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  1. #1
    randalll
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    taking my bike back for a refund. advice please

    hey there

    im returning a bike to the store today to see whether they'll refund it.

    when i bought it 3 weeks ago it wasn't assemmbled properly, i found metal shards in the BB shell suggesting it had been cross threaded, and just today i found oil leaking from the forks.

    what would be the best thing to say to them when returning it?

    i want to make a solid case so they'll be inclined to refund me.

    many bike shops would try to tell me theres nothing wrong with it just for the sake of their books.


    also.. would it matter that there's a bit of rust on the stem screws.


    any help and advice appreciated

    randall
    Last edited by randalll; 08-12-09 at 04:41 PM.

  2. #2
    My bike's better than me! neil0502's Avatar
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    The metal in the bb shell (ideally) could mean the shell had been faced and chased -- a good thing.

    Surface rust on fasteners isn't a big deal, though it's avoided with application of grease to the threads prior to assembly.

    What (else) has you believing that it wasn't assembled properly? In other words, exactly why do you want to return it?

  3. #3
    randalll
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    the forks were the final straw but ive had problems with the drivetrain ever since buying it, its noisy and jumps a lot

    i know this problem could be fixed with a good service but its the service im getting that's unnacceptable, ive spent loads on train fares down to the shop to try and get them to sort it out, but they never really take the time to look at it.

    also, the BB cups should be screwed in all the way, anything else isnt proper assemmbly, and i expect a first class assembly on a new £500 bike.

    anyway im not looking for you to persuade me not to go, ive made up my mind about this, i just want some advice for talking to them about it.

  4. #4
    My bike's better than me! neil0502's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by randalll View Post
    the forks were the final straw but ive had problems with the drivetrain ever since buying it, its noisy and jumps a lot

    i know this problem could be fixed with a good service but its the service im getting that's unnacceptable, ive spent loads on train fares down to the shop to try and get them to sort it out, but they never really take the time to look at it.

    also, the BB cups should be screwed in all the way, anything else isnt proper assemmbly, and i expect a first class assembly on a new £500 bike.

    anyway im not looking for you to persuade me not to go, ive made up my mind about this, i just want some advice for talking to them about it.
    I'm not trying "to persuade you not to go." I'm trying to determine what your concerns are, how valid they are, and what other options there may be for addressing them.

    In truth? You've got a big chip on your shoulder. If I can detect it, then the shop will, too.

    Good luck to you.....

  5. #5
    randalll
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    Quote Originally Posted by neil0502 View Post
    I'm not trying "to persuade you not to go." I'm trying to determine what your concerns are, how valid they are, and what other options there may be for addressing them.

    In truth? You've got a big chip on your shoulder. If I can detect it, then the shop will, too.

    Good luck to you.....
    yeah sorry about that, ive just been stressed about this, i dont have much money and saved up for ages for this bike.

    i just get the impression the bike shop may refuse me a refund not over the state of the bike but the way i present the problems.

  6. #6
    You Know!? For Kids! jsharr's Avatar
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    Work out exactly what you want to say. Get a mate to play sales clerk and run it past him a time or two to work out the bugs.

    Be very clear about why you want to return the bike and what you expect in return. Is there another bike in stock that would satisfy you, etc.

    Are you willing to pay the shop a restocking fee? It would not be to much for them to ask, as they now have a bike that has been worked on by you, or others, as it sounds like you have had the cranks off and the bottom bracket apart.

    Just some thoughts from my end.

    At the very least, stay calm, friendly, relaxed, but go in with a clear plan of what your expectations are and be willing to be a bit flexible.

    Best of luck.
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  7. #7
    Senior Member badmother's Avatar
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    Seriousely. He went to the shop several times by train. They are not taking it seriousely. Oil leaking, drivetrain not working properly. Of course he is going to be suspicius and look for further damage, and also look for more problems since he is not happy with the bike and no longer trust the shop.

    Why should he pay anything? He should have his train rides refunded and the bike phurchase sorted out one way or another. If there is sonething wrong (unfixable) with the bike I do not know but for sure there must be something wrong with the shop.
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  8. #8
    Senior Member turtlewoman's Avatar
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    Try writing down all your concerns in an objective, non-aggressive way. I agree with what isharr said. Role-play with a couple of different people. The shop, I feel, should be willing to give you a refund or do-with seriousness and care-the work it takes to get it right. It sounds like they were very sloppy. If they don't deal with you in a fair way is there something like "small claims court" in the UK. This is a court where you can take your grievances and not have to go to an attorney and incur a bunch of fees. I'd check out all my options here. They should "play ball" with you and get it right.
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  9. #9
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    You crack me up, Randal!

    WHOOO!!!

    Good luck.
    Chain stores are a little more likely to give you a refund, In my experience.

  10. #10
    You Know!? For Kids! jsharr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by badmother View Post
    Seriousely. SNIP.
    Not aware of all the back story on this one. My answer was based solely on the information in this thread.
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    Quote Originally Posted by colorider View Post
    Phobias are for irrational fears. Fear of junk ripping badgers is perfectly rational. Those things are nasty.

  11. #11
    I have senior moments... bikinfool's Avatar
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    You're not sharing your bath with your bike anymore? Do you service your bike in the bath too?
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  12. #12
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    Sorry, but I just don't see any justification for demanding a refund, after 3 weeks.

    The poor service is certainly not a justification. Try taking a car back because you don't like the service.

