Correct bb spindle length for Sugino XD600 cranks on a Surly LHT?
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Correct bb spindle length for Sugino XD600 cranks on a Surly LHT?
I'm about to install Sugino XD 600 cranks on a Surly LHT. The Surly site lists the complete bike as having a 110mm bb spindle with these cranks, but it seems 113-118mm is recommended for these cranks nearly everywhere I look, so I'm not sure what's right. I'd like to avoid the trial and error method of bb installation if I can.......anyone know the correct spindle length for this setup?
FWIW, I'll be using a Shimano UN 54 bottom bracket. Thanks for any info-
FWIW, I'll be using a Shimano UN 54 bottom bracket. Thanks for any info-
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I did a search and found that others have used the 110mm spindle with the XD600/Surly LHT and all is well. Looks like I should have trusted the specs on the Surly site after all-
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I'd go with a 113. I don't think you can go wrong with a bit more clearance.
The 118 would be for a bike with oversized tubing.
The 118 would be for a bike with oversized tubing.
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This is Africa, 1943. War spits out its violence overhead and the sandy graveyard swallows it up. Her name is King Nine, B-25, medium bomber, Twelfth Air Force. On a hot, still morning she took off from Tunisia to bomb the southern tip of Italy. An errant piece of flak tore a hole in a wing tank and, like a wounded bird, this is where she landed, not to return on this day, or any other day.
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Seems any would work, just a matter of dialing in a precise chain line. Those Shimano cartridge BB can be used with spacers too. I've used those to scoot the drive side a couple mm further outboard to reduce some cross chaining I was getting with a particular bike.
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Just to update this, I installed the 110mm spindle bb (Shimano UN54) and the chainline is ideal. The seat tube on the bike is 28.6mm, I'm running a 26t granny ring on the Sugino XD600 cranks, and there's ample clearance between the 26t chainring and the chainstay. Dropout spacing is 135mm. I don't know why the 110mm spindle works so well with this setup since the general recommendation for these cranks is a bb with a spindle 113mm to 118mm, but 110mm is the one in this case-
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Keep in mind, since the XD rings are comparably lower geared than a typical road bike, you may find the that you use a bigger range of your rear cassette. That was my experience when switching from a 48/38/28 Truvativ Touro to the 46/36/26 Sugino XD.
Also, for a loaded touring rig where you'll spend a lot more time in the middle or triple ring, I prefer to add a spacer on drive side BB cup and bring my chain line outboard 2mm or so. That lets me use more of my cassette from the smaller chain rings without bending the chain too much.
The generic rule of thumb is the middle ring should align with the middle cog on the cassette, but the LHT has longer chain stays, so wider chain angles are tolerable compared with a compact geometry road bike.
Also, for a loaded touring rig where you'll spend a lot more time in the middle or triple ring, I prefer to add a spacer on drive side BB cup and bring my chain line outboard 2mm or so. That lets me use more of my cassette from the smaller chain rings without bending the chain too much.
The generic rule of thumb is the middle ring should align with the middle cog on the cassette, but the LHT has longer chain stays, so wider chain angles are tolerable compared with a compact geometry road bike.
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Thanks for all the posts on bottom bracket spindle length with Sugino cranks.
I have had a lengthy adventure trying to get the chainline right on an old Trek 520 frame that I bought used. I wanted to use a Sugino XD2 crank that I already owned and a nine-speed shimano cassette. I couldn't find any reference for bottom-bracket spindle length, so I ended up trying three different bottom brackets before finally getting it right. Once it all worked out, the Trek 520 from the early 90s was a fine bike and it has now passed on to a friend.
Now I am considering a build-up of a Surly Long Haul trucker and would like to avoid the "trial and error" method of bottom bracket spindle length selection again.
Reading various posts on these great Bike Forums, it seems like a spindle length of 110 is appropriate and some sources seem to say 113.
So, does anyone here have photos or good description of their chainline with a Sugino XD2 triple crank on a Surly Long Haul Trucker with a nine-speed cassette?
In my ideal world, when the chain is on the middle chainring up front, I would like a straight chainline as the chain goes to the middle of the rear cassette. For folks with 110mm spindle lenght, is this the case? What about 113mm spindle length?
With sincere appreciation for your thoughts on this....
I have had a lengthy adventure trying to get the chainline right on an old Trek 520 frame that I bought used. I wanted to use a Sugino XD2 crank that I already owned and a nine-speed shimano cassette. I couldn't find any reference for bottom-bracket spindle length, so I ended up trying three different bottom brackets before finally getting it right. Once it all worked out, the Trek 520 from the early 90s was a fine bike and it has now passed on to a friend.
Now I am considering a build-up of a Surly Long Haul trucker and would like to avoid the "trial and error" method of bottom bracket spindle length selection again.
Reading various posts on these great Bike Forums, it seems like a spindle length of 110 is appropriate and some sources seem to say 113.
