gcasillo

Title pretty much says it all. I bought a Veloce group last Fall, and I finally got around to installing it on a frameset today. When opening the bag containing the BB cups, I noticed that the retainer clip was missing. This is out of the original Campagnolo bag. For reference, this is the little metal clip I'm talking about:



It fits on the drive side BB cup.

Who do I contact to get one of these sent to me so I can follow through and complete my build?

DaveSSS 

Wouldn't it make sense to contact the seller of the BB cups? Be sure that the clip is not hiding at the bottom of the box. If the cups didn't come in a box, then the seller probably failed to include the clip.

You can buy the clip separately. A local shop might have one if they deal in Campy. Many shops are 99% SRAM/Shimano and wouldn't have one.

https://aebike.com/product/campagnolo...r9920-qc30.htm

This clip is neded. Some people think it's a safety item to keep the crankarm from falling off in case the center fixing bolt comes loose. Not so. It's an essential part of the design that keeps the right side of the crank from moving to the right. The wave washer on the left side would allow close to 2mm of movement without the clip and a total loss of bearing preload.

gcasillo

As I stated above, out of the Campagnolo bag that contained them, there was no clip included with the BB cups. So, I don't expect the seller, an online outfit in the UK, will be of much assistance.

Agreed that it's an essential part which is why I am more adamant about the manufacturer, Campagnolo in this case, providing it without extra charge.

Steev

What will an e-mail to the supplier cost? You could even use the phone, the time difference is easy enough to work around. Might as well start there.
If you get no joy, try Campagnolo. Most manufacturers prefer you talk to the retailer, but will probably help if you've tried the retailer.
Failing that, you've been given a source for the part, You'll have to eat some cost, but at least you will be able to use a pretty pricey crankset that's not much use as it is. I bet it will be much faster to get the part.

DaveSSS 

My BB cups never came in a single bag. They come is a box with each cup bagged separately. IIRC, the clip was not in a bag, it was just in the small box. I think that your issue is with the seller, not Campy.

I'd just buy the clip wherever I could, unless the seller will mail you one.

gcasillo

You're right, DaveSSS. My parts came in Campagnolo bags and bubble wrap but with no original boxes. I'm just going to buy the clip locally tomorrow. Way it goes.

operator

This is 100% wrong.

1) Campy documents refer to it as a "safety spring".
2) Pretend you did not have the spring in hand, install crank normally. There is absolutely no play, or loss of preload when the fixing bolt is up to torque.
3) There is no way two protruding pins into the drive cup has absolutely any bearing (excuse the pun) on preload or proper setting thereof

I've repeated #2 test 5 times now, on different bikes with different cranks. The safety spring, is just that a safety clip designed to keep the drive arm retained in case the bolt comes completely off/loses torque.

As an addendum the Park instructions "The wavy washer is in effect the "bearing adjustment." And the "retaining clip" (their terms) is installed last *after* the center bolt is torqued up.

https://www.parktool.com/repair/readc...ner.asp?id=154

operator

Retail packaging for super record/record is individual bags for each cup, and the retaining clip is prepackaged with the drive cup, sealed inside a small bag.

DaveSSS 

Operator...


Here is a link to the official Campy crank installation instructions. I found no use of the term "safety spring". It is referred to as a retaining spring. https://www.campagnolo.com/repository...kset-02-09.pdf

The retaining spring is NOT installed last according to Campy. It is installed before the left side crankarm is in place. That allows for a test of proper retaining spring function by tyring to move the right crankarm from side to side, being sure that the spring is doing it's job.

Try this:

Assemble a UT crank, but leave the wave washer and spring clip off. In this state, there is a little less than 3mm of side play available, depending on the exact width of the BB shell. The wave washer is made of spring steel that is about .6mm in thickness. The unrestrained wave washer height is about 3mm. To produce a preload tension, you know that the washer must be compressed by some amount, but less than 2.4mm. The BB shell alone can deviate in width by 1.6mm. Put the wave washer in place and reassemble the crank. The wave washer exerts a force against the left side bearing that is transferred through the spindle and forces the right side bearing tight against the face of it's bearing cup. It applies a force in the 20-60 pound range (as best I can measure), depending on the exact width of the BB shell (the wider the shell, the greater the force). There can be no preload tension on the right bearing unless it maintains contact with the face of it's bearing cup. Even with the wave washer in place, the crank can still be moved to the right by 1-2mm - fully compressing the wave washer if enough load is applied - but only if the retaining spring is not in place. If fully compressed, with no retaining spring in place, preload tension would vary constantly and could become excessive on the left or zero on the right, if the right bearing loses contact with the face of the bearing cup. The spring clip is what restricts the movement down to less than .5mm and maintains a relatively uniform preload tension. It also prevents both bearings from moving from side to side, causing wear on the cup bores.

