Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Bicycle Mechanics Broken bottom bracket? Tacoed wheel? If you're having problems with your bicycle, or just need help fixing a flat, drop in here for the latest on bicycle mechanics & bicycle maintenance.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11-12-04, 11:02 PM   #1
phantomcow2
la vache fantôme
Thread Starter
 
phantomcow2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: NH
Bikes:
Posts: 6,266
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Can a wheelbuilder please help me out

Okjay well im trying to build my first wheelset. I didnt want to spend too much money on the highest quality parts becuase its my first so im doing 32 hole 3 cross. I am using DT swiss Hayes front hub with vuelta rear. DT Swiss competition spokes. I have taken apart 3 wheels and relaced them to get familiar with the process, but now this seems much harder. I used the DT swiss calculator and all of my parts (aside from rims) were in the database. Im having some hard time understanding it though. I see ri. and le. which i assume is right or left, but what i dont understnad is hjow do you determine which side is right and left? Or is it like for trailing spokes use a certain length and leading spokes use certain length. Please help. Oh and to get the best help i would guess i need the measurnment thing DT swiss gave me from the calculator.
Below is a link to the PDF file: http://home.comcast.net/~phantomcow3...11-13_0602.pdf
phantomcow2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-04, 11:04 PM   #2
seely 
The Rabbi
 
seely's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 5,087
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Right is ALWAYS your drive side, left is always your non drive side, just like on pedals and cranks. I haven't used that calculator but I would assume thats what they are referring to.
seely is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-04, 11:57 PM   #3
Bobthe....
Ex Racer, frame builder
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: NSW Australia
Bikes: 1872 Rudge, 1902 Rudge, about 12 or so self built
Posts: 29
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Hi,

The drive side ( *usually* the right hand side of the bicycle) is the right side of the wheel.

Rear wheels only :
Where you need to dish the wheel ( ie set the rim closer to the drive side hub flange ), the spokes on the left side (non drive) are longer by between 3 turns of the nipple and 6 turns. You can use different length spokes with the longer ones on the left. Or, if your spokes fit well near their mid range, you can get all the adjustment using all spokes of the same length, by tightening the drive side by 3 or so turns before reaching final tension all over.

Note: the most common mistake made by beginner wheel builders, is to not set the pattern correctly around the valve hole. Its easiest to get it right by fitting up the spoke adjacent to the valve hole first, then after the first round (of 8 spokes in the case of a 32 wheel) rotating the hub so the first spoke goes away from the valve, before crossing and fitting the next 8 (on the same side).
Then turn the wheel over and fit the other adjacent spoke, its 7 mates, then the final 8.

That way the valve will have the most access space.

Good luck !

Bobthe....
Bobthe.... is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-04, 06:57 AM   #4
Retro Grouch 
Senior Member
 
Retro Grouch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: St Peters, Missouri
Bikes: Rans Rockst (Retro rocket) Rans Enduro Sport (Retro racket) Catrike 559, Merin Bear Valley (beater bike).
Posts: 26,614
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 89 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by phantomcow2
. I used the DT swiss calculator and all of my parts (aside from rims) were in the database.
Lets go back to the spoke length calculation because if this isn't right the whole thing isn't going to work. How did you determine your ERD (effective rim diameter)? Most of the spoke length differences stem from the rim being used and measuring a rim with the necessary precision isn't as easy as it sounds.
Retro Grouch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-04, 07:07 AM   #5
cascade168
Klaatu barada nikto
 
cascade168's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Southern NH
Bikes:
Posts: 1,453
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
You might want to look at this thread, posted on 10/18:

"Need help with spoke length"

