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Thread: Is this normal?

  1. #1
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    Is this normal?

    Hey all,
    A friend of mine just gave him an older road bike of his. It hasn't been ridden is a long while so i began to tighten and adjust most of everything. As i got to the test ride, i heard some clanking in the back, i look at the back closer and saw that the 4 biggest cogs on my cassette (i hope thats correct terminology) were able to spin slightly while i held the lower 4, or if the chain was on the lower 4. When the chain is on one of upper 4, the lower 4 cogs can turn, but very slightly.

    The spin isn't a huge spin, its a tiny wiggle, but i have never seen this before and i just wanted to make sure it was ok.

    any thoughts?

    thanks

  2. #2
    Senior Member cnnrmccloskey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barefootdan View Post
    Hey all,
    A friend of mine just gave him an older road bike of his. It hasn't been ridden is a long while so i began to tighten and adjust most of everything. As i got to the test ride, i heard some clanking in the back, i look at the back closer and saw that the 4 biggest cogs on my cassette (i hope thats correct terminology) were able to spin slightly while i held the lower 4, or if the chain was on the lower 4. When the chain is on one of upper 4, the lower 4 cogs can turn, but very slightly.

    The spin isn't a huge spin, its a tiny wiggle, but i have never seen this before and i just wanted to make sure it was ok.

    any thoughts?

    thanks
    Video?
    I'm having trouble visualizing this problem
    Quote Originally Posted by Braden1550 View Post
    Monocoque unicycles with internal gear hubs, ridden by extortionists with an excellent sense of balance.

    You'll see. Unless you drilled out your eyes because they were too heavy.

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    lock ring on tight? aluminum freehub body?

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    hm, cant do a video right now. ill try to elaborate.

    Its as though the cassette broken? I dont think it is cause itd be much worse, but then again, this is why im here. Whenever i shift into the smaller 4 gears (size wise) the bigger 4 can move together separately from the smaller 4. By moving i mean spin slightly. kind of like the tiny amount of play you get right before your cassette clicks to the next [gear?]. It wont click into a new spot, but it has about the same amount of play. i can hear something in the back of my bike making a sound when i hit a bump, which i believe this is it since ive looked and made sure everything else is tight.
    anyways, to sum it up in simpler words, picture the whole cassette. the chain is on the smallest cog. i can move the 4 biggest cogs (by move i mean spin as though it was moving with a chain on it) a tiny amount. The smaller 4 cogs wont move when i move the 4 big cogs which makes me worry.

    I hope that kind of gives a picture. ill try to get pictures or a video soon, if this didnt help

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    Quote Originally Posted by reptilezs View Post
    lock ring on tight? aluminum freehub body?
    The lockring is on tight. i dont have a chain whip, so maybe it is a bit loose. Im not sure about the freehub body. I just got the bike from a friend, so im kind of new. Its a trek 1000 if that helps.

  6. #6
    Senior Member cnnrmccloskey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barefootdan View Post
    The lockring is on tight. i dont have a chain whip, so maybe it is a bit loose. Im not sure about the freehub body. I just got the bike from a friend, so im kind of new. Its a trek 1000 if that helps.
    Prehaps your cassette is missing a spacer preventing it from tightening properly
    Quote Originally Posted by Braden1550 View Post
    Monocoque unicycles with internal gear hubs, ridden by extortionists with an excellent sense of balance.

    You'll see. Unless you drilled out your eyes because they were too heavy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cnnrmccloskey View Post
    Prehaps your cassette is missing a spacer preventing it from tightening properly
    i hope thats the problem. im low on money at the moment, so something major would suck.

    if anyone else knows whats going on, help is appriciated

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    Senior Member DannoXYZ's Avatar
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    How many teeth on the smallest cassette cog???

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    DRF aka Thrifty Bill wrk101's Avatar
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    I can't imagine a cassette turning on the freehub. What is a tiny amount? Real tiny = loose cassette, tighten it and you will be fine.

    A quick stop at your favorite bike shop, they might do it for free for you, or at least take a quick look at it. Diagnosing a problem via the internet is difficult, with no pictures, even more difficult.


    Good luck, hope it is something simple.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DannoXYZ View Post
    How many teeth on the smallest cassette cog???
    11teeth on the smallest.


    Also, here is a video of the problem. Hope it helps

    http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/4854/mvi0262.mp4

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    Senior Member DannoXYZ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barefootdan View Post
    11teeth on the smallest.


