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Old 06-17-09, 07:31 PM   #1
Cyclebum 
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hoseless pump use

I recently destroyed 3 tubes using a hoseless pump on presta valves. (My Roadmorp was out of service.) Due to brake clearance problems, I have to pump up the tires after they are on the bike.

What's the secret to using a hoseless pump on presta valves without breaking the valve stem? I did my best to stablize it while pumping, locking my fingers around the spokes, but the back and forth was still too much for the stem.
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Old 06-17-09, 08:01 PM   #2
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Maybe try stabilizing the pump head with your body somehow? You seem to know the secret but just don't have the hand strength to make it work.
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Old 06-17-09, 09:33 PM   #3
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Use the nut that comes with the tube. That should stabilize the valve stem enough.
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Old 06-17-09, 09:44 PM   #4
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The nut does nothing to help stabilize the stem. It only prevents the stem from being pushed in towards the tube.
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Old 06-17-09, 09:49 PM   #5
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Use the nut that comes with the tube. That should stabilize the valve stem enough.
You'd think, but it doesn't, didn't. Far as I'm concerned hoseless pumps are worthless for presta valves.

BTW, Bell makes a pump with a gage and hose you can sometimes find at WM for $15. No Roadmorph for sure, but it does work if you're light on $$$s.
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Old 06-17-09, 10:45 PM   #6
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Well, I'm not sure what to tell you, I've never really had that problem. I rarely use my floor pump because my frame pump is so easy to use and is always in reach.
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Old 06-17-09, 10:47 PM   #7
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You simply have to work on the holding the pump head to the valve more securely, hoses make it easier, but it's possible without a hose.
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Old 06-18-09, 10:15 AM   #8
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I've never had a problem with it. When I'm pumping, I have the wheel sitting on the ground with the valve at the top, hold the pump head in one hand and pump with the other. That way, the valve stem isn't having pressure applied against it.
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Old 06-18-09, 10:20 AM   #9
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been pumping with a no-hose frame pump since the late 70s with no problem... the trick is hooking one's fingers around the tire while holding the pump at the valve and then using straight strokes...

IOW, it's all in the wrist action...
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Old 06-18-09, 11:07 AM   #10
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Thumb around the tire, fingers gripping the body of the pump: always works for me with the
Zefal HPX that seem to last forever. Still using one I got in the '70s, Worked on the minipumps
I seemed to throw away after a few years til I went back to the HP/HPX just as well.
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Old 06-18-09, 11:52 AM   #11
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Have a nice, old Silca Impero that is a frame-fitting pump from the 1970's - 80's. No hose and a presta-head. Never had a problem using it. I just wrap my fingers around the end of it and hold on.
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Old 06-18-09, 12:05 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclebum View Post
I recently destroyed 3 tubes using a hoseless pump on presta valves. (My Roadmorp was out of service.) Due to brake clearance problems, I have to pump up the tires after they are on the bike.

What's the secret to using a hoseless pump on presta valves without breaking the valve stem? I did my best to stablize it while pumping, locking my fingers around the spokes, but the back and forth was still too much for the stem.
I've used hoseless pumps for years on presta-values and I don't have problems.

Here is what I suspect people are not doing who do have problems.

1) Use the other hand to stabilize the pump head so it (and the valve) doesn't move. It takes muscle to stabilize the pump head. (if you don't feel it as you pump, you aren't stabilizing the pump head.)
2) Pump against the other hand (not against the valve). Think of pushing the pump handle against the hand that is stabilizing the valve. Note that you'll feel the other hand forcing back against the other hand.
3) Pump slowly and in control. I think that people who are ripping valves think that pumping quickly is easier (especially as the pressure goes up). It's actually easier to use slow and steady strokes.

Last edited by njkayaker; 06-18-09 at 12:10 PM.
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Old 06-19-09, 04:11 PM   #13
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Thanks to all for your post. I am obviously a kluz where hoseless pumps are concerned. Your suggestions make sense and your experience with hoseless pumps certainly prove their utility.

That being said, I hope to never again have to use one. But, god forbid, should the occasion present itself, at least I've got the technique from experts.

I think my bad experience related to the "pump slowly and in control" advice. At the time, I was on tour, stressed, and did neither. It just got worse as I blew tubes.
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Old 06-19-09, 04:21 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclebum View Post
Far as I'm concerned hoseless pumps are worthless for presta valves.
I have never broken a valve stem using a frame pump, even with the wheel mounted. It's a combination of upper body strength and super technique.
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Old 06-19-09, 05:50 PM   #15
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Silly question: Should the nut go on the inside or outside of the rim? It seems that if it were on the inside you would not be able to damage the tube by pulling on the valve stem.
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Old 06-21-09, 05:27 PM   #16
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Silly question: Should the nut go on the inside or outside of the rim? It seems that if it were on the inside you would not be able to damage the tube by pulling on the valve stem.
The nut goes on the outside of the rim. One reason it goes there is so that the valve doesn't get pushed into the rim when you put the pump onto it.

If it served the purpose you suggest, I would think that the valve would be designed to do that without an extra piece and the extra machining required to use it.

Quote:
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I think my bad experience related to the "pump slowly and in control" advice.
That's the secret (don't tell anybody!).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclebum View Post
At the time, I was on tour, stressed, and did neither. It just got worse as I blew tubes.
Dude, it's just a flat! Definitely, nothing to get stressed about!

Last edited by njkayaker; 06-21-09 at 05:30 PM.
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Old 06-23-09, 08:34 AM   #17
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Just don't hold the wheel AT ALL with either of your hands, and don't brace the wheel against anything. The wheel has to ne completely free. Then one hand on the end of the pump that attaches to the valve, and pump with the other hand.
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Old 06-23-09, 10:40 AM   #18
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Just don't hold the wheel AT ALL with either of your hands, and don't brace the wheel against anything. The wheel has to be completely free. Then one hand on the end of the pump that attaches to the valve, and pump with the other hand.
Agreed.
And I've found that bracing the back of the hand holding the valve end, against the inner side of the knee, makes things even easier.
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