gauge
    Dishing tool


    If there's a community bike shop with open shop hours near you, you may be able to do all this there, as long as you bring your new rims and spokes, and they will probably help you get started, and give you tips along the way. But as you can see, time and expense add up, and financially you might do almost as well buying a new wheelset. I, personally, hope you rebuild. Good luck.
    Last edited by krems81; 12-24-08 at 05:09 PM.

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    Hopeing Not to hijack the thread , but , where do you find the ERD??...
    I have a similar situation with a 25 year old set of wienman(sp) 700 concave rims that have a problem with modern tires staying seated. since I built the original wheels , how do I find a rim that is the same as the originals??? any info would be appreciated...
    Bud

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    sorry... no luck

    i'm across the country! But thanks for the offer

  12. #12
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    build the wheels. or if you DO get new wheels, recycle your old hubs and spokes on the forum, or through freecycle or craig's list's "free" section. no sense in needlessly throwing useable stuff in the trash.
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    If you're really strapped for cash the 700c wheels on a $30 garage sale road bike will probably do the trick for now, although they may not be the best long term solution.

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    Quote Originally Posted by oldster View Post
    Hopeing Not to hijack the thread , but , where do you find the ERD??...
    I have a similar situation with a 25 year old set of wienman(sp) 700 concave rims that have a problem with modern tires staying seated. since I built the original wheels , how do I find a rim that is the same as the originals??? any info would be appreciated...
    Bud
    Download spocalc: http://www.sheldonbrown.com/rinard/spocalc.htm. Theres a rim database there. If you can find your rim, just look for others with same erd. If not, there are instructions for measuring erd if you scroll down the download page I linked you to.

    Even easier is to choose the rim you want, and then buy spokes to fit it. Plus, you get to take measurements and use spocalc, which is fun and educational.

  15. #15
    Senior Member bikeman715's Avatar
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    to oldster, check your old rim near the value hole, or a sticker somewhere on the rim (if there is one ) and the information should be there. it usually stated with the tire size.

  16. #16
    Senior Member oldbobcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldster View Post
    Hopeing Not to hijack the thread , but , where do you find the ERD??...
    I have a similar situation with a 25 year old set of wienman(sp) 700 concave rims
    Bud
    All modern rim manufacturers show the ERD imprinted directly on the rim or in the marketing literature.

    You don't want a new rim that's just like your old concave Weinmanns. The new ones are better in every respect. You can never go wrong with Mavic Open Sports for durability, but if you're on a limited budget you can do well with non-aero or semi-aero rims from Velocity, Sun-Ringle, and Alex. DT also makes fine alloy rims, but they tend to be pricey.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldster View Post
    Hopeing Not to hijack the thread , but , where do you find the ERD??...
    I have a similar situation with a 25 year old set of wienman(sp) 700 concave rims that have a problem with modern tires staying seated. since I built the original wheels , how do I find a rim that is the same as the originals??? any info would be appreciated...
    Bud
    you're not likely to find a good double wall rim with the same erd as your weinmann concave. The concave shape puts spoke nipple seat further from hub than rims that are rounded outward, which is every other rim on the market. so get whatever rim you want and buy new spokes.

    strongly recommend butted spokes. they're more elastic and reduce accute stress on the rim from impact. It will be a more comfortable wheel, and will last longer, for maybe an extra $8-10 per wheel

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    the ebay seller dave_ornee usually has quality double butted spokes for sale at a very good price, $38 for 72 sapim db 14/15 gauge 2.0/1.8mm spokes of any length or combination of lengths, with sapim brass nipples. $45 w/ shipping. He doesn't appear to have any spokes listed right now, but I'll bet he has them. you can contact him to find out. He's a wheelbuilder in the chicao area. I've met him, good guy.

  19. #19
    Senior Member Bikedued's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldbobcat View Post
    You don't want a new rim that's just like your old concave Weinmanns. The new ones are better in every respect.

