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Old 04-13-12, 07:40 PM   #1
TromboneAl
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Can't Get Cog Lockring Loose

I made a home-made chainwhip, but the lockring just won't come off. I've got a nice big wrench, but it's stuck.

Any tips for getting it off, or should I just take it into the bike shop?

Thanks,

Al
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Old 04-13-12, 07:45 PM   #2
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The torque spec on that is 30 lb/ft. That's pretty stout. I once had one that was so tight that I eventually had to cut it with a cutting disc in my Dremel.
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Old 04-13-12, 07:49 PM   #3
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It IS a cassette & not Free Wheel?
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Old 04-13-12, 08:35 PM   #4
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Best to get your terminology straight so we know what your talking about. Because you said you are using a chain whip and a big wrench, then it is assumed you are trying to remove the lockring that holds a cassette (made from different size cogs) on a freehub. The best method for this is to place the lock ring tool into the lockring and run your skewer through the tool with the end nut so the tool will stay in place. Make sure you chain whip and wrench arms are close to the same size. Now stand over the wheel with the cassette facing away from you. Drape the chain whip chain over the right side of the cassette and engage a cog with the chainwhip arm about 45deg to the left. Now engage the tool with your wrench with the arm about 45 deg to the right. Holding the wheel against you legs push down simultaneously on both tool arms using both your strength and weight. If this doesn't break it free extend the lengths of the tool arms with sections of pipe or get a friend to push down one side while you push the other down. I have never known this not to work.
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Old 04-13-12, 08:52 PM   #5
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...The best method for this is to place the lock ring tool into the lockring and run your skewer through the tool with the end nut so the tool will stay in place. .. ... Now engage the tool with your wrench with the arm about 45 deg to the right. Holding the wheel against you legs push down simultaneously on both tool arms using both your strength and weight. ...
+1. A secured tool and leverage are your best buddies here.
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Old 04-14-12, 08:07 AM   #6
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The OP mentioned a chain whip but said nothing about the lockring tool he's using.
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Old 04-14-12, 08:25 AM   #7
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Like a fixed gear locking? You know it's left threaded, right?
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Old 04-14-12, 08:39 AM   #8
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Best to get your terminology straight so we know what your talking about. Because you said you are using a chain whip and a big wrench, then it is assumed you are trying to remove the lockring that holds a cassette (made from different size cogs) on a freehub. The best method for this is to place the lock ring tool into the lockring and run your skewer through the tool with the end nut so the tool will stay in place. Make sure you chain whip and wrench arms are close to the same size. Now stand over the wheel with the cassette facing away from you. Drape the chain whip chain over the right side of the cassette and engage a cog with the chainwhip arm about 45deg to the left. Now engage the tool with your wrench with the arm about 45 deg to the right. Holding the wheel against you legs push down simultaneously on both tool arms using both your strength and weight. If this doesn't break it free extend the lengths of the tool arms with sections of pipe or get a friend to push down one side while you push the other down. I have never known this not to work.
Yes, that's exactly right, and that is exactly what I did. I'm guessing that I wasn't applying quite as much pressure as I could, worried that I was doing something wrong. The quick release nut just barely has enough room to screw onto the skewer, but I didn't tighten it down too much.

Quote:
Like a fixed gear locking? You know it's left threaded, right?
No, a standard cassette. I'm sure it's not left threaded (my mantra is that everything on the right side of the bike is right-threaded).

Quote:
It IS a cassette & not Free Wheel?
Yes.

Quote:
The OP mentioned a chain whip but said nothing about the lockring tool he's using.
A Park Tool FR5 and my cassette is a Shimano.

Thanks for the help.

Al
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Old 04-14-12, 09:02 AM   #9
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chain whip to hold the bigger cogs,and a tool with the same splines, as the lockring.
Campag and Shimano differ on that spline pattern.

they are offered in 1/2" drive for acting like a Socket, and hex to use a 12~16" 'crescent' wrench.
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Old 04-14-12, 09:12 AM   #10
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If a real track wheel and real lock ring then the kid might be trying to lose the lockring backwards??

