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Old 07-31-09, 04:24 PM   #1
jimfols
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15/16/15 Spokes??

Hello,

I have been using 15/16/15 X 36 spokes for many years with no problems.

I am building new wheels with 32 spokes (cross 3).
Mavic Open Pro/Shimano 105 (10 speed).

I have 15/16/15 spokes that are the correct length.

I weigh 160 lbs.

My question is, does anyone have any experience using these 15/16/15 spokes
in a 32 spoke wheel?

Thank You.
Jim
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Old 07-31-09, 04:37 PM   #2
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1.8/1.6/1.8mm in a 700c wheel sounds a bit weak for a rear. front should be ok.
most 700c wheels I've seen use 14ga (2.0mm) spokes that are either straight or butted.
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Old 07-31-09, 04:39 PM   #3
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I've had good luck with them on my race wheels. Actually have a 24/28h wheelset with them for my track bike. I was anywhere between 145-165lbs during the time I was racing track. Also have them on a 28/32h tubular wheelset on my crit bike as well. The double-butting actually makes for a more durable wheel that doesn't go out of true easily (compared to straight-gauge spokes).
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Old 07-31-09, 04:55 PM   #4
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I would use 2.0-1.8-2.0 on the rear wheel driveside. And either 2.0-1.8-2.0 or 2.0-1.5-2.0 on the rear non-driveside.

Last edited by Al1943; 07-31-09 at 05:01 PM.
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Old 08-01-09, 09:47 AM   #5
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I've got a pair of 6speed, 32 spoke wheels with those spokes, and they work fine. When I build a 10s wheel, i put a heavier spoke on the drive side, just to equalize the strain between both sides, but I'm nit sure that is necessary. It's easier to build with heavier spokes because they twist less, but 15g spokes are more than strong enough for a 32 spoke wheel.
Back in the day we used 36 spokes with sew-up tires, but modern rims have a deeper section, which makes the rim stronger, so it's safe to use fewer spokes. 32 is plenty for most rims, I'm riding 24 spokes now with no problem, and I weigh 195. The 24 spoke wheel has 2mm spokes, but I think it needs that for rigidity, or to make it easier to build (i didn't build it.), not for strength.

em

em
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Old 08-01-09, 10:14 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al1943 View Post
I would use 2.0-1.8-2.0 on the rear wheel driveside. And either 2.0-1.8-2.0 or 2.0-1.5-2.0 on the rear non-driveside.
I'm not a particular fan of that build because it uses two different sizes of nipples. I once worked in a shop where somebody got 15 gauge and 15 gauge nipples mixed together in the same can. The only way that I could tell them apart was to test thread them onto a spoke. 14 gauge nipples will thread quite nicely onto a 15 gauge spoke but they won't hold.

Can you say PITA?
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Old 08-01-09, 10:31 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Al1943 View Post
I would use 2.0-1.8-2.0 on the rear wheel driveside. And either 2.0-1.8-2.0 or 2.0-1.5-2.0 on the rear non-driveside.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retro Grouch View Post
I'm not a particular fan of that build because it uses two different sizes of nipples. I once worked in a shop where somebody got 15 gauge and 15 gauge nipples mixed together in the same can. The only way that I could tell them apart was to test thread them onto a spoke. 14 gauge nipples will thread quite nicely onto a 15 gauge spoke but they won't hold.

Can you say PITA?
Actually, 2.0-1.8-2.0 and 2.0-1.5-2.0 use the same size nipples, but you are right that different size nipples are a PITA in a shop. OTOH I don't use 2.0-1.5-2.0 because they are expensive, twist too easily and are no stronger or lighter than a 1.8-1.6-1.8. In actual use, they are probably weaker because you can end up with a failure caused by torsional stress, if you are not careful.
Sometimes I use straight gauge one side and a DB on the other, so all the nipples are the same size, and sometimes I just deal with 2 sets of nipples. I lot depends on what stuff I have around my shop at the time.

em
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Old 08-01-09, 10:36 AM   #8
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... 15 gauge and 15 gauge nipples mixed together in the same can.
Man, I *hate* it when that happens!
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Old 08-01-09, 10:39 AM   #9
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Actually, 2.0-1.8-2.0 and 2.0-1.5-2.0 use the same size nipples,
Oops, you're right. The original post had to do with 15 gauge spokes and I didn't read Al's post carefully enough to notice that he wasn't recommending mixing 14 gauge and 15 gauge spokes on the same wheel.
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Old 08-01-09, 11:14 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eddy m View Post
OTOH I don't use 2.0-1.5-2.0 because they are expensive, twist too easily and are no stronger or lighter than a 1.8-1.6-1.8. In actual use, they are probably weaker because you can end up with a failure caused by torsional stress, if you are not careful.
I'm not disagreeing with you but from my experience with DT Revolutions, 2.0-1.5-2.0, the only problem I've had is on the driveside rear where they stretch too much from the higher tension needed to offset the low tension on the non-driveside. On wheel sets that I've built for myself with all Revolution spokes the DS rear spokes over a period of 5 years have stretched to the point that there are not enough threads left to maintain wheel dish or make truing adjustments. These I have rebuilt with Competition 2.0-1.8-2.0 on the DS rear. I have not had any break.

Al
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Old 08-01-09, 02:14 PM   #11
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Thanks for all the replies, that's exactly what I was asking for.

I've been building my own wheels for over 40 years but this is the first time using less than 36 spokes.

I call it moving along with the times http://www.bikeforums.net/images/smilies/lol.gif.

I'm going for it.

Jim
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Old 08-01-09, 03:42 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al1943 View Post
I'm not disagreeing with you but from my experience with DT Revolutions, 2.0-1.5-2.0, the only problem I've had is on the driveside rear where they stretch too much from the higher tension needed to offset the low tension on the non-driveside. On wheel sets that I've built for myself with all Revolution spokes the DS rear spokes over a period of 5 years have stretched to the point that there are not enough threads left to maintain wheel dish or make truing adjustments. These I have rebuilt with Competition 2.0-1.8-2.0 on the DS rear. I have not had any break.

Al
If a spoke continues to stretch after the wheel is built, that spoke has exceeded its yield strength and has failed. YOu are not only not disagreeing with me, you are providing testimony that I am right. The only good reason I have ever heard for using those extremely butted spokes is that the shop doesn't need to worry about mixing large and small nipples.

em
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