    Old concave Weinmann rims came in two types. Single wall junk with no eyelets, and double wall with eyelets. I don't see how a modern double wall eyelet rim could be a whole lot better than an old one of the same type. Maybe an advance in metalurgy, but overall not much difference. Back then there was probably a little less price point manufacturing, so it's probably a toss up which one is actually better. Actually, I just looked over my 1980 Weinmanns, and found no pinned/glued gap anywhere. That means they actually spent time welding, finishing, and polishing these. A pretty nice product, if I'm still able to ride them 29 years after they were made? I don't imagine any of the rims made now will still be ridable in 2038. Well, maybe the Mavics will?,,,,BD
    "Whale. Oil. Beef. Hooked!" The Rumjacks

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sturmcrow View Post
    Get yourself a rim with the same (or nearly the same) ERD so that you can reuse the spokes.
    Some tweaking can be done by going to another number of crosses. Going from 3X to 4X can very well be enough to compensate for the switch from single wall to double wall. It'll be quite a bit harder than replacing with a matched rim though.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldbobcat View Post
    All modern rim manufacturers show the ERD imprinted directly on the rim or in the marketing literature.
    The ERD may be given in the product literature but it's not printed or engraved on any rim I can find. I just looked carefully at sets of Mavic CXP-33, Sun Mistral, Matrix (Trek's house brand) road and Matrix MTB and none of them have ERD values on either the labels or on the rim itself.

    The only dimensions on these rims are 622 x XX or 559 x XX, which are the ISO bead seat diameter and interior width, not the ERD.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bikedued View Post
    Old concave Weinmann rims came in two types. Single wall junk with no eyelets, and double wall with eyelets. I don't see how a modern double wall eyelet rim could be a whole lot better than an old one of the same type. Maybe an advance in metalurgy, but overall not much difference. Back then there was probably a little less price point manufacturing, so it's probably a toss up which one is actually better. Actually, I just looked over my 1980 Weinmanns, and found no pinned/glued gap anywhere. That means they actually spent time welding, finishing, and polishing these. A pretty nice product, if I'm still able to ride them 29 years after they were made? I don't imagine any of the rims made now will still be ridable in 2038. Well, maybe the Mavics will?,,,,BD
    These are with eyelets and are still really good preforming units....Only problem is, since I went from 700c/19 michlein tires to some 700/23 vredesteins I cant go over 85 psi without them popping off...
    I may will just buy a set of mavics and spokes and re do em.
    ...OR....go the whole route and get a 10sp casette hub,new casette, 10 sp Der, new chain and 10 sp downtube shifter. Only another $400...(if my ship comes in...) Not sure if its worth it?????
    Bud

  23. #23
    DRF aka Thrifty Bill wrk101's Avatar
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    +1 When you are strapped for cash, find a donor bike. I have bought garage sale and thrift store bikes in the $5 to $20 range.

    A good donor is usually a very cost effective way to find spares. Usually, you can just take the parts you need, then ebay or Craigs List the remaining parts, more than covering your cost. Or save the parts for the next project. I have taken hundreds of dollars of parts off of a single $5 donor bike.

  24. #24
    Senior Member oldbobcat's Avatar
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    The workmanship of the old Weinmanns is unimpeachable. After riding an old double-wall Wienmann in the rear for over a year I was ready for change. My objections were weight, softness of the alloy compared to what's now available, negative aerodynamics, and the way dirt accumulates in the channel.

    I'm replacing it with a Sun-Ringle M13II. This is a double-walled, eyeleted rim that doesn't weight a lot (470 grams), doesn't cost a lot, and has a traditional box-section appearance. Any local shop that has an account with J&B Importers should be able to get them for you.

  25. #25
    Senior Member Bikedued's Avatar
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    I put 100psi +/- in the Serfas on my Weinmanns, but of course they're wire bead. No way I would attempt to use a folding bead on a flat sided rim. I went through that with some Continental Ultra Sports on a rim I thought could handle it. (Wolber TX semi aero) Sun M13II's are pretty decent. I have a set on my Prelude. No complaints so far.,,,,BD
    "Whale. Oil. Beef. Hooked!" The Rumjacks

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