How to remove cranks?
02-11-05, 07:34 PM
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well.... i suppose you could go out with a crow bar if your that in need, i hope you like your frames finish if you do. You will probably have to buy the proper tool, ive seen them on ebay for cheap so it isnt that bad.,
https://www.parktool.com/tools/CCP_2.shtml
https://www.parktool.com/tools/CCP_2.shtml
02-11-05, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by fixie.ninja
Hi gang --
I've been desperately trying to remove my cranks for over an hour, and I can't figure out how to do it. They are the square taper variety, and the locking nut has been removed. They appear to be stuck on with friction (and old age). I have saturated them with a thread unlocker, and they do not budge. I have hit them and yelled at them -- to no avail. Am I going to have to bite the bullet and buy a proper tool?
I've been desperately trying to remove my cranks for over an hour, and I can't figure out how to do it. They are the square taper variety, and the locking nut has been removed. They appear to be stuck on with friction (and old age). I have saturated them with a thread unlocker, and they do not budge. I have hit them and yelled at them -- to no avail. Am I going to have to bite the bullet and buy a proper tool?
Doc
02-11-05, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by fixie.ninja
Hi gang --
I've been desperately trying to remove my cranks for over an hour, and I can't figure out how to do it. They are the square taper variety, and the locking nut has been removed. They appear to be stuck on with friction (and old age). I have saturated them with a thread unlocker, and they do not budge. I have hit them and yelled at them -- to no avail. Am I going to have to bite the bullet and buy a proper tool?
I've been desperately trying to remove my cranks for over an hour, and I can't figure out how to do it. They are the square taper variety, and the locking nut has been removed. They appear to be stuck on with friction (and old age). I have saturated them with a thread unlocker, and they do not budge. I have hit them and yelled at them -- to no avail. Am I going to have to bite the bullet and buy a proper tool?
02-11-05, 07:36 PM
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Yes.
It's called a crank extractor. You'll see that the holes in the cranks are actually threaded, so you thread in the extractor and then there's a center barrel that threads through the extractor body and pushes against the spindle.
Or you can just go out and torque the hell out of your cranks if you don't even want to use them again. It'll round out the square hole.
It's called a crank extractor. You'll see that the holes in the cranks are actually threaded, so you thread in the extractor and then there's a center barrel that threads through the extractor body and pushes against the spindle.
Or you can just go out and torque the hell out of your cranks if you don't even want to use them again. It'll round out the square hole.
02-11-05, 07:38 PM
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yep, when i wanted to remove the crranks off an old frame, which i would never use again. I used the crowbar, sprayed WD40 on the spindle, well where the square meets the actual crank, and there you are. with a hammer it came off with enough beating
02-11-05, 07:46 PM
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every bike shop will have this tool, you can ask them to do it and they might charge you 3 bucks. Its quick and easy with the tool
02-11-05, 08:50 PM
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Sounds like you have a cotter crank, which my bike book recommends tapping lightly with a hammer. I did this recently and the thing popped out no problem. I plan on installing new, more modern cranks that uses a more sensible mechanism to hold it in place... but of course that means a new, more modern bottom bracket as well.
The metal creak/pop in your left crank... can you *feel* it? Or just hear it? If you can feel it, it's probably the metal of the crank wearing out against the cotter pin or spindle, and you will need a new one. Once they start to go like that, they're gone. If it's just a creaking sound, then yeah: clean & repack & make sure everything is tight & see if it goes away.
The metal creak/pop in your left crank... can you *feel* it? Or just hear it? If you can feel it, it's probably the metal of the crank wearing out against the cotter pin or spindle, and you will need a new one. Once they start to go like that, they're gone. If it's just a creaking sound, then yeah: clean & repack & make sure everything is tight & see if it goes away.
