mcallaghan

Not sure if this is the right thread for this, but I am trying to figure out more about my Titanium Merlin.

I purchased it in 2003/2004 with it being about 2 years old (I believe a 2002 model). Its Titanium, with Dura-Ace Components, but thats all I can figure out. It has a carbon-fiber front fork that has 'Wound Up' decal on it.The only other sticker I can find says:

MERLING
3 - 2.5
Titanium

Not quite sure what that means or if it helps reveal the exact model.

Its also a compact (no granny gear) which is why I want to sell it (thus figure out what model etc so I can price it).

I bought it when I was in much better physical shape and having compact gearing on it was not an issue. I've really only ridden it for 2 out of the last 5 years (for various reasons) and now that I live in the Rockies, I find that the gearing is not low enough for me to ride the mountains out here. I am going to look around the LBS and see if I can perhaps trade it in and apply it towards buying a new bike from them, something that does have a granny gear so I can better enjoy my rides out here and ride Independence Pass with out dying on the way up!

goatalope

Pictures would help. On first blush, I'd think you could get $1000-1500 for it. Not a lot of shops do trade-ins, but feel free to ask.

Airburst

All 3-2.5 means is that the titanium alloy used is 3% aluminium and 2.5% vanadium, which is the standard alloy used for titanium frames, so unfortunately it doesn't really reveal much.

mcallaghan

I took some crappy pictures on my cellphone when I rolled out of bed this morning. I think I'll wait to get home and take some proper ones since the cellphone ones don't really help a whole lot. I'll take some proper ones when I get home to see if I can figure anything else out. I'll also start talking to some LBS to see if they'll do a trade in...otherwise I guess its Craigslist?

HillRider

Merlin was/is a very high-line Titanium bicycle maker and, as Airburst noted, that 3/2.5 is the Ti alloy used in it's construction. What cassette does it now have and would fitting a wider range cassette make it more suitable for your riding? Also, you could fit a triple crank to it at less cost than a newer bike.

mcallaghan

The rear cassette has already been changed to something more suitable for hill climbing years ago, probably around the time I first got the bike. I'd have to count the teeth to see exactly what I have since I don't know off the top of my head. Switching to a Triple Crank would require new shifters etc wouldn't it? Basically an entire new groupset? Which would roughly be $1500 or so?

Airburst

Not a whole groupset - your wheelset and brakes will definitely still work. If you can find a triple-compatible left-hand shifter that matches the shifters you currently have, you can just change that, the crankset and maybe the front derailleur. You may also need a new rear derailleur with a longer cage to take up the additional chain slack when you shift into your small ring on the front, depending on what you currently have.

Or you can have odd shifters, but you may not like that.

If you've got Campagnolo brifters, my understanding is that most of their left-hand ones will shift a triple or a double.

wrk101

Trade in is a good way to lose quite a bit of value there, probably at least half if not more. A lot of shops around here would consider a 11 year old bike to be obsolete, even a really nice Merlin (OK, its less likely). I routinely have shops tell me any bike over 5 or 6 years old is obsolete and should be replaced (thats BS). Shops get exposed to the latest and greatest, and drink the koolaid.

Realize the only thing on your bike that is Merlin is the frame. Everything came from the same suppliers that sold parts to everyone else.

One possible change is just put a triple crankset on it. A triple does not require an entire new group. But it can mean a new bb, new crankset, new FD, new RD, and new front shifter. The cost? It really depends how resourceful you are. $1500 is high, I guess its possible to spend that much. But its also possible to do it for a fraction of that amount.

Some Shimano STI are double and triple compatible. ON DA, they had a separate triple STI.

https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...iple-Questions

Myself, I am a big fan of N+1. I would be hunting up an easier geared touring/sport touring bike. For the steepest hills around here, I will either ride my touring bike, or my drop bar conversion mountain bike. On the flatter stuff, I'll pull out the Colnago racing bike, or whatever.

mconlonx

Dura Ace triples hang the granny ring off the middle ring. Not that the chainrings and triple spacers/bolts would be exactly cheap, but you shouldn't need a new crank.

