Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Bicycle Mechanics
Reload this Page >

Which is more rust or corrosion-proof? Black or silver spokes and nipples?

Notices
Bicycle Mechanics Broken bottom bracket? Tacoed wheel? If you're having problems with your bicycle, or just need help fixing a flat, drop in here for the latest on bicycle mechanics & bicycle maintenance.

Which is more rust or corrosion-proof? Black or silver spokes and nipples?

Old 12-13-10, 06:00 AM
  #1  
we be rollin'
Thread Starter
 
hybridbkrdr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Quebec, Canada
Posts: 1,930
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 222 Post(s)
Liked 25 Times in 24 Posts
Which is more rust or corrosion-proof? Black or silver spokes and nipples?

Also, would it be worth it to try Wheelsmith nipples on DT Swiss spokes?
hybridbkrdr is offline  
Old 12-13-10, 07:43 AM
  #2  
Bianchi Goddess
 
Bianchigirll's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Shady Pines Retirement Fort Wayne, In
Posts: 29,716

Bikes: Too many to list here check my signature.

Mentioned: 191 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2910 Post(s)
Liked 2,829 Times in 1,456 Posts
when you say black or silver are you simply refering to color or materiel? I never cared for Alumium nipples unless you were building race or TT wheels. therefore I always used silver or more exactly the chromed brass nipples. if the bike is well cared for corrosion or rust should never be much of an issue.

as for mixing and matching brands as long as you are threading 14ga nipples on to 14ga spokes brand should not matter
__________________
One morning you wake up, the girl is gone, the bikes are gone, all that's left behind is a pair of old tires and a tube of tubular glue, all squeezed out"

Sugar "Kane" Kowalczyk
Bianchigirll is offline  
Old 12-13-10, 09:37 AM
  #3  
Senior Member
 
mrrabbit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: San Jose, California
Posts: 3,504

Bikes: 2001 Tommasini Sintesi w/ Campagnolo Daytona 10 Speed

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 145 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 35 Times in 30 Posts
Stainless Steel Ain't

Some grades are more resistant than others - but - eventually left in the rain ALL will rust. Most often will start where the spokes cross each other and where nicks/scratches have occurred marring the smooth finish. It can actually result in a mid-section snap as opposed to the common head snap and rare nipple snap.

The color finish doesn't change a thing...

The cheapest from Taiwan and China will rust in just one season.


You could try titanium spokes but they ain't cheap and will break periodically making it an expensive hobby.

=8-)
__________________
5000+ wheels built since 1984...

Disclaimer:

1. I do not claim to be an expert in bicycle mechanics despite my experience.
2. I like anyone will comment in other areas.
3. I do not own the preexisting concepts of DISH and ERD.
4. I will provide information as I always have to others that I believe will help them protect themselves from unscrupulous mechanics.
5. My all time favorite book is:

Kahane, Howard. Logic and Contemporary Rhetoric: The Use of Reason in Everyday Life
mrrabbit is offline  
Old 12-13-10, 09:54 AM
  #4  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 33,656

Bikes: '96 Litespeed Catalyst, '05 Litespeed Firenze, '06 Litespeed Tuscany, '20 Surly Midnight Special, All are 3x10. It is hilly around here!

Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2026 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1,095 Times in 741 Posts
I agree with Bianchigirll. Aluminum nipples are corrosion prone no matter what color they are. If you ride in wet and/or salty conditions they will corrode. Brass nipples are stronger, more corrosion resistant and do less damage when they corrode than aluminum.

Good quality spokes (DT, Wheelsmith, etc.) are all stainless steel these days so corrosion isn't a problem no matter what color they are.
HillRider is offline  
Old 12-13-10, 09:56 AM
  #5  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 33,656

Bikes: '96 Litespeed Catalyst, '05 Litespeed Firenze, '06 Litespeed Tuscany, '20 Surly Midnight Special, All are 3x10. It is hilly around here!

Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2026 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1,095 Times in 741 Posts
Originally Posted by mrrabbit
Stainless Steel Ain't

Some grades are more resistant than others - but - eventually left in the rain ALL will rust.
Spokes are typically made of 304 stainless steel which is a VERY corrosion resistant grade and, in fact, is the grade used in most chemical piping and reactor construction.
HillRider is offline  
Old 12-13-10, 10:30 AM
  #6  
velo-orange
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Mentioned: Post(s)
Tagged: Thread(s)
Quoted: Post(s)
DT and Wheelsmith 14gau spokes and nipples have different thread pitches. They are not interchangable- at least this is the way it was for years and years. Maybe that's changed in the past couple years?