So, does anyone here have photos or good description of their chainline with a Sugino XD2 triple crank on a Surly Long Haul Trucker with a nine-speed cassette?
In my ideal world, when the chain is on the middle chainring up front, I would like a straight chainline as the chain goes to the middle of the rear cassette. For folks with 110mm spindle lenght, is this the case? What about 113mm spindle length?
With sincere appreciation for your thoughts on this....
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Just to update this, I installed the 110mm spindle bb (Shimano UN54) and the chainline is ideal. The seat tube on the bike is 28.6mm, I'm running a 26t granny ring on the Sugino XD600 cranks, and there's ample clearance between the 26t chainring and the chainstay. Dropout spacing is 135mm. I don't know why the 110mm spindle works so well with this setup since the general recommendation for these cranks is a bb with a spindle 113mm to 118mm, but 110mm is the one in this case-
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This is kind of an old thread, and I've got several hundred (maybe close to a thousand) miles on the bike now, it's all worked out very well.
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I have basically an identical issue, and I'd like to bring this thread back to life rather than starting a new one from scratch, if that's OK.
I intend to replace a 30/42/52 105 Hollowtech crankset on a 2003 Trek 502 with a 26/36/48 Sugino XD-600 crankset.
The chainline on the existing 105 crankset is 45mm. I'm trying to work out what square taper BB I need to get the same chainline with the XD-600.
Sugino recommend a 113mm spindle, but I have not been able to definitively find out what chainline that will produce.
However, in another thread rednaxela said:
So, I think rednaxela has go to the bottom of that issue, but I have some more questions:
(a) Would the 2.5mm increase in chainline going from the existing 105 crankset to the XD-600 crankset cause any problems? (I am using a 9 speed cassette).
(b) I were to use a 110mm spindle to establish a 46mm chainline would I have enough clearance between the inner chainring and the BB? I know that this worked with the OP's LHT, but would it be fair to draw a conclusion that it will always work?
(c) I were to use a 107mm spindle to establish a 44.5mm chainline would I have enough clearance between the inner chainring and the BB?
I realize that these questions might seem a bit basic, but I'm new to this stuff and would appreciate any help.
Thanks
I intend to replace a 30/42/52 105 Hollowtech crankset on a 2003 Trek 502 with a 26/36/48 Sugino XD-600 crankset.
The chainline on the existing 105 crankset is 45mm. I'm trying to work out what square taper BB I need to get the same chainline with the XD-600.
Sugino recommend a 113mm spindle, but I have not been able to definitively find out what chainline that will produce.
However, in another thread rednaxela said:
I went through the same thing, and wrote Sugino. To their credit, they wrote back pretty quickly, and in english to boot.
The XD300 and 600 are designed for either a 113 or a 118 bb.
A 113mm bb will get you a chainline of 47.5
A 118mm bb will get you a chainline of 50.
The XD300 and 600 are designed for either a 113 or a 118 bb.
A 113mm bb will get you a chainline of 47.5
A 118mm bb will get you a chainline of 50.
(a) Would the 2.5mm increase in chainline going from the existing 105 crankset to the XD-600 crankset cause any problems? (I am using a 9 speed cassette).
(b) I were to use a 110mm spindle to establish a 46mm chainline would I have enough clearance between the inner chainring and the BB? I know that this worked with the OP's LHT, but would it be fair to draw a conclusion that it will always work?
(c) I were to use a 107mm spindle to establish a 44.5mm chainline would I have enough clearance between the inner chainring and the BB?
I realize that these questions might seem a bit basic, but I'm new to this stuff and would appreciate any help.
Thanks
Last edited by Abacus; 01-04-09 at 01:54 AM.
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OK. Having got some information from somewhere else I'll answer my own question.
As well as clearance between the inner gear and the BB, I have to consider whether a smaller spindle will allow enough distance between the inner chain ring and the chain stay [slaps head].
I'll leave this up to the LBS, and just ask them to put on the narrowest one that will fit.
Is a Shimano BB-UN54 decent enough quality for a bike that will do around 4,000km (2,500 miles) per year?
As well as clearance between the inner gear and the BB, I have to consider whether a smaller spindle will allow enough distance between the inner chain ring and the chain stay [slaps head].
I'll leave this up to the LBS, and just ask them to put on the narrowest one that will fit.
Is a Shimano BB-UN54 decent enough quality for a bike that will do around 4,000km (2,500 miles) per year?
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Wow, I remember this thread from way back when. well biked, glad you've enjoyed the ride since then.
For the record, and for comparison, my Sugino XD2 triple got proper chainline on a 130mm-spaced bike using a 110mm bottom bracket.
The XD2 (48/36/26) is on my Centurion Comp TA, which originally had 126mm spacing but I spread it to 130mm for the rebuild.
As for Abacus' question, a UN-54 bottom bracket is fine. The difference with the UN-7X series and the UN-5X series was that the UN-7X had a fully hollow spindle, that was a little bit lighter. I think the seals are the same between the two though.