02-11-05, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by fixie.ninja
Along these same lines (crank issues) --
I'm going to buy the tool (prefer to do my own maintenance). I was initially trying to tear everything apart to clean up and repack the bottom bracket. There's been a really weird metal creak/pop coming from the left crank, every time I exert heavy force on the pedal. It is not the pedal (tried two other pedals known to work properly). I wasn't sure what could be the problem -- I was hoping a rebuild would incidentally fix whatever was happening. Any ideas?
I'm going to buy the tool (prefer to do my own maintenance). I was initially trying to tear everything apart to clean up and repack the bottom bracket. There's been a really weird metal creak/pop coming from the left crank, every time I exert heavy force on the pedal. It is not the pedal (tried two other pedals known to work properly). I wasn't sure what could be the problem -- I was hoping a rebuild would incidentally fix whatever was happening. Any ideas?
02-11-05, 10:06 PM
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The secret bike mechanic trick is................
Use the right tool! In this case, a crankarm extractor.
Use the right tool! In this case, a crankarm extractor.
02-12-05, 10:12 AM
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The creak is quite likely from an undertightened crank arm bolt. It could also be from the BB, a cracked BB shell, or the pedals, but my money would be on the crank.
After you put the crank back on, be sure to torque the hell out of it. There's a set lbf load that you're supposed to torque to, but that may be incorrect at this point given that it's been creaking around on you.
I believe Jobst Brandt has a very nice rant wherein he debunks the old myths that alloy cranks need no grease when seating on the spindle (he points out that they won't seize for lack of grease but the grease will allow you to properly seat them in the first place) and that overtightening will cause the cranks to "walk" up the spindle and split. In actuality, undertightening causes the crank's spindle hole to widen, requiring more tightening in a never-ending spiral until the combined damage and bolt tension will do the splitting.
So the moral is, install your cranks right the first time and you won't have any problems.
After you put the crank back on, be sure to torque the hell out of it. There's a set lbf load that you're supposed to torque to, but that may be incorrect at this point given that it's been creaking around on you.
I believe Jobst Brandt has a very nice rant wherein he debunks the old myths that alloy cranks need no grease when seating on the spindle (he points out that they won't seize for lack of grease but the grease will allow you to properly seat them in the first place) and that overtightening will cause the cranks to "walk" up the spindle and split. In actuality, undertightening causes the crank's spindle hole to widen, requiring more tightening in a never-ending spiral until the combined damage and bolt tension will do the splitting.
So the moral is, install your cranks right the first time and you won't have any problems.
02-12-05, 11:57 AM
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Originally Posted by bostontrevor
Nice article/post. Really puts some good solid thoughts around the grease / no grease debate on crank installation.
02-12-05, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by dobber
Nice article/post. Really puts some good solid thoughts around the grease / no grease debate on crank installation.
02-12-05, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by operator
New... bottom bracket...
02-12-05, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by fixie.ninja
So my cranks may be in the preliminary stages of what that article talks about, since they're certainly not loose, and to my knowledge have never been removed (the crank bolts looked like they've never been touched.
02-12-05, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by sydney
Already been said,but no one seems to be listening. If the crankarm stays tight it likely isn't hosed,and it typically doensn't make crunchy noises either.
Hey, what do you mean when you say 'hosed' ? I'm just curious about what that term means. Thanks! And by the way, I thought that all the bottom bracket was is just a whole in the bottom of the frame, and then you put the crank bearings and spindle through. Is there more to it? This is something I've been wondering about for a LONG time, and I just keep forgetting to ask.
02-12-05, 05:55 PM
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flyboy, what you're talking about is the bottom bracket *shell*. The bottom bracket itself is all the crap that sits inside there. These days it tends to be a single unit like this guy right here:
Back in the day it would be loose ball bearings, some cones, cups, and the BB spindle. On American-style bottom brackets (any 1-piece crankset) the BB spindle and crank arms are one-in-the-same.
fixie.ninja, let us know what it ends up being. I'd be curious to know.
Back in the day it would be loose ball bearings, some cones, cups, and the BB spindle. On American-style bottom brackets (any 1-piece crankset) the BB spindle and crank arms are one-in-the-same.