There is a discussion of ERD in there.
cascade168 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-04, 07:34 AM   #6
phantomcow2
la vache fantôme
Thread Starter
 
phantomcow2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: NH
Bikes:
Posts: 6,266
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I got hte ERD from the Vuelta website. http://www.vueltausa.com/vuelta2/rims/rims.asp and ive got hte cross country ones.
phantomcow2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-04, 07:36 AM   #7
phantomcow2
la vache fantôme
Thread Starter
 
phantomcow2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: NH
Bikes:
Posts: 6,266
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
well what i have done is put all of hte spokes that are going one way in first, that way its much much easier to install the spokes going the other way becuase they go from the inside of hte flange out
phantomcow2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-04, 07:38 AM   #8
phantomcow2
la vache fantôme
Thread Starter
 
phantomcow2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: NH
Bikes:
Posts: 6,266
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Oh, and i just ordered the book The art of wheel building from amazon
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...books&n=507846
any opinions on this book?
phantomcow2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-04, 08:42 AM   #9
cascade168
Klaatu barada nikto
 
cascade168's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Southern NH
Bikes:
Posts: 1,453
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by phantomcow2
Oh, and i just ordered the book The art of wheel building from amazon
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...books&n=507846
any opinions on this book?
When I started building my own wheels, I used that book and Barnett's as my major references. There is a lot I like in Schraner's book, but be aware he is very opinionated (like me). For example, he is a strong proponent of tying and wiring, which some "experts" such as Jobst Brandt say is hooey. I started out with cheap rims and hubs, but have always used good quality spokes. I use the DT Competition 2.0/1.8 double butted spokes for everything now and this was influenced quite a bit by Schraner. I would love to own Brandt's book, but it is ridiculously expensive. You can get Barnett's brand new for less. I'd suggest you look at Sheldon Brown's site and another one I just found that is very interesting is: http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/

I found Barnett's the easiest and most idiot proof for lacing the spokes. I also think it gives a more complete explanation and process for truing and tensioning.

Schraner shows a resonable method for lacing. I think his cause/effect explanations for what happens during truing, dishing, and tensioning are excellent. Yes, this book was well worth the price. I like his "strive for perfection" mentality. He says it's "art", Barnett's says it's "all science". Personally, I think it's a combination of both.

FWIW, even my first home builds are still running quite nicely - and that pretty much says it ain't rocket science Take your time, have fun, and enjoy your new ride!
cascade168 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-04, 08:59 AM   #10
phantomcow2
la vache fantôme
Thread Starter
 
phantomcow2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: NH
Bikes:
Posts: 6,266
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Okay well now i have a new problem. Thres a few spokes loose out of their pile corresponding with their size. How do you actually measure the length of the spoke. When a manufactur says 261mm what is it 261mm from?
phantomcow2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-04, 09:13 AM   #11
cascade168
Klaatu barada nikto
 
cascade168's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Southern NH
Bikes:
Posts: 1,453
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by phantomcow2
Okay well now i have a new problem. Thres a few spokes loose out of their pile corresponding with their size. How do you actually measure the length of the spoke. When a manufactur says 261mm what is it 261mm from?

It's measured from inside the elbow to the end of the threads. If you have a metal scale just hang the head of the spoke over the end and read the length at the end of the threaded end. That's it.
cascade168 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-04, 10:18 AM   #12
Retro Grouch 
Senior Member
 
Retro Grouch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: St Peters, Missouri
Bikes: Rans Rockst (Retro rocket) Rans Enduro Sport (Retro racket) Catrike 559, Merin Bear Valley (beater bike).
Posts: 26,614
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 89 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by phantomcow2
Okay well now i have a new problem. Thres a few spokes loose out of their pile corresponding with their size. How do you actually measure the length of the spoke. When a manufactur says 261mm what is it 261mm from?
Length is measured from the inside radius of the elbow but don't worry about measureing them. Stand the threaded end of one of the loose spokes on a table and trial fit spokes from the same-size piles next to it until one of them matches.
Retro Grouch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-04, 10:23 AM   #13
phantomcow2
la vache fantôme
Thread Starter
 
phantomcow2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: NH
Bikes:
Posts: 6,266
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
thnx retrogrouch thats what im doing nowl. HOpefully this will be done by tonight
phantomcow2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:58 AM.