Stainless steel spokes are very resistant to water and moisture, more so than galvanized or chrome plated spokes. A DT or Wheelsmith or Sapim spoke use a slightly different stainless material and will be more water resistant than Taiwan or china stainless material.
The black spokes from DT, Wheelsmith and Sapim are stainless to begin with. The black color is electro-deposited or chemically etched, or something like that. It's not going to give you additional corrosion resistance. It's substantially more expensive though.

If you are riding through a lot of salt water and leave the bike outside all year round, expect your stainless spokes to get a very light layer of surface rust on them which can be scotchbrighted off. That's normal. it does not mean the spokes are defective or that user error contributed to the 5 microns of rust growth.
 
Old 12-13-10, 10:34 AM
  #7  
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NW,Oregon Coast
Posts: 43,598

Bikes: 8

Mentioned: 197 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7607 Post(s)
Liked 1,354 Times in 861 Posts
Titanium... it is used for piping to carry Caustics well off Ph 7.
fietsbob is offline  
Old 12-13-10, 11:00 AM
  #8  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 33,656

Bikes: '96 Litespeed Catalyst, '05 Litespeed Firenze, '06 Litespeed Tuscany, '20 Surly Midnight Special, All are 3x10. It is hilly around here!

Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2026 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1,095 Times in 741 Posts
Originally Posted by fietsbob
Titanium... it is used for piping to carry Caustics well off Ph 7.
So are glass and PVC but that doesn't make them suitable for spokes.
HillRider is offline  
Old 12-13-10, 11:15 AM
  #9  
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NW,Oregon Coast
Posts: 43,598

Bikes: 8

Mentioned: 197 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7607 Post(s)
Liked 1,354 Times in 861 Posts
someone made Ti spoke nipples, I suppose a $3 + spoke nipple, each, was a bit much.
fietsbob is offline  
Old 12-13-10, 11:16 AM
  #10  
Thrifty Bill
 
wrk101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Mountains of Western NC
Posts: 23,570

Bikes: 86 Katakura Silk, 87 Prologue X2, 88 Cimarron LE, 1975 Sekai 4000 Professional, 73 Paramount, plus more

Mentioned: 96 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1236 Post(s)
Liked 957 Times in 624 Posts
Originally Posted by fietsbob
Titanium... it is used for piping to carry Caustics well off Ph 7.
Many caustics, sodium hydroxide, are stored and piped via carbon steel.
wrk101 is offline  
Old 12-13-10, 11:21 AM
  #11  
Senior Member
 
mrrabbit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: San Jose, California
Posts: 3,504

Bikes: 2001 Tommasini Sintesi w/ Campagnolo Daytona 10 Speed

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 145 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 35 Times in 30 Posts
Originally Posted by HillRider
Spokes are typically made of 304 stainless steel which is a VERY corrosion resistant grade and, in fact, is the grade used in most chemical piping and reactor construction.

Was there and argument that you were making since you quoted me? Just curious...

=8-)
__________________
5000+ wheels built since 1984...

Disclaimer:

1. I do not claim to be an expert in bicycle mechanics despite my experience.
2. I like anyone will comment in other areas.
3. I do not own the preexisting concepts of DISH and ERD.
4. I will provide information as I always have to others that I believe will help them protect themselves from unscrupulous mechanics.
5. My all time favorite book is:

Kahane, Howard. Logic and Contemporary Rhetoric: The Use of Reason in Everyday Life
mrrabbit is offline  
Old 12-13-10, 12:41 PM
  #12  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 33,656

Bikes: '96 Litespeed Catalyst, '05 Litespeed Firenze, '06 Litespeed Tuscany, '20 Surly Midnight Special, All are 3x10. It is hilly around here!

Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2026 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1,095 Times in 741 Posts
Originally Posted by mrrabbit
Was there and argument that you were making since you quoted me? Just curious...=8-)
Not arguing, just pointing out that the grade of stainless steel used for spokes is very corrosion resistant. You said "Stainless Steel Ain't.......eventually left in the rain ALL will rust." and while that's factually correct, some grades are indeed a lot more resistant than others and 304 won't rust in the rain no matter how long it's left there.
HillRider is offline  
Old 12-13-10, 01:02 PM
  #13  
Senior Member
 
mrrabbit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: San Jose, California
Posts: 3,504

Bikes: 2001 Tommasini Sintesi w/ Campagnolo Daytona 10 Speed

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 145 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 35 Times in 30 Posts
Originally Posted by HillRider
Not arguing, just pointing out that the grade of stainless steel used for spokes is very corrosion resistant. You said "Stainless Steel Ain't.......eventually left in the rain ALL will rust." and while that's factually correct, some grades are indeed a lot more resistant than others and 304 won't rust in the rain no matter how long it's left there.
You seem to be confusing the properties of 304 with 316 and 316L.