If you want to believe that the retaining spring is only a safety item, fine, but please post something from Campy that states this to be the case. I say that it's far more important in preventing side to side movement that can wear the bearing cups and insures a more uniform preload tension on both bearings, to prevent premature bearing failure. I would never leave the retaining spring off.

If the spring was truly a safety item, it does a poor job. If the center fixing bolt comes loose, there's nothing to hold the left crankarm in place. Both crankarms would drop to the bottom of the stroke and drop the rider on the pavemment before either one would come completely off.

operator

I have official campy documentation, from a real campy box that states "safety spring". Here is a CC of the actual instruction.

https://www.probikekit.com/PDF/Crankset%20Inst.pdf

operator

The job being, retaining the arm in place which is indisputable fact. Bearing preload is speculation on your part. There is NO discernable movement of the drive arm without the "retaining clip" with the rest of the crankset properly installed on a shell width 68 +/- 0.8mm (direct from campy spec), not 1.6mm as you state. The wavy washer fucntion is the "bearing adjustment" as stated by Park, and as a "thrust washer" by campy. Nowhere is there any indication the retaining clip (note the word that is used, "retaining") is anything but a crankarm retainer.

If the expected job of the retaining clip were to prevent movement of the bearings (seriously, 2 tiny metal pins is going to do that?) without any force on them (evidenced by the fact that the clips are easily removed before the crankbolt is loosened, and by the fact that they are not bent on removal) then it fails in doing that as well.

You can claim that campy does not explicitly state that the "safety spring"/"retaining clip" is supposed to be for safety or to retain anything. At the same time i'd like you to post something from Campy indicating that the retaining clip is essential to bearing adjustment

Your own campy PDF states to quote:

"Gently move the right crank sideways as if to remove it from the bb cup to make sure the spring has been fitted correctly and that it retains the crank"

Absoultely nowhere in this installation is bearing preload mentioned with the retaining clip.

DaveSSS 

One correction. I said that the BB shell width can deviate in width by 1.6mm and that is correct. 67.2-68.8 is a range of 1.6mm. I did not say plus or minus 1.6mm. I've worked in precision machining for over 20 years, so I fully inderstand tolerances.

Apparently, you don't understand how the wave washer works, or refuse to acknowledge how it works. If you'd measure the wave washer, you could verify the dimensions I've posted are accurate. That washer, being about 3mm in height, unrestrained, can only preload the bearings if it's compressed, but it should never be fully compressed. The spring clip is what prevents that from happening.

Apparenty you don't have the equipment to verify the crank's axial play. If the BB width is exactly 68mm, then you know for certain that the crank could be moved to the right by at least .8mm, if the retaining spring is not in place, since the BB can be .8mm wider and not over-compress the wave washer. If the BB is at the minimum 67.2mm in width there is at least 1.6mm of possible side play. Even at the maximum width of 68.8mm, there must still be some movment possible, because a wave washer would never be fully compressed (too much bearing preload would result). If you push with enough force and squarely against the center of the left crankarm, it should move to the right, unless the retaining spring is in place to prevent that movement.

Of course the retaining spring has no force on it with the crank at rest. It's not supposed to. The wave washer applies a force that ensures that the right side bearing is tight against the face of the cup. The retaining spring pins protruding next to the bearing only come into play if pedaling forces are applied the would try to move the crank to the right. That force is not all that large since the sping washer will exhibit a substantial amount of compression with 50 lbs applied to it. If you seriously question the strength of the retaining spring, do a calculation of the force required to shear off just one end of the spring. It's .063 inch in diameter. The area is .0031 square inches. Multiply by the 75,000 psi shear strength of a typical steel. It would take a force of about 230 lbs to shear off a pin of that diameter. There are two pins holding the bearing in place. That's a lot of retention strength.

With all the safety warnings included with products today, I can't imagine that there would be nothing said about the consequences of leaving off the retaining spring if it was in any way related to safety. As I noted, keeping just one of the crank arms from falling off the bike isn't much of a safety improvement. The whole idea that the retaining spring is a safety device is what's pure conjecture - started by someone who obviously does not understand the crank's design. Like you, that person just couldn't figure out what it's purpose really was.