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  1. #1
    he said member ls01's Avatar
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    self loosening spokes; part II

    Well, its been about 200 miles on my cxp 33 wheels. So today I started up an overpass and every time I put any real force on the pedal I could feel and hear the rear brake rubbing on the wheel. I have aprox. 1/8 of an inch of play on both sides of the brake. I stopped at a local bike shop and explained my plight, he retensioned my spokes for me, Bringing them back up to spec. This is the 4 th time this season I have had this problem. I used DTdouble butted spokes, linsead oil for thread locker. they did last about twice as long this time but this is getting stupid.
    o.k. I have one builder that I spoke to say that I should be using straight gage spokes because my weight (240 lbs.) is streching the lighter gage spokes. Causing the spokes on the bottom to loosen.
    At this point I am out of ideas. Does this make any sense to anyone? could it be plausable that this is the cure for my wheel woes?
    Any opinions are welcome.

  2. #2
    Senior Member
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    This sounds like the wheel never had enough tension, or the nipples don't fit the spokes.
    You can try locktight on the threads this should not be necessary but it won't hurt as long as the locktight isn't the extra strong type.
    What kind of spokes are they. Are you sure they are loosening and not stretching? If they are 1.5 mm in the middle they could be stretching. But I doubt that is the problem.
    I see no reason to go to straight gauge spokes, but it may be that the double butted spokes are wound up during tensioning and as they unwind they will loosen. Stress relieving should should help with the windup but I hold mine with pliers to avoid windup.

    Al

  3. #3
    In the right lane gerv's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ls01 View Post
    Well, its been about 200 miles on my cxp 33 wheels. So today I started up an overpass and every time I put any real force on the pedal I could feel and hear the rear brake rubbing on the wheel. I have aprox. 1/8 of an inch of play on both sides of the brake. I stopped at a local bike shop and explained my plight, he retensioned my spokes for me, Bringing them back up to spec. This is the 4 th time this season I have had this problem. I used DTdouble butted spokes, linsead oil for thread locker. they did last about twice as long this time but this is getting stupid.
    o.k. I have one builder that I spoke to say that I should be using straight gage spokes because my weight (240 lbs.) is streching the lighter gage spokes. Causing the spokes on the bottom to loosen.
    At this point I am out of ideas. Does this make any sense to anyone? could it be plausable that this is the cure for my wheel woes?
    Any opinions are welcome.

    Did the mechanic use a tension meter? Where did you get this wheel? BTW on the non-drive side of the rear wheel, you won't need any linseed oil. What you prefer is no oil at all.

  4. #4
    he said member ls01's Avatar
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    Ok, well, I built these wheels myself. Spokes are not wound up I used a marker on the spokes to mark them. Linseed oil dries up to a spoke prep type locking compound. I have a tension meter.its a park .yes non drive side spokes are about 65%of drive side spokes, drive side were about 120 - 130, with the occasional odd ball. spoke nipples are the correct ones and the spokes are 2.0 - 1.8.
    Like I said this is the 4 th time this has happened. and its not my only wheelset that does this. I also have a set of open pro's thata re doing the same thing but I ride the cpx 33 more.

  5. #5
    In the right lane gerv's Avatar
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    I wonder if there is a problem with the rim. If you loosened all the spokes, would the wheel start looking rather twisted? I have tried to tension wheels only to discover that the rim was severely twisted. I have also seen true wheels that were only true because some of the spokes were very loose.

    If this is the case, I hope it doesn't cause you to give up wheelbuilding. Perhaps you could write it off to "experience".

  6. #6
    he said member ls01's Avatar
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    I wont give up, I just need to figure out why this keeps happening and what to do to fix it. I have a couple of other rear wheels that do this too. I think I will go with straight gage spokes and some kind of prep and see what happens. if that works then I can fix the other wheels that do this too.
    Last edited by ls01; 08-13-09 at 08:54 PM.

  7. #7
    billyymc
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    This is the same problem I'm having with my Roval Pave wheel on a 2007 Specialized Tricross Comp. Have had it trued and tensioned by LBS three times this year. The last time it held (with loctite) for about 300 miles. Then the last couple times I've just trued it myself on the bike.

  8. #8
    afraid of whales Mr IGH's Avatar
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    If the wheel has less than 2~3 turns for dish, your wheelbuilder is the issue. If your wheel has more than 2~2 turns for dish, get a new rear hub with less dish.
    IGH's, Dyno Hubs, LED lights and old frames

  9. #9
    billyymc
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    Mr IGH - can you explain that a little more to someone not versed in wheelbuilding terminology?

    I understand dish (sort of), but not your comment.

  10. #10
    afraid of whales Mr IGH's Avatar
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    Back in the old days of 120mm, 6 speed hubs (non-ultra), to correctly dish a wheel, it took 5~6 extra turns of the nipple on the cogs side compared to the left side of the hub to align the rim correctly in the frame. This created a very large difference in spoke tension between the spokes on cog compared to the non-cog side of the wheel. Heavy riders would rip these wheels to shreds no matter what I did. The non-cog side would come loose, sometimes I used dykes to crimp the nipples so they'd hold tight.

    Then the world went to 126mm rear hubs, removing 2-3 nipple turns of dish (ie spoke tension differential). The wheels would hold tight just fine even under heavy riders. Heavy riders will still bend rims, the spokes will hold tight if the wheel is built correctly.

    If the hub is an 130mm, there's no reason for a well built wheel to come loose, no matter the rim, spokes or rider weight/style.
    IGH's, Dyno Hubs, LED lights and old frames

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