wrobertdavis

I just bought a new Surly LHT frame. Is it necessary to face the headtube and bottom bracket shell before installing headset and bottom bracket?

Bob

clydeosaur

Not sure, but I'll take a stab at it & say perhaps it's standard practice to avoid issues of debris in the threads (paint, primer, powder coating of metal shavings from thread cutting) or just a follow up to ensure new parts seat properly?

ncfisherman

Facing is the only way to ensure that the faces are parallel to each other - it will make for a better fit and prolong bearing life. BB taps will clean up the threads, to remove excess paint and other debris.

Is it an absolute necessity? No. But it would likely prolong the life of your frame, BB, and headset.

sgrobben

What Surly says:

https://surlybikes.com/blog/spew/spew...r_steel_frame/

Dan Burkhart 

What the others have said. Highly recommended. That said, I've built up several Surly frames of different models and found them all to be perfectly square out of the box. All I did by facing was remove paint.

Purp

Just put an outboard bearing BB and a new headset on my new Surly LHT, no facing at all. I've experienced no problems so far. My 2 cents.

well biked

We sell a lot of Surlys at our shop, both complete bikes and framesets. With framesets, we chase and face the bb and headtube, there's usually enough powdercoat residue to make it a good idea. On my own LHT, I chased and faced everything before building it up. On complete bikes the bb is already installed so we don't do anything there and have had no problems. Most of the Surly framesets we sell end up with cartridge bearing square taper bb's, so often the main issue is cleaning up the threads in the bb shell more than facing the shell (but we do both to while we're at it).

wrobertdavis

Thanks to everyone for taking the time to write informative replies. It seems there is a range of acceptable approaches. Having it all done by professionals with proper tools ensures maximum longevity, though the Surly frames do not seem to require much prep. I just got a quote from a local, trusted bike shop and I think I'll spend the money. FYI, the total was $93.00 to chase and face everything, press the headset cups, and press the crown race.

HillRider

+1. My Cross Check went together with no problems except for overspray in every thread and on every face. A can of acetone, a putty knife and a rag were the only preparation it required.

A facing tool and thread chasing taps will do the same thing at higher cost.

gruppo

I, too, complete lots of frame up builds in my bike shop, on Surly and other steel frames-set brands, and I face the bottom bracket shells and head tubes and chase the bottom bracket threads on all of them (I also check the alignment and spacing of the frame's and fork's drop-outs). I've been doing this for 30 years because it shows respect for both the owners of the frames and the art & craft of building up bikes. And, of course, it gives the frame, bottom bracket, and headset the best possible chance for long and trouble free performance.

You've made a wise choice and your money is well spent. In my experience anyone who skips these steps is foolish and cheap.

JohnDThompson 

Only if the frame was properly prepped before it was painted.

HillRider

Based on how well it assembled after I removed the overspray, I have to conclude it was indeed properly prepped by Surly.

operator

Wow $93?

operator

A branded generic taiwanese steel frame, made from gas pipe tubing. Not sure why everyone thinks Surlys are the bomb.

krome

There is no reason to face a BB if cartridge style bottom brackets are being put in. Sure, chase the threads. Traditional adjustable cup style BB should have the BB faced.

krome

Ouch, did a Surly beat up your dad? Full disclaimer, I just ordered a Surly fork. That will become the only Surly branded item I'll have so far (because it is hard to find a 26" [559] non-suspension corrected fork with all the eyelets and is chrome-moly).

I'd venture that they're better than the Chinese branded "gas pipe" tubed frames? (And by Chinese, I mean mainland) Does double butted chrome-moly count as "gas pipe" these days?

HillRider

First they are 4130 double butted Cr-Mo, not "gas pipe" (aka Hi-Ten) so let's get that nonsense out of the way. Second, not every one thinks they are "the bomb" but owners tend to be very satisfied and recognize them for their merits.

True they are generic and Taiwanese but they are also very reasonably priced, well made and versatile. No one buys them as pur sang racing bikes or for their bling appeal but they are certainly functional and fill several very useful niches. The LHT is one of the premier affordable touring bikes. Sure you can get lighter, more sophisticated frames but only for a lot more money.

operator

This is pure wrong.

Certain cartridge BB's have a much higher tolerance for facing errors than others, but some do not. That doesn't mean you don't need to face any of them

1) All manner of external bottom brackets
2) Shimano octalink bottom brackets (cartridge)
3) Campagnolo square taper bottom brackets (cartridge)

If you have a large enough facing error, even cartridge shimano cartridges will bind when installed.

To you maybe.

Go look at some off the rack Marinoni's. Surlys use ****ty 4130 straight gauge tubing. It's anything but quality or value. You could build yourself an equivalently priced, same quality 'touring bike', from a $99 nashbar frame. It's a low-end touring bike, nothing more.

krome

External doesn't count as a cartridge style. If a fixed cup bears against a surface that needs facing, face just the surface that needs it, not both. You're just scraping off paint. If you're putting in a Phil cartridge BB, don't bother facing.

operator

Again, wrong.

Both cups bear against a surface that needs facing. Thus?

#2 and #3 in my previous post counts as 'cartridge', they both have flanges that tighten against the face of the shell. Any other incorrect things you would like to add to this conversation?

dedhed

I just had a frame done at Ben's, $25 to face and chase BB and head tube - While I waited no less! I'm sure pressing in the cups and crown wouldn't have added more than $20.

krome

I'd say it depends on the BB one chooses to install as to determine if it needs facing. If your just going to put a ****ty shimano cartridge style in there, who cares? The flexing of the spindle is more than any mis-alignment on any decent frame made since what, 1980? I mean, if you've [the manufacturer] screwed up facing the BB shell prior to welding, it is a botched job already. Octolink is an abortion. Some BB's don't have any bearing support parts that bear against the BB shell face. Who cares if it is faced then? You guys throw out answers to questions in a general manner. Sure, facing is nice. Sometimes it is needed. Sometimes it isn't. You gonna charge your customer to do work that isn't needed?

operator

That's extremely cheap service - labour rates not only have to pay for well the labour but the tool as well. Chasing and facing tools for the bottom bracket and headset are extremely expensive. If the shop doesn't do much of them it will take them a long time to repay that tool cost.

operator

I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that you've never actually worked in a high volume, retail shop. Fixing bikes for a living.

An improperly faced shell, or one that needs facing, even for a ****ty shimano cart. When installed may cause it to bind, or not turn smoothly. If you run this it will significantly reduce the lifespan of the BB. You claim that no catridge bb's need to have shells faced. I just showed you one reason why they would need to be.

It's obvious you have never seen this problem before. One of many if you don't face something that needs to be.

krome

What if the guy says he's putting a Phil square taper BB in there? You gonna tell him it needs facing? Chasing threads sure. I don't disagree with that. I'd say again, it depends on the bike and BB combo as to determine the need to face a BB. If you do face it, do it once and be done. I'm on the side of less material removal. A guy with a facing tool can do some damage. I'm in full agreement that a BB that doesn't turn smooth is not good and should be corrected. The correct action depends on the circumstance.