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Thread: Tiagra vs 105

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    Tiagra vs 105

    Is 2012 Tiagra beter than my 2000ish 105? Mainly the rear der. and shifters.
    If This Is Heaven...How Bad Is Hell???

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    AEO
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    yes.
    Food for thought: if you aren't dead by 2050, you and your entire family will be within a few years from starvation. Now that is a cruel gift to leave for your offspring. ;)
    http://sanfrancisco.ibtimes.com/arti...ger-photos.htm

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    bike whisperer Kimmo's Avatar
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    I'd suggest not. As long as the old gear isn't shagged.

    But I guess it depends on your criteria. I'm pretty sure there haven't been any advances in derailleur geometry since the slant parallelogram (the newer one might have bigger jockey wheels, which is a slight improvement), and the only change I'm aware of to STI aside from adding speeds is the redesign of the hidden-cable models, which Tiagra isn't one of.

    It may prove in practice that the new shifters and the old derailleur are better, or vice versa - IMO you can't be sure until you try em.

    I'd be amazed if the 105 gear wasn't at least lighter and better-looking.

    Also, when it comes to crisp shifting, I've noticed many derailleurs have play, even from new, in the upper sprung pivot. I've fixed it a few times by putting a washer behind the circlip (on Shimano derailleurs I had to file a notch in side of the washer, on the Campy one I had to grind it thinner) with good results. Finding a way to add tension to the parallelogram spring is often well worth it too. Also, on Shimano derailleurs I piff the Centeron pulley (or you can just swap the pulleys, that should be 95% as good) - if you think about it, that lateral slop in the upper pulley is kinda like a dork disk - it detracts from a properly-adjusted machine.

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    They both do the job.
    but the chain , cassette and chainrings wear from use.

    keep stuff clean and lubricated. Replace chains and etc when worn.

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    Senior Member oldbobcat's Avatar
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    Apples and oranges. 2012 Tiagra shifters do 10-speed. 2000-ish 105 is 9.

    If the old 105 shifters are nearing the end of their lives, I'd recommend new 10-speed Tiagra shifters, cassette, and chain in a heartbeat. Decent 9-speed shifters that aren't worn out are going the way of the brontosaurus. The old derailleurs are compatible and should keep going a few more years, though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kimmo View Post
    I'd suggest not. As long as the old gear isn't shagged.

    But I guess it depends on your criteria. I'm pretty sure there haven't been any advances in derailleur geometry since the slant parallelogram (the newer one might have bigger jockey wheels, which is a slight improvement), and the only change I'm aware of to STI aside from adding speeds is the redesign of the hidden-cable models, which Tiagra isn't one of.

    It may prove in practice that the new shifters and the old derailleur are better, or vice versa - IMO you can't be sure until you try em.

    I'd be amazed if the 105 gear wasn't at least lighter and better-looking.

    Also, when it comes to crisp shifting, I've noticed many derailleurs have play, even from new, in the upper sprung pivot. I've fixed it a few times by putting a washer behind the circlip (on Shimano derailleurs I had to file a notch in side of the washer, on the Campy one I had to grind it thinner) with good results. Finding a way to add tension to the parallelogram spring is often well worth it too. Also, on Shimano derailleurs I piff the Centeron pulley (or you can just swap the pulleys, that should be 95% as good) - if you think about it, that lateral slop in the upper pulley is kinda like a dork disk - it detracts from a properly-adjusted machine.
    9sp 105 is real garbage when you compare it to 2012 10sp tiagra. The newer hardware shifts better, is lighter and looks modern. What more is needed?
    Food for thought: if you aren't dead by 2050, you and your entire family will be within a few years from starvation. Now that is a cruel gift to leave for your offspring. ;)
    http://sanfrancisco.ibtimes.com/arti...ger-photos.htm

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    Igo
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    My new Defy had Tiagra. Fine machinery.
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldbobcat View Post
    Apples and oranges. 2012 Tiagra shifters do 10-speed. 2000-ish 105 is 9.

    If the old 105 shifters are nearing the end of their lives, I'd recommend new 10-speed Tiagra shifters, cassette, and chain in a heartbeat. Decent 9-speed shifters that aren't worn out are going the way of the brontosaurus. The old derailleurs are compatible and should keep going a few more years, though.
    +1

    Although you can still find plenty of 9s stuff in good condition.

    Doesn't Shimano stuff trickle down? So 9s 105 had already become 9s Tiagra. Tiagra has since become 10 speed, so I suspect it'd be better, albeit marginally.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Puget Pounder View Post
    +1
    Doesn't Shimano stuff trickle down? So 9s 105 had already become 9s Tiagra. Tiagra has since become 10 speed, so I suspect it'd be better, albeit marginally.
    Bingo

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    In my experieice, there are two issues to ocnsider with bicycle components - features and quality. While a lot of the features 'trickle down' from the higher groups to the lower ones, the quality does not. For instance, a set of 1993 7 speed Deore XT components is still better than a set of 2012 9 speed Deore components because the XT will have better materials and suffer more use and abuse before needing replacement (better quality), even though the Deore is 9 speed (more features).

    However, the difference between 105 and Tiagra is very slight and a 105 derailleur with a bit of wear in the pivots will likely be a bit more fussy to set up and keep adjusted than a brand new Tiagra replacement.
    When new they all work almost the same - you likely could not tell the difference between Tiagra and 105 or Ultegra when new. Even if you could discern a difference, it won't make a difference to the way the bike rides.

    Unless your 105 stuff is damaged or totally worn out (the derailleurs - the shifters tend to not wear out so much as occaisionally and suddenly 'fail') then it can be set up to behave almost as well or as well as the Tiagra stuff. Newer != better.
    If you have a working set of 105 components 'upgrading' to Tiagra will be a waste of money. New cables, chain, cassette, and possibly derailleur jockey wheels will make the bike work like new.

  11. #11
    bike whisperer Kimmo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AEO View Post
    9sp 105 is real garbage when you compare it to 2012 10sp tiagra. The newer hardware shifts better, is lighter and looks modern. What more is needed?
    I'm sure the crankset and BB are lighter, but what else has really changed, other than the addition of a cog and styling? (And speaking of looks, modern Shimano cranks are vile.)

    There's the STI redesign (meh), but Tiagra still has exposed cables, amirite?

    And derailleurs still have the same actuation ratio, which is barely sufficient for 8spd. All the tiny shifter refinements in the world aren't worth a damn next to increasing cable pull.

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