Or, buy cheaper components, used or NOS Ultegra triple shifters and crankset from the same era; box the DA components for if you want to sell the bike in the future, or sell them off to finance the triple conversion.

mcallaghan

I'm not very resourceful/mechanically inclined. I know enough to maintain my bike, but not to install new parts or know the difference between various brands etc with out looking online and reading reviews. I'll give the LBS a call later and see what they'd suggest. I think I've tried to have some one do it in the past, but was recommended against doing such a switch.

gilaasepeda

if you change the part, 105 is the best value here. shifter, triple crank 50-39-30, bb ht2, sprocket tiagra 12-30,fd ,rd for less than $400. chainring 30t meet sprocket 30t should be light at least im using this configuration, but im not sure if your wheelset fit with 10 speed sprocket.

mcallaghan

Thanks for all the advice. I think I'll go down to the 105 and keep the Dura Ace...not sure what the resale value on those components would be...and might be nice to have around should I ever return to flatter climes. Out here, the 'Flat' ride involves somewhere in the ballpark of an 800ft Climb...which I am barely able to do on the Compact. Of course, the rides I want to do involve 12-mile, 3000ft climbs (the Maroon Bells, Castle Creek to Ashcroft, Independence Pass) which I just can't do on the current setup.

pierce

the other complication on upgrading stuff like this, in 2002, D-A was probably a 9 speed group (9 cogs on the back cassette). now its a 10 or 11 speed group, and uses a much skinnier chain, so nothing new D-A will work. putting low-to-mid grade Tiagra type parts on there would be a travesty IMHO.

if your rear derailleur is a long arm, you probably can run as low as a 34T rear sprocket, which is a 1:1 gear, and should be plenty low enough to get up the steepest hills on a light bike after a few weeks of regular riding. just changing the cassette is inexpensive, a 8 or 9 speed HG50 type cassette would be fine, and cost maybe $20 or $30 plus $10 to install if the LBS aren't rippoffs. cheaper if you just bring the wheel.

on the back of the rear derailleur should be a stamped number, like RD-7xxx (7 is the dura-ace series, RD is rear derailleur). if you can find that, we can probably figure out what the max low gear you could run is.

trick for counting teeth on rear cogs... wheel off bike, use a finger on each hand, and start at adjacent teeth at 12 oclock, and count by twos. a compact probably has an 11T high gear, which is for racers in a high speed peloton, and is silly-too-high for anything else, so I'd get a replacement cassette with a 13T high gear.


update: ah. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shimano#Road_groupsets suggests RD-77xx from 1996 is 9-speed, RD-78xx from 2003 is 10 speed, so you could have a 9 or 10 speed.

edit: and, oops. RD-7700 only came short, and has max 26T rear. reference: https://techdocs.shimano.com/media/te...9830610603.pdf
RD-7800 only came short, too (actually, I don't thinkt here are any long cage dura-ace as its the 'race' group), and has a 27T max rear cog.
reference: https://techdocs.shimano.com/media/te...9830612494.pdf

gilaasepeda

i forgot to tell rear derailleur 105 need long cage RD-5700-GS for accommodate triple crank

HillRider

Perhaps a bit of background on Merlin might be of interest. Merlin was one of the first makers of Titanium bikes and was considered a boutique brand, probably above Litespeed in the pecking order. Several years ago Merlin was purchased by American Bicycle Group, who also bought Litespeed and Quanta Roo and Merlin and Litespeed were "merged". Apparently, Merlins appeal and sales fell rather sharply after this and recently Merlin was purchased by Competative Cyclist and they hope to give it a rebirth. Here is an article on that acquisition with a bit of history included:

https://velonews.competitor.com/2011/...e-group_165369

The upshot is you have a very high end frame and it's well worth installing good components.

Drew Eckhardt 

Installing a triple crank, derailleurs, and shift levers is not a big deal especially with used parts.

mcallaghan

Alright...sorry for the delay. Looks like the rear derailleur says RD-7700.

I think the rear cassette has a big ring of 28 and the smallest ring is 12. I may have miscounted.

