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  1. #1
    Bacon-wrapped Member ahsposo's Avatar
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    Wheel trueing advice: Fulcrum 5 rear w/ 2 to 1 spokes

    My Fulcrum 5 rear wheel is slightly off true. It has the 2 to 1 spoke design: non-drive side is laced radially and the drive side has paired spokes.

    Here's my dilemma: I've trued wheels in the past. I've got a trueing stand and the spoke wrenches. I don't have a tensiometer. In the past I worked by ear. With these new design wheels and the higher tensions I'm fearful of making things worse rather than better.

    Should I just leave it alone? Right now it's just out of true enough that I can see it when I spin my wheel but there is no brake rub or other ride-ability issue.

    I don't really want to take it around to an LBS. I feel like I would insult them by doing an interview on their qualifications to true a wheel. But I'm open to suggestions from you shop guys on this.

    OR should I just swallow my fear and have at like it's just a wheel - how bad could I mess it up anyway?

    Thanks.
    Quote Originally Posted by 3alarmer View Post
    ...ixnay on the exsay alktay.

  2. #2
    Senior Member bikeman715's Avatar
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    If you are not sure what to do yes bring it to the shop,and it does just hurt to ask when you are there for help. It what we are here for.
    bikeman715

  3. #3
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    On a rear wheel I don't use the drive side to do lateral truing. It works well using the non-drive side spokes. I have done this for friends with the silly paired spokes wheels, but I don't know for sure about yours.

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    The wheel works just like a regular one truing laterally. What i recommend you to have is a center gauge thing, w/o that you are basically dead. Follow davidad advice then use the gauge and put the wheel back to the center if aint center already.

    The other thing i noticed with these wheels with high tension spokes is that no matter what you do the tension is almost even all the time in all the spokes. If you know how to true a wheel you should not have a single problem with this one at all. At leat is not a super few spokes bontranger or a campagnolo g3 because those ones not even a shop will take them

    Truing radially is the hard part because the rims in low count spoke wheels are so stiff that push the rim to take a hop out sometimes is not enough, in those cases u have to lose the spokes at the hop, then tight the opposite hop side spokes to pull the rim/hub to the opposite side so the hop has more rim to pull. Carbon wheels have this problem usually.

    Good luck

  5. #5
    Bacon-wrapped Member ahsposo's Avatar
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    I guess I should clarify:

    The rims are still perfectly round as far as I can tell. It's just the slight out of center that's bugging me.

    As far as a dishing tool (ultraman6970 is this what you call a center gauge?) I've just always flipped the wheel over in the truing stand to find the center while truing a finished wheel.

    My main concern here is the higher tensions of these lower spoke wheels. I don't want to make things worse.
    Quote Originally Posted by 3alarmer View Post
    ...ixnay on the exsay alktay.

  6. #6
    Senior Member
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    Flipping the wheel over to center the rim works as well as any other technique. It just takes some horse sense and patience.
    Go ahead and true the wheel but make the changes in very small increments. The principles are the same for all wheels.
    If the spokes are bladed be sure to hold them straight to avoid twisting. Actually twisting should be avoided for all spokes.

  7. #7
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    i also own a pair of fulcrum 5's 2014 model BUT my problem is that the rear has a little bump as if the rim is slightly out of round.
    i did some minor side to side truing but i dont know how to take off this low spot.any ideas?

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    Q. Can you feel this low spot/bump while riding?

    If not and you have relatively even spoke tension all around then leave it alone, ride harder or longer until something else comes up worth focusing on. It could be an anomoly in the rim, it could be permanent deformation due to hitting something on the road.

    It is generally easier to pull in a high spot than it is to let out a low spot...if you really want to give it a go then start by loosening the spoke on both right and left sides of the wheel in the area of the low spot. The issue that you may have is that the spokes are too far apart to really have an affect on working/tuning the low spot out due to the low spoke count of the wheels.

    Particularly on low spoke count wheels concentrate on the following:
    1. Lateral trueness
    2. Even spoke tension
    3. Centered/dished properly
    4. High/Low spots that are significant enough that they can be felt while riding.

    I will go out on a limb (as I am sure some may disagree) and state that any low spot that is significant enough to feel while riding that is not an apparent defect in a new rim would be due to damage while riding/transporting/storing or someone with lack of knowledge toying around with a spoke wrench...in all 3 cases the likelyhood is high that the rim is plasticly deformed and in the case of low spoke count and super light weight wheels the rim should be replaced.

    If it is not significant enough to feel when riding and all else is good then ride on.

    -j

  9. #9
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    I have some Fulcrum 5s and broke a front spoke. Set up my DIY truing stand and fixed that, and as long as I had it set up pulled the rear. Just needed some minor lateral truing which I did like any other wheel. Pinging was a good sanity check. My SRAM Force calipers seem to need to keep the pads pretty close to the rim otherwise there is too much lever travel on hard braking so I like true wheels. I did buy one of those Park aero spoke holders which helps.

    scott s.
    .