To my understanding, Shimano discontinued the UN-7X series because of the shrinking market for square-taper bottom brackets.
For the record, and for comparison, my Sugino XD2 triple got proper chainline on a 130mm-spaced bike using a 110mm bottom bracket.
The XD2 (48/36/26) is on my Centurion Comp TA, which originally had 126mm spacing but I spread it to 130mm for the rebuild.
As for Abacus' question, a UN-54 bottom bracket is fine. The difference with the UN-7X series and the UN-5X series was that the UN-7X had a fully hollow spindle, that was a little bit lighter. I think the seals are the same between the two though.
To my understanding, Shimano discontinued the UN-7X series because of the shrinking market for square-taper bottom brackets.
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"c" is not a unit that measures tire width
"c" is not a unit that measures tire width
Last edited by TallRider; 01-04-09 at 11:39 AM.
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#14
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(b) I were to use a 110mm spindle to establish a 46mm chainline would I have enough clearance between the inner chainring and the BB? I know that this worked with the OP's LHT, but would it be fair to draw a conclusion that it will always work?
(c) I were to use a 107mm spindle to establish a 44.5mm chainline would I have enough clearance between the inner chainring and the BB?
I realize that these questions might seem a bit basic, but I'm new to this stuff and would appreciate any help.
Thanks
(c) I were to use a 107mm spindle to establish a 44.5mm chainline would I have enough clearance between the inner chainring and the BB?
I realize that these questions might seem a bit basic, but I'm new to this stuff and would appreciate any help.
Thanks
I have a brand new 107mm UN73 (hollow axle, all steel cups) that I picked up trying to find the right BB length for another bike. I'd be willing to part with it pretty cheap if you determined that was the length you need.
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beautiful! are these current pics, or shot right after you completed the build, but before much riding?
(most of my bike pictures are right after the build, before the bike gets much use. the difference is especially noticeable in my mountain bike, which I don't clean much and can get away with it because it's a singlespeed.)
(most of my bike pictures are right after the build, before the bike gets much use. the difference is especially noticeable in my mountain bike, which I don't clean much and can get away with it because it's a singlespeed.)
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"c" is not a unit that measures tire width
"c" is not a unit that measures tire width
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beautiful! are these current pics, or shot right after you completed the build, but before much riding?
(most of my bike pictures are right after the build, before the bike gets much use. the difference is especially noticeable in my mountain bike, which I don't clean much and can get away with it because it's a singlespeed.)
(most of my bike pictures are right after the build, before the bike gets much use. the difference is especially noticeable in my mountain bike, which I don't clean much and can get away with it because it's a singlespeed.)
Thanks. The pics are from about a month ago I think.
One thing I've changed on the bike in the last few days are the tires. We've been getting a lot of rain, and this is pretty much my everyday bike, so it's seeing some wet weather duty. I really like the look, and ride feel, of the Panaracer Pasela Tourguards (26 x 1.5) that are on the bike in the pics, but they are dicey in wet conditions. I've put Continental Sport Contacts on it (26 x 1.6), and they seem to do better. They're pretty much a true slick, with a lot more rubber on the road than the Panaracers.
I've also re-arranged the headset spacers, and now have the stem at the top of the stack, no spacers above it. I figure if you're going to run with a stem that high, might as well go all out. It is really an incredibly comfortable bike. I have tentative plans in '09 for some real touring on it-
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Hi,
I followed this thread for awhile and finally received my Surly Long Haul Trucker frame. For those who are interested, the 110mm spindle length on the bottom bracket seems to give an excellent chainline with the Sugino SD2 crank.
I followed this thread for awhile and finally received my Surly Long Haul Trucker frame. For those who are interested, the 110mm spindle length on the bottom bracket seems to give an excellent chainline with the Sugino SD2 crank.
Last edited by Doconabike; 01-25-09 at 07:51 PM. Reason: trying to insert photo
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Hi,
I followed this thread for awhile and finally received my Surly Long Haul Trucker frame. For those who are interested, the 110mm spindle length on the bottom bracket seems to give an excellent chainline with the Sugino SD2 crank.
click below for the photo
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...eat=directlink
I followed this thread for awhile and finally received my Surly Long Haul Trucker frame. For those who are interested, the 110mm spindle length on the bottom bracket seems to give an excellent chainline with the Sugino SD2 crank.
click below for the photo
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...eat=directlink
Last edited by well biked; 01-24-09 at 06:41 PM.
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QBP built it originally; the tension was way too high, the dish was off and it was out of true. It was what I expected. I REbuilt it, to be accurate, as I do nearly all "pre-built" custom wheels. But the parts were cheaper that way than if I purchased them separately.
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Maybe a little toe overlap, but nothing to worry about. I think I get some toe overlap with all my road bikes if I'm turning sharply, going slow, and the pedal happens to be in the wrong place. No biggie, I don't even notice it.