On the front, looks like the big ring is around 54-teeth. Not sure on the other ring.

pierce

54T is a larger than normal big ring on a conventional double, something that might be used by triathletes, who tend to be mashers rather than spinners. A conventional road double is 52-39 or 53-39 (and yes, I realize 54 is hardly bigger than 53).

you have a 9 speed system, a lot of newer road bike stuff is 10 speed, even 11, to change this would require different shifters, this greatly adds to the expense and complexity of the conversion.

easy way to count teeth on a sprocket, use the index finger of both hands, start on two adjacent teeth at the top, and count by twos. if there's an odd tooth at the bottom, add 1

your front sprockets should have the teeth count stamped on them, near the edge and probably opposite the crank arm.

a RD-7700 was speced as having a max front chainring difference of 14 teeth, a max total capacity of 26T, and a max rear sprocket of 26T.

The total capacity is calcuated as (bigfront-smallfront) + (bigrear-smallrear), or if you prefer (bigfront+bigrear) - (smallfront+smallrear). for instance, a 53-39 is a chainring difference of 14T, and an 12-28 is a rear difference of 16, for a total difference of 30T, which in theory exceeds the capacity of your rear derailleur. in reality, you can get away with some of this with careful adjustment, but it means you're already at the stretching point. a compact double crank is typically 50-34, which is a front difference of 16.

re: tradeins, you'd likely get more if your local bike shop will sell it on commission rather than buying it from you, assuming they do both. one local high end shop that does this will give you 50% of the resale value on a trade-in, and 70-75% of the actual sale price on a commission sale.

Bill Kapaun

Maybe you can pick out the bike from these-

https://www.bikepedia.com/QuickBike/B...n#.URxqW2fnOGY

It appears , at quick glance, some of the bikes with (04) in the name might match yours.

3alarmer 

You really ought to either post some photos or show the thing to someone there
who both knows something about bicycle mechanics and has no financial interests
in selling you a new bike/a buncha high end parts.

For a number of years, Merlins were made by Kellogg, IIRC. some of his bikes (like
the one I have) have a kinda strange BB shell, which I've never encountered
before and might be hard to change out. But as stated already, 54 is a pretty
big chainring, which can be changed out reasonably, and it is entirely possible
that your front derlr and brifter will accommodate a third small chainring with some
simple adjustment.

The big question, in my mind, is what's involved in adding that third ring on the crank.
And of course, obtaining a longer cage rear derailleur that works with your current setup.


I'd be doing some research and talking before I took a bath on it selling it on CL
and then buying something else.........but I have more experience with this stuff.

Certainly if you end up selling it on CL, someone of the vultures like we who roost
here will be most appreciative of the swell deal they are likely to get on it.

Carbon fiber bikes and the price they command has sucked most of the cash out
of the used market for bikes like yours. It's sad, but that's how it is.

mcallaghan

Don't get me wrong, I like my Merlin. Its just the gearing is not suited for riding out here (at least, with me on the bike). The three fulltime bikeshops out here (the other 2 - 3 turn into Ski-gear for the winter)...2 of them I will probably not go to. One is a Trek Dealer with really high end gear (Lance Armstrong does have a place out here and is seen a lot during the summer months) and the other shop (where I got my Surly as it was the only Surly dealer) is too pricey by far as well. Which leads the third - the one I went to to get a new helmet and shoes etc. I'll give them a call tomorrow, I think, and see what they think they can do. Price is certainly a big issue in regards to this. The paths looked relatively ice/snow free today so if that is the case tomorrow I'll be able to take the bike in - even if its just so they can take a look.

bargainguy

Nothing against bike shops, but $60-80/hr labor charge is not unheard of.

Is it possible there's a bicycle aficionado, retired mechanic or some such who'd be able to help install, guide you as far as part selection and perhaps get something in return for a skill you possess? Barter is coming back these days as folks hunker down and cash gets short.

pierce

you have a very high end, even exotic, frame, with the best parts Shimano had to offer. I wouldn't take it to the corner hack who rebuilds beater bikes for the neighbor kids.

bargainguy

Not what I meant. Sometimes there are folks around you who have the requesite skills to do a job outside the traditional channels. Heck, if I lived anywhere near the Rockies, I'd help you myself, and I'm a certificed bike mechanic (yes, there is such a thing).

fietsbob

.. thats when you hire the services of a Professional at a bike shop, near you .


The one here has a labor flat rate of $60, to do lots of things.. parts not included.