    If there is something wrong with the tune, they should correct it, to the degree that it is correctable with the components.

    Noisy drivetrain could just mean that more should have been spent on quality components, as could the difficulty tuning. I don't know that is the case, but it is one possible explanation.

    The fact that you mentally jumped immediately from metal shards in the bottom bracket, to somebody must have done something wrong, is totally unsupportable, and grounds for them to not take the bike back.

    If the fork is leaking oil, I'm assuming a suspension fork here, then the fork should be repaired. If it is weeping, well, they all do that to a degree.

    I wish you the best of luck, but it may very well be a case of "You get what you pay for" You can't go cheap and then complain about quality.

  13. #13
    Senior Member Proofide's Avatar
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    That isn't remotely cheap. Sure, you can pay three or four thousand pounds for a bike here (if you're daft enough), but £500 is still a lot. It's more than I'd ever pay for a new bike (a Schwinn Paramount might be another matter!). The mistake here was not to return the bike immediately, and you shouldn't have dismantled anything. Under UK legislation, if you buy something which is not of merchantable quality, not fit for the purpose for which it was sold, and inaccurately described, you are entitled to reject it and demand a refund. It's one thing to know your rights under the law, and another to secure them. Shops will try their hardest to deny you these rights. There is indeed a small claims court here, which deals with claims up to a maximum amount, which temporarily escapes me. I feel it may be less than £500 - maybe £300 or thereabouts.
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  14. #14
    S'toon trail rider! MisterK's Avatar
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    if its a big box store bike theyll prolly tell you that theyll send it back to the manufacturer to get "rebuilt"
    however if its from an LBS, ur better off asking for repairs or a total rebuild. most LBS include a free tune with the sale of a bike, and im sure if there is a defect im sure theyll gladly repair anything especially if its only been 3 weeks. unless youve clearly beat the bike to crap, then ur out of steam...
    what do you ride anyways?

    to add: tho i did buy a GT "dirt jump" style MTB from wally world, rode it down the street and the whole crank fell off, i was actually able to get my money back but only after asking to speak to the district manager

  15. #15
    randalll
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    i took it to the store today and they denied me the refund. they said they were going to "check the forks and bottom bracket for damage.. and if there is any damage.. Refund, Replace or Repair".


    Sorry, but I just don't see any justification for demanding a refund, after 3 weeks.

    The poor service is certainly not a justification. Try taking a car back because you don't like the service.
    well they could just sell me anything then, surely they must have standards to be met when they're assembling bikes, i feel like this service fell short, and its not just the state that the bike is in now, if it's not set up properly then there is chance that parts may have been damaged, and will fail sooner rather than later.


    The fact that you mentally jumped immediately from metal shards in the bottom bracket, to somebody must have done something wrong, is totally unsupportable, and grounds for them to not take the bike back.
    when i went to pick the bike up the left bottom bracket cup wasn't screwed down all the way... it had about 6-7 mm of threads showing.... thats improper assembly surely? although i didn't know this straight away, i just thought it was a different type of bottom bracket. it was only when i took it off to try to make sense of the drivetrain noises i found the metal shards in there, and when i put the cup back on i found it went in a lot further than before


    when i told them about this they said they dont install the bottom brackets into the frame, they come to the store already installed... so it's not their mistake.


    before taking it to the store i phoned to describe the problem, and the assistant manager said that they've had similar reports of the same fork (Rock Shox Dart 3) leaking oil, he said its a known problem and it happens to 1 in 200-300 Dart forks.

    considering this surely im within my rights to demand a refund?

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Proofide View Post
    That isn't remotely cheap. Sure, you can pay three or four thousand pounds for a bike here (if you're daft enough), but £500 is still a lot. It's more than I'd ever pay for a new bike (a Schwinn Paramount might be another matter!). The mistake here was not to return the bike immediately, and you shouldn't have dismantled anything. Under UK legislation, if you buy something which is not of merchantable quality, not fit for the purpose for which it was sold, and inaccurately described, you are entitled to reject it and demand a refund. It's one thing to know your rights under the law, and another to secure them. Shops will try their hardest to deny you these rights. There is indeed a small claims court here, which deals with claims up to a maximum amount, which temporarily escapes me. I feel it may be less than £500 - maybe £300 or thereabouts.

    I didn't mean to imply that 500 was cheap, just that at that price range there are a lot of compromises that builders make in groupos. A higher quality frameset in that price range will come with a lower quality group, as a rule of thumb, and the inverse is also true. In any case 500 will only buy a moderately priced group, never mind a group and suspension fork. A full suspension bike in that price range could generally be considered low quality. It depends a great deal on where those compromises were made.

  17. #17
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    500 pounds = $850 US dollars. What components are on the bike? Here in Portland, $850 will buy a MTB with Deore LX / Sram X.7 level components, disc brakes, and a so-so fork for singletrack. Properly tuned Deore LX should not have problems with jumping gears, etc.

  18. #18
    randalll
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg_R View Post
    500 pounds = $850 US dollars. What components are on the bike? Here in Portland, $850 will buy a MTB with Deore LX / Sram X.7 level components, disc brakes, and a so-so fork for singletrack. Properly tuned Deore LX should not have problems with jumping gears, etc.


    yeah its mostly Deore components.. LX rear derailleur. Hayes Stroker Ryde disc brakes.. Rock Shox Dart 3 fork... FSA Alpha Drive crankset
    Last edited by randalll; 08-12-09 at 04:51 PM.

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