harescbl905

On a steel bike is there anything specail you need to do when cleaning it or riding it (avoiding rain)? How well does it resist rusting (better/worse than aluminum)? O and I did try searching but all I could find was some steel vs. aluminum.

PS. The reason Im asking is I was lookling at the Evil DOC frame so its good quality.

Maelstrom 

:drool:....evil doc is a god frame.

Don't avoid rain. If you do it get it wet just make sure you dry it well. But really I don't think you will have to many problems. I am moving this to the maintenance forum as you may get more knowledgable responses there. I just ride my steel bike, don't think to much about it (although it isn't the same price as the DOC, I might be more concerned otherwise)

mtbikerinpa

I have never hear of that effect before, and I have studied cro-mo a fair bit. Unless you are heat treating, the chromium element is alloyed into the iron and will not precipitate out. Obviously chromium has a much higher resistance to wear and deep corrosion, but the plating processes that we would run into in this indusry are rarely pure enough to prevent bleed through corrosion.
Regardless, the name of the game is to dry then coat it. Exposed metal is vulnderable. Paint is cosmetic and effective, but car wax(carnauba and the like) are also good. An old saying says 'A polished bike will never rust or leave you stranded'. If you keep it polished and waxed there are no external things that can surprise you, since your nose is right up close all the time. It sounds excessive, but once you try it it is no big deal. I can wax/polish mine up in less than 20 mins if i feel like it(but I like to relax).
Internally: You will want to leave the frame in warm dry places after wet rides, this allows any dampness to evaporate. Starting with a dry frame(rust or no) apply a liberal coating of Extend or similar rust treater. It bonds with any oxides formed inside the tubes(you will need to slosh it a bit) and makes a hardshell rust proof coating. Once that has hardened, the areas are good for essentially ever, though it only makes a tru bond with corroded areas. As such, a little bit here and there may be good, but it will automatically coat the areas where water will lay. I will assume for now that you have a bottom-bracket drain hole. If not, do a forum search on such, it was discussed recently.
After the extend treatment, spray a coating of LPS-3 boat tubing treatment oil. It is of a similar composition to linseed oil, but with its straw spray nozzel it can actually be applied. I replenish the LPS coating every 8 months or so, and this is a very wet area.

With those treatments effected on your frame, it should last a great long while. I just had my 14 yr old one apart after a bad wreck(had to change a tube) and there were no active rust pockets, and hardly any former ones, that were treated. I have done almost 4 seasons worth of river-crossing mud xc races, lived on a tropical island(where the previous owner left it outside for 5 yrs) and I use it for everything. So, no worries.

harescbl905

Alright thank you. Mael pretty soon if I can sell a few things Im buying a DOC with a Pike or Z1. Its gonne be a dream come true.

sydney

totally wrong.

late

Hi,
that boat tubing protector sounds like it might be worth trying,
This is the classic stuff that you spray into steel frames.
https://www.bikemannetwork.com/biking...BELBPOL/LU7500

phantomcow2

two words aren't enough to help somebody out, whats wrong about it?

DocF

Read mtbikerinpa's post. He has it pretty much right.

Doc

DocF

Major problem here--you are talking about a stainless steel alloy (which will rust, believe me; we use 308 tubing for front axles on race cars quite often) and bicycles are built of alloys similar to 4130 used for airplanes and open wheel race cars. The various chromolly alloys will rust quite readily. Here I speak from over 50 years experience messing with this stuff.

I say again, mtbikerinpa has is right.

Doc

sydney

Well, the subject was not about stainless steel, but alloy steel in general as used in bike frames, including chromo, chrome vanadium, manganese moly and so forth. Some of which like 531 and 753 manganese moly have no chromium at all. The rest(excluding stainleess) have relatively low chromium contents, which does not rise to the surface.Check the definition of alloy . Any chromium on the surface of chrome moly steel, or other non stainless steel alloy is the result of a secondary plating process.If that plating is damaged,the underlying steel can rust.

sydney

FWIW, you need to re-read that blurb with the comprehension switch in the on position ,so you can do a better job of regurgitating it next time,.