    Also, here is a video of the problem. Hope it helps

    http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/4854/mvi0262.mp4
    That's what I thought. The freehub body you have does not accept a Hyperglide-C 11t cog. Here's the difference (Hyperglide-C left, Hyperglide right):


    Remove the lockring and take the sprockets off and you'll see that the end of the splines go to the very end and doesn't provide room for the 11t cog to slide on far enough to pinch the rest of the stack.

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    Senior Member cnnrmccloskey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DannoXYZ View Post
    That's what I thought. The freehub body you have does not accept a Hyperglide-C 11t cog. Here's the difference (Hyperglide-C left, Hyperglide right):


    Remove the lockring and take the sprockets off and you'll see that the end of the splines go to the very end and doesn't provide room for the 11t cog to slide on far enough to pinch the rest of the stack.
    +1
    Quote Originally Posted by Braden1550 View Post
    Monocoque unicycles with internal gear hubs, ridden by extortionists with an excellent sense of balance.

    You'll see. Unless you drilled out your eyes because they were too heavy.

  13. #13
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    DannoXYZ identified the problem, the solution is to get a cassette with a 12 tooth smallest cog. If the next smallest cog on your present cassette is 13T or higher, then you could just find a 12T cog and use just that.

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    kk sounds like it might be the problem. when i get home ill count the teeth.

    Edit: But i was thinking, if its just the 11 tooth that shouldnt be there, why are the other 3 lowest cogs not moving also?
    Last edited by barefootdan; 05-05-10 at 09:29 AM.

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    the next smallest is a 12, then it goes to 14.

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    Quote Originally Posted by barefootdan View Post
    kk sounds like it might be the problem. when i get home ill count the teeth.

    Edit: But i was thinking, if its just the 11 tooth that shouldnt be there, why are the other 3 lowest cogs not moving also?
    I may be an issue like this:


    The larger cogs generate more torque and force at the splines and may have gouged out the splines on the freehub body. This lets them wiggle more than the smaller cogs.

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    Senior Member BCRider's Avatar
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    Barefoot, the stack of cogs in your cassette is just riveted together. If the setup hase been loose like this for some time and a bunch of miles the rivets will have stretched and worn loose. Now all the parts are sort of floating and relying on the splines to hold things together. Why some move together and others don't may well be due to the way the rivets wore or broke. Also both the 12 and 14 tooth cogs are actually loose cogs and only the rest are riveted together. This likely has something to do with what you're seeing.
    Model airplanes are cool too!.....

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    i took off the lockring and this is what i saw

    http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/7952/img0265gr.jpg

    yet, when i was taking off the lockring....it wasnt even tight. so ill put it back on tight, yet i dont have a chain whip or the lockring tool, so ill try my best.

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    well, seems to be the stupidest reason why, the lockring was loose...after all that.

    Sorry for the mishap, but thanks for the help!

  20. #20
    Senior member Dan Burkhart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barefootdan View Post
    i took off the lockring and this is what i saw

    http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/7952/img0265gr.jpg

    yet, when i was taking off the lockring....it wasnt even tight. so ill put it back on tight, yet i dont have a chain whip or the lockring tool, so ill try my best.
    You don't need the chainwhip for installation, only for removal. The fact that you were able to remove the lockring without a removal tool or a chainwhip indicates that it was way loose as you discovered.
    You will need a lockring tool to tighten it up.

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    Senior Member rumrunn6's Avatar
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    not normal. take it to a LBS for diagnosis and repair.
    cycling is like baseball ~ it doesn't take much to make it interesting

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    Low car diet JiveTurkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Burkhart View Post
    You don't need the chainwhip for installation, only for removal. The fact that you were able to remove the lockring without a removal tool or a chainwhip indicates that it was way loose as you discovered.
    You will need a lockring tool to tighten it up.
    +1

    Spend the 5 or 7 bucks on the chainring tool. You will not get it anywhere near tight enough otherwise. You can buy the chainwhip later if you ever need to remove a cassette.

    Edit: No need to take it to a shop yet. Get the right tool and tighten it up correctly. That lockring needs to be way tighter than your hand or a screw driver or anything else will get it.
    Quote Originally Posted by slopvehicle View Post
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    well im about to take it in for a tune up tomorrow, should i just say its loose and needs tightening?

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by JiveTurkey View Post
    +1
    Edit: No need to take it to a shop yet. Get the right tool and tighten it up correctly. That lockring needs to be way tighter than your hand or a screw driver or anything else will get it.
    What about that picture of the freehub body he posted - thing looks fried, doesn't it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Underbridge View Post
    What about that picture of the freehub body he posted - thing looks fried, doesn't it?
    i think it is just the picture. i didnt look or feel bad to me

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