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    i took a closer look -as i had the bike to the basement- and it's a high spot finally.so as the theory says i have to pull the spokes evenly on that spot right?
    is the spoke tension the same due to the 2 to 1 lacing?will it be easy or it'll mess up the whole wheel?the tension is very high on drive side and i dont trust local bike stores..seem to know only how to sell!

    so is the front wheel.very stiff construction,bought them second hand and remain true although some bad potholes.

    scott967 how much did the spoke cost?was it easy to replace?

    just to mention the problem to the back was from the previous owner.

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    You have the basic idea down. Start by looking up radially truing a wheel to get a better idea of the process. You will find that what you do radially may have an affect on lateral trueness. When actually putting spoke wrench to the wheel use small increments such as 1/8 to 1/4 turn and slowly work the area out.

    Again you can find yourself in a position like a dog chasing its own tail with this so evaluate if this hop is something you can feel when riding or not....if you can't feel it while riding and the spoke tension is relatively even then leave it be and just ride.

    ***note: even spoke tension on rear wheel means that the spoke tension is even among the non-drive side spoke, and the tension is even among the drive side spokes....not to be confused with tension being even among a mix of drive side and non-drive side spoke.

    Wheel truing is almost as much art as it is science and when to stop working the spokes can be a function of how OCD someone is...don't let "best" be the enemy of "good enough" as there is a point of deminishing returns....Your focus should be on having a durable wheel to log lots of miles/kilometers, use that thought to keep things in perspective.

    -j

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by xifias View Post
    scott967 how much did the spoke cost?was it easy to replace?
    QBP has a number of options for "Fulcrum" spokes (don't know what the original source is). I got a "5 pack" that Fulcrum calls a "mini-kit" for $20 from Harris (Harris was fast to ship but I suppose you could get from any LBS with access to QBP catalog).

    I'd never messed with aero/bladed spokes before but once I got the tool to hold the spoke from windup it was like any other spoke. Easier actually since it is a straight-pull spoke and the head just fits in a slot in the hub behind a plastic cover. I don't know if you can get the 2 "special" spokes that Fulcrum uses to supposedly balance the wheel. I was wondering about tensioning and truing a 20 spoke wheel (the rim was kind of tacoed), but it came in pretty quickly between my gauge indicator and pinging for tension. I have a few 100 miles on it and I did check it once with no change and will probably do it again one last time.

    scott s.
    .

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenfieldja View Post
    You have the basic idea down. Start by looking up radially...don't let "best" be the enemy of "good enough" as there is a point of deminishing returns....Your focus should be on having a durable wheel to log lots of miles/kilometers, use that thought to keep things in perspective.

    -j
    you were very clear.indeed wheeltruing is a complex process that someone has to approach with care.as a matter of fact the "problem" is an about 3-4mm high spot.surely i dont feel it while riding and of course i dont risk at all end up with an unusable wheel.the tension of the spokes seems even or at least "high" although 1 or 2 seem twisted.apart from that,some make the almost the same noise,others not.
    my deep doubt is some elasticity-flexing when pedaling hard out of the saddle especially on low cadence low gear uphills,that seems to come from the wheel.as if there is some delay from getting the power to the ground.i weigh rough 85 kilos.although the rest of the bike isnt smthng exotic superstiff material,rather a simple aluminum frame of unknown make.either chinese,or as from the looks,it seems like a willier triestina evasion.

    is that "flexing" typical of the low spoke wheels as this model is,or likely a suspect of weak tension maybe?or both?

    Quote Originally Posted by scott967 View Post
    QBP has a number of options for "Fulcrum" spokes ...... I don't know if you can get the 2 "special" spokes that Fulcrum uses to supposedly balance the wheel. I was wondering about tensioning and truing a 20 spoke wheel (the rim was kind of tacoed), but it came in pretty quickly between my gauge indicator and pinging for tension. I have a few 100 miles on it and I did check it once with no change and will probably do it again one last time.

    scott s.
    .
    radial lacing on the front is regarded generally as a "weak" lacing,but as you say it seems easy to replace and truing.
    i think that this specific model doesnt have balancing spokes.fulcrum 3's and above have.as a matter of fact,this wheel gets out of balance with tyre-valve etc.if you let it spin slowly you'll see that makes the known pendulum movement until it rests.i counterweigh this effect by placing a tiny nut on the valve along with a schrader valve adapter and the speed sensor magnet placed at exactly the opossite direction.

  14. #14
    Senior Member JTGraphics's Avatar
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    All I can say is truing method is the same as any other wheel but to do it correctly you do need know where the tension is on the spokes so you can make the correct moves.
    Guessing will still get it done but to some degree but as far as knowing if tension was adjusted the correct way to get it true is another story.
    Good luck with it.
    It may not be fancy but it gets me were I need to go.
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