MichaelW

You can get a wax treatment for the inside of the tubes called frame-saver. I have an old frame and sprayed in some WD40 which seems to have the same effect, a bright shiny rust-free surface on the inside.
Watch out for water accumulating inside the frame from seepage or condensation. A drainage hole in the bottom bracket shell will solve this if it becomes a regular problem.
Apply several layers of car wax to the clean dry outside of the frame. I find that one application a year is sufficient.
If the paint gets chipped, apply something to protect the surface. You can use touch up paint, car wax or a smear of light grease.
Steel frames will last a lifetime if you look after them.

powers2b

Steel bike: WD-40 on the inside of the frame, and keep the bike clean (wax or pledge if you have time). Note: WD-40 on the paint may degrade the finish over time.
Enjoy

jemoryl

The time to make sure the inside of the frame is rustproof is at the factory, IMO. I know of a few buiders who are very careful about this (and I'm sure there are others): Basso (when they made steel frames) and Scapin come to mind. Here is a description of a rustproofing treatment from the Scapin website (www.scapin.com):

Scapin Bike was the first bicycle manufacturer in the world to introduce the cataphoresis treatment to its products, taking the initiative from the experience of distinguished and well known
automotive firms.This treatment consisting of three distinct phases has definitively resolved one limitation evident in steel frames rust and corrosion and renders our products impervious to atmospheric agents. The first treatment, ZINC NICKEL PLATING, is an external one, and protects the tubing from damage by atmospheric agents.

Our treatments resistance to corrosion has been tested in saline mist for approximately 1000 hours. PHOSPHATION, the successive treatment, is applied both externally and internally; it guarantees a uniform bonding for the BLACK CATAPHORESIS, the final A.W.P. treatment. BLACK CATAPHORESIS is a treatment effected by immersion in a tank; it is both external and internal, and among its principal characteristics are elevated resistance to corrosion (almost 1000 hours in saline mist) and greatly increased surface hardness. This procedure unites the benefits of three treatments, whose objective is to obtain a product that has practically a lifetime resistance to rust, the guarantee of a product that is technologically advanced and durable over time, a Scapin product.

Scapin makes a very nice frame....

Joe

SJK

I just bought a slightly used Columbus Nivacrom steel frame and there is some paint chipped away on the derailleur hanger. What would you recommend to coat this area of chipped away paint?

mtbikerinpa

If you can clean it and yiu have the right stuff, paint is best. Otherwise wax it with the same carnuba you should be using externally anyway. As long as it is not in air it is fine, oil, wax, paint all solve that.

alanbikehouston

I was reading some stuff about the old Schwinn factory in Chicago, and it discussed the fact that Schwinn put some sort of anti-rust treatment on its steel tubes before priming and painting. The treatment was intended to limit rust to the surface, and prevent it from actually eating down into the metal.

Here in the Houston/Galveston area, the salt water breezes off the Gulf of Mexico "eats" steel. I see bikes in Galveston that are just a year or so old that have a lot of surface corrosion. But, I also see a lot of old Schwinns from the '60's. Beach cruisers, Varsities, Suburbans, and Collegiates. Thirty or Forty years of exposure to the Gulf climate. Lots of surface corrosion. And not a SINGLE spot where the rust has eaten down into the tube.

I was curious about this, and began asking guys at some of the long-time Schwinn dealers "Have you ever seen a Chicago-made frame actually FAIL solely because of rust or corrosion?" No one could remember seeing a single Chicago frame that had failed only because of corrosion.

I have also read that Reynolds "pre-treated" its 531 tubing for corrosion prior to shipping the tubes to builders. I have some twenty year old bikes with 531 tubes. These bikes clearly have been "ridden hard and put up wet". Little chips in the paint have created a little surface corrosion here and there. But, after looking carefully, I have seen no evidence that these tubes are not as strong as the day they left England. I am going to wear out before these frames do.

mtbikerinpa

THe treatment you refer to is actually commonplace in the better manufacturers. It is a coating of a phosphate chemical that reacts to the surface and treats it from corrosion. This is what gives steel frames a blackish brown color when they are stripped with chemical strippers(designed not to eat that). Internally speaking, the frames are not so consistently treated. If they are then it is good, but they are often done haphazzardly if at all. That is why I cut to the chase and instally preventive measures inside my frames. The phosphate is not perfect either, it will eventually break down and allow corrosion.

Another point with the old Schwinns,(I have almost a dozen 60s era ones) is they have some extremely thick tubing walls. Not very light, but they last.

classic1

Touch it up or paint over it with clear nail polish.