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  1. #1
    Hell bent for pleather fatsoforgotso's Avatar
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    Building 20 spoke front wheel with plain gauge spokes?

    I've built 32 and 36 spoked wheels before that are still true and tensioned.

    I have a 20h Ritchey road front hub that was never built into a wheel.
    If I get a 20h rim -I'm thinking the DTSwiss RR 585- to go with it, can I build it with plain gauge 2.0 stainless steel spokes in a radial pattern, and not have the wheel explode?

    I'm figuring each spoke might have to be tensioned to 120Kg or so, making the wheel difficult to build, making me round up nipples, causing spoke torsion and possibly overstressing the spokes during road riding. Or would the rim and hub flange give out first?
    you know, there's nothing worse than roadside surgery...

  2. #2
    AEO
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    120kgf is on the higher side, but it's not enough to round quality brass nipples or cause severe spoke torsion, especially for 2.0mm straight gauge spokes. It's not even enough to crack flanges or rims if they are rated for the tension.
    Food for thought: if you aren't dead by 2050, you and your entire family will be within a few years from starvation. Now that is a cruel gift to leave for your offspring. ;)
    http://sanfrancisco.ibtimes.com/arti...ger-photos.htm

  3. #3
    coprolite fietsbob's Avatar
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    My older Brompton has a 20 spoke wheel, hub is steel, so no possible Pull thru.
    I'd say the issue is the hub choice, if there is a lot of metal outside of the hole ,
    then fatigue of the aluminum, results in that being a lower possible outcome..

    one benefit of a bladed spoke is it can be held to not wind up with the nip rotation.

    Bontrager supplies a tool to hold the blade.

  4. #4
    30 YR Wrench BikeWise1's Avatar
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    I'm more concerned with the hub than the rim. Many light hubs have restrictions against radial spoking. An email to Ritchey might be in order before you risk your flesh....

  5. #5
    Senior Member mrrabbit's Avatar
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    Like the others, caution is more to the hubba bubba side...

    =8-)
    4000+ wheels built since 1984...

    Disclaimer:

    1. I do not claim to be an expert in bicycle mechanics despite my experience.
    2. I like anyone will comment in other areas.
    3. I do not own the preexisting concepts of DISH and ERD.
    4. I will provide information as I always have to others that I believe will help them protect themselves from unscrupulous mechanics.
    5. My all time favorite book is:

    Kahane, Howard. Logic and Contemporary Rhetoric: The Use of Reason in Everyday Life

  6. #6
    A little North of Hell
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    butted spokes

    not much difference in cost between straight gauge and the butted spokes that I would use instead.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    XXXI

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    Quote Originally Posted by fatsoforgotso View Post
    I'

    I'm figuring each spoke might have to be tensioned to 120Kg or so, making the wheel difficult to build, making me round up nipples, causing spoke torsion and possibly overstressing the spokes during road riding. Or would the rim and hub flange give out first?
    I've tensioned alloy nipples on DT 2.0/1.5 Revolutions to 124 kgf average without issue.

    When you lubricate threads and sockets with anti-seize and do something (tape flags on representative spokes, sharpie dots, etc) to monitor wind-up (about 1/4 turn by the end) it's just not a big deal.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fatsoforgotso View Post
    I've built 32 and 36 spoked wheels before that are still true and tensioned.

    I have a 20h Ritchey road front hub that was never built into a wheel.
    If I get a 20h rim -I'm thinking the DTSwiss RR 585- to go with it, can I build it with plain gauge 2.0 stainless steel spokes in a radial pattern, and not have the wheel explode?

    I'm figuring each spoke might have to be tensioned to 120Kg or so, making the wheel difficult to build, making me round up nipples, causing spoke torsion and possibly overstressing the spokes during road riding. Or would the rim and hub flange give out first?
    If it were me.. I'd swap/sell that 20 and find something more suitable. Said '20' manages to break a spoke for whatever reason.. and your high and dry.. at least. And maybe worse.

    I remember well an image posted on the web.. of a guy riding in the front of a large pack of riders.. all clustered together. The dude's front wheel is just going 'wonky'.. taco-ing.. show him just starting to go down.
    That has to produce a mess.. and some very serious injuries.

  9. #9
    Hell bent for pleather fatsoforgotso's Avatar
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    The hub is a Ritchey Pro like this one:



    If I remember correctly Ritchey is OK with radial lacing for this one, but I'll double check.

    So let me get my checklist straight:
    a) spoke torsion and nipples rounding should not be a problem, if the tension is on the order of 120Kg/spoke.
    b) check the hub x 3
    c) straight gauge, double gauge, or bladed. I'm definitely going with straight gauge unless there's a big reason to go for the other two. I don't know where I would find bladed spokes in the correct lenght but cost would be surely higher, so I'd rather leave bladed spokes out.

    Sure, breaking a single spoke is a bigger problem with the 20 spoked wheel, but I'll think about it as just one in a million little things that could just kill me when I'm riding in traffic. That eases my mind.
    you know, there's nothing worse than roadside surgery...

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by fatsoforgotso View Post
    Sure, breaking a single spoke is a bigger problem with the 20 spoked wheel, but I'll think about it as just one in a million little things that could just kill me when I'm riding in traffic. That eases my mind.
    Very true. Yet the spoke isn't making any decisions.. the rider is. Using a suitable spoke number means said one million ...minus one.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soil_Sampler View Post
    not much difference in cost between straight gauge and the butted spokes that I would use instead.
    At only 20 spoke, I'd be concerned about lateral stiffness when going to butted spokes.

    But then I'm allergic to brake rub during honking.

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