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Old 05-04-10, 08:52 PM   #1
Jtgyk
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Wheel Rebuild

I have a Alexrim DH19 with Deore hub that has started popping spokes (4 so far in 2 months) and I want to rebuild it as strong and forgiving as possible.

The spokes on it now are 2mm straight (probably cheepo).
Which would make the strongest rebuild:
1) Wheelsmith 2mm straight spokes
2) Wheelsmith 2-1.7-2 butted spokes (or 2-1.8-2 if I can find them)
or
some variation of the above with Swiss DT spokes

This will be 3 cross.

Any other options available?
I really want to be able to trust this wheel for longer distances than 10 miles.


Thanks
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Old 05-04-10, 08:57 PM   #2
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the double butted spokes take longer to wear out.
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Old 05-04-10, 08:59 PM   #3
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Butted spokes.

Spoke breakage is most commonly caused by insufficient tension, allowing flexing as the spoke passes by the bottom of the rotating wheel.

Last edited by Shimagnolo; 05-04-10 at 10:09 PM.
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Old 05-04-10, 09:45 PM   #4
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Thanks

The spokes are all on the right side and break near the hub, so I assume you're right about tensioning.

I'm over 300lbs and need all the help I can get. I did get over 1000 miles out of this wheel before things started poppin', so I can't complain about it too much. I figure with quality spokes, I should be able to depend on it until I save up the money for a phill woods or white industry 48h hub and velocity chukker rim to build up sometime in the late fall.

any other options or configs you can suggest
(I know....lose some wieght.)
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Old 05-04-10, 10:01 PM   #5
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DT alpine III 2.34/1.8/2.0mm TB spokes are extra strong and built for heavy loads.
If you can't get wheelsmith in 2.0/1.8/2.0, than there's always DT swiss comp spokes.

at your weight, getting the spoke tension very even and at the proper tension is the most important part, rather than spoke choice.
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Old 05-04-10, 10:04 PM   #6
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How do I find the proper spoke tension for my rim/spoke/hub combo?

I have access to a tensiometer.
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Old 05-04-10, 10:17 PM   #7
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any other options or configs you can suggest
(I know....lose some wieght.)
More spokes? I am 210ish and am considering a 40 spoke wheel for my touring bike.
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Old 05-04-10, 10:28 PM   #8
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I don't know if you can get the faq to work, it's not working for me, but ask them about what the recommended and maximum tension they recommend for the rim you're using.

Hubs won't crack before rims, in terms of spoke tension, as long as you're not lacing it radially.
http://www.alexrims.com/support.asp?btn=11
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Old 05-05-10, 02:44 PM   #9
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Unless you're SURE about the condition of the rim, I'd pop for a new one. You've been breaking spokes. If your rim has a "set" in it you won't be able to build it true without resorting to uneven spoke tensions.

I use DT Competition spokes 14/15/14 unless I'm doing something special. For example, I used DT Alpines when I built my tandem wheels.

I don't obcess over spoke count. Both of my sons use 32 spoke wheels on their freeride bikes and, trust me, they give them a real thorough testing. Build quality trumps spoke count every time.
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Old 05-05-10, 03:07 PM   #10
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DT alpine III 2.34/1.8/2.0mm TB spokes.
+1. Build it up with Alpines. They're a substitute for a properly built wheel but they're the strongest spoke out there.


Quote:
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I have access to a tensiometer.
I'm not fan of spoke tension meters. I think they cause more issues than they solve because people rely on them as gospil. "The gauge says 'X', its tensioned properly." Ummmm.....no.
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Old 05-05-10, 03:12 PM   #11
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+1. Build it up with Alpines. They're a substitute for a properly built wheel but they're the strongest spoke out there.




I'm not fan of spoke tension meters. I think they cause more issues than they solve because people rely on them as gospil. "The gauge says 'X', its tensioned properly." Ummmm.....no.
after properly stress relieving and inflating a tire on the rim, check spoke tension again, as they'll drop. Only then is the wheel 'ready' to be ridden.
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Old 05-05-10, 03:15 PM   #12
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after properly stress relieving and inflating a tire on the rim, check spoke tension again, as they'll drop. Only then is the wheel 'ready' to be ridden.
I'm not sure how that statements relates to my post but I'm not disagreeing with it.....



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Old 05-05-10, 03:47 PM   #13
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DT Alpine spokes are 13g at the hub, 15g in the middle, and 14g at the wheel. They say that most spoke breakage occurs at the hub (or near it) so these spokes put the strength where it is most needed. I've read that the spoke holes need to be at least 2.6 mm for these spokes -- others say 2.4 mm. Apparently, Wheelsmith has spokes that are 13g at the hub and 14g from the middle to the wheel. Also, Phil Wood has 13g/14g spokes. I've been looking at these recently because I need to build a wheel for a tandem. I've not actually used any of these so far. Just for information -- some British/European shops (eg SJS) have decent prices on the DT Alpine spokes in quantities of six. There is a shop in NC(Cycle9) that specializes (best I can tell) in electrics that has the Phil Wood spokes cut to custom length at $1.00 each.

Many knowledgeable people recommend 14g/15g/14g (or similar) spokes as opposed to straight 14g spokes, but almost everyone agrees that a well constructed 36 spoke wheel with 14g spokes is plenty strong and will last a long time -- probably as long as the rim. One thing is certain -- for the same spoke count, tension, and cross, the rim will flex less with straight spokes as opposed to butted spokes, What that means for a very heavy rider, I don't know.
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Old 05-05-10, 07:58 PM   #14
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The theory says that the butted spokes have enough "give" to allow the surrounding spokes to take added stress of occasional bumps and torsions instead of concetrating all the force to one, which can break the spoke.
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Old 05-05-10, 09:25 PM   #15
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The theory says that the butted spokes have enough "give" to allow the surrounding spokes to take added stress of occasional bumps and torsions instead of concetrating all the force to one, which can break the spoke.
I honsetly don't know about that. I've heard engineering guys argue both ways.

What I do know is I've seen a whole lot of spokes that broke at the elbow. I've seen a lesser number of spokes that broke right at the nipple. I've seen a few that broke after the chain overshifted the freewheel and buggered them up. I've never seen a spoke that broke in the middle.
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Old 05-05-10, 09:32 PM   #16
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I was pretty sure the extra material at the ends allowed the spoke to last longer because the metal didn't fatigue as fast.
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Old 05-06-10, 12:50 AM   #17
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Well I ordered my DT Alpine III spokes from SJS. Funny that I could get them cheaper from the UK...shipped than here in the states. (I managed to get a Brooks B17, honey colored, for $68 shipped last year).

I'm just going to re-build my current wheels with the new spokes and see how well it works, and save different rim/hub/number of spoke combinations for a later date. (I'm still leaning toward the velocity chukkers, though the Synergy offset rim may have an advantage with less dish)

So, if I'm understanding your answers correctly, I need to make sure that the drive side tension is very tight (though not too tight...Sheldon said he pretty much liked to tune them to F#...) and very even and the left side will be tensioned to a lesser degree. I'm sure somewhere there is a fact sheet telling about max tension for the Alexrim.
max tension on my Alexrim rear wheel
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