Lockrings in track wheels/hubs have the theads reversed.. if the cog lose pulling to the back (counterwise), the lock ring tights that way and lose counterwise.

If cassette... then you need somebody to keep the chainwipp and the cassette tight and you use the cassette lockring tool with a big ass wrench.
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Old 04-14-12, 11:17 AM   #11
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Yes, that's exactly right, and that is exactly what I did. I'm guessing that I wasn't applying quite as much pressure as I could, worried that I was doing something wrong. The quick release nut just barely has enough room to screw onto the skewer, but I didn't tighten it down too much.
... I'm sure it's not left threaded (my mantra is that everything on the right side of the bike is right-threaded).
It sounds like you are doing every thing correctly you just need to use those big guns with a little more force. Your expalination of the skewer is right on. You only keep it on until you break the lockring loose, so it can be a little snug but not tight. Again a Shimano cassette lock ring is right threaded and don't worry about breaking anything. The only real issues are the lockring tool pulling out (your skewer will prevent this) or the chain whip not engaging; use one of the bigger cogs. Just keeping giving it more pressure and don't give yourself that much credit, as hard as you push, you can't hurt the wheel doing this.
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Old 04-14-12, 12:50 PM   #12
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No, a standard cassette. I'm sure it's not left threaded (my mantra is that everything on the right side of the bike is right-threaded).
A dangerous mantra. English and Swiss thread fixed cups are left hand thread, as are track hub lockrings.
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Old 04-14-12, 04:38 PM   #13
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I took it into the LBS, and the repair guy was able to break it loose. But, it was very hard, and it took him four separate grunting sessions to do it. I'll grease it up well when I reinstall it, and it should be easier next time.
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Old 04-14-12, 04:49 PM   #14
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...my mantra is that everything on the right side of the bike is right-threaded...
Mostly true, except for [english] BB cups and a fixed gear lockrings.

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Old 04-14-12, 07:07 PM   #15
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I'll grease it up well when I reinstall it, and it should be easier next time.
Also, note the installation torque for the lockring is around 30 ft-lb. Hopefully you have or can borrow a torque wrench.
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Old 04-15-12, 08:00 AM   #16
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Also, note the installation torque for the lockring is around 30 ft-lb. Hopefully you have or can borrow a torque wrench.
I have a torque wrench, but no way to attach it to the big lock ring removal tool. Maybe I can jury rig something.
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Old 04-15-12, 09:39 AM   #17
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1/2" drive lock ring tool is the Shop best, Park, etc..
Guide pin in them goes in the hollow axle,
then you get a 1/2" drive torque wrench, or dont..

Just dont knock yourself out over-tightening it this time.
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Old 04-15-12, 11:52 AM   #18
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I've always just gotten it tight with a 10" crescent. I don't know what that torque is, but I never had any trouble, not to mention I'm a pretty guy putting the force behind that wrench. *shrug*
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Old 04-15-12, 02:12 PM   #19
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I've always just gotten it tight with a 10" crescent. I don't know what that torque is, but I never had any trouble, not to mention I'm a pretty guy putting the force behind that wrench. *shrug*
Well, I may not be as pretty as you but I just made it pretty damn tight with my 10" crescent wrench. I don't think it's going to come loose.

I also learned to put the wheel on the bike and test the hub adjustment before putting the cogs back on. The first time the cones weren't tight enough so I had to take everything off and readjust.
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Old 04-15-12, 03:45 PM   #20
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*Ahem* "pretty big".
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Old 04-15-12, 04:31 PM   #21
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I have a torque wrench, but no way to attach it to the big lock ring removal tool. Maybe I can jury rig something.
The Park FR-5 fits a one-inch socket. Just match a 1" socket to the drive of your torque wrench, or use an adapter.
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