=8-)
__________________
5000+ wheels built since 1984...

Disclaimer:

1. I do not claim to be an expert in bicycle mechanics despite my experience.
2. I like anyone will comment in other areas.
3. I do not own the preexisting concepts of DISH and ERD.
4. I will provide information as I always have to others that I believe will help them protect themselves from unscrupulous mechanics.
5. My all time favorite book is:

Kahane, Howard. Logic and Contemporary Rhetoric: The Use of Reason in Everyday Life
mrrabbit is offline  
Old 12-13-10, 01:12 PM
  #14  
AEO
Senior Member
 
AEO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: A Coffin Called Earth. or Toronto, ON
Posts: 12,258

Bikes: Bianchi, Miyata, Dahon, Rossin

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times in 5 Posts
there are many forms of corrosion to consider. galvanic, acidic and oxidation to name a few.
Aluminum is simply more reactive than most of the other metals used in wheels.

Chromium and Molybdenum are in the same group and both are used to enhance corrosion resistance of steel alloys.
Then you take a look at copper, silver and gold, which are in the same group and they're resistant to acid. You might encounter acid from acid rain.

You want to use brass nipples, because they're not as reactive as aluminum.
__________________
Food for thought: if you aren't dead by 2050, you and your entire family will be within a few years from starvation. Now that is a cruel gift to leave for your offspring. ;)
https://sanfrancisco.ibtimes.com/arti...ger-photos.htm
AEO is offline  
Old 12-13-10, 08:02 PM
  #15  
we be rollin'
Thread Starter
 
hybridbkrdr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Quebec, Canada
Posts: 1,930
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 222 Post(s)
Liked 25 Times in 24 Posts
Yeah, I was talking about either DT Swiss or Wheelsmith spokes and brass nipples (found some painted black). (I know Sapim is a well-regarded name, it's just easier to find DT Swiss sold individually).

Well, it sounds to me like I won't have longer lasting wheels by choosing black spokes and nipples. Thanks for taking the time to answer.

By the way, I read a couple of messages on the Internet someone claiming black spokes break more frequently. Could there be any truth to that?

Would there be any benefit to putting wax over your nipples once the wheel is complete to keep water out?
hybridbkrdr is offline  
Old 12-13-10, 11:18 PM
  #16  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: New Rochelle, NY
Posts: 38,544

Bikes: too many bikes from 1967 10s (5x2)Frejus to a Sumitomo Ti/Chorus aluminum 10s (10x2), plus one non-susp mtn bike I use as my commuter

Mentioned: 139 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5703 Post(s)
Liked 2,425 Times in 1,341 Posts
Originally Posted by velo-orange
DT and Wheelsmith 14gau spokes and nipples have different thread pitches. They are not interchangable- at least this is the way it was for years and years. Maybe that's changed in the past couple years?
HUH!!!, Both Wheelsmith and DT, 14g spokes, along with almost all the spokes sold in the western world over the last half century, have UNC 2-56 threads (a carryover from when the USA led the world in spoke making and other industrial production) now the ISO standard for 14g spokes.

One exception would be spokes made in France more than 20 years ago, which used the "Jauge de Paris" standard, and had different thread pitch.

The only thread difference between various brands of nipples and spokes is the length of thread, which determines how far up into the nipple a spoke will thread.

As far as the OP's question goes, both black and silver anodized nipples are roughly equal in corrosion resistance. Good quality anodizing offers pretty good corrosion protection and is used in many marine applications, such as sailboat masts, along with all kinds of bike parts. Nickle plated brass is probably the gold standard, but if the threads are greased anodized alloy will hold up very well too.
__________________
FB
Chain-L site

An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.

Just because I'm tired of arguing, doesn't mean you're right.

“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN

WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.

Last edited by FBinNY; 12-13-10 at 11:45 PM.
FBinNY is offline  
Old 07-19-14, 02:48 PM
  #17  
we be rollin'
Thread Starter
 
hybridbkrdr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Quebec, Canada
Posts: 1,930
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 222 Post(s)
Liked 25 Times in 24 Posts
I know this thread is old but I wanted to add a link relevant to this one in case someone is searching...
https://www.bikeforums.net/bicycle-me...kes-break.html
hybridbkrdr is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
frogman
Bicycle Mechanics
12
11-07-17 10:35 PM
angelodp123
Bicycle Mechanics
5
07-06-17 11:51 PM
Chombi
Classic & Vintage
12
12-02-12 09:51 PM
vincavinz
Classic & Vintage
6
07-24-11 04:30 PM
bradtx
Bicycle Mechanics
7
12-15-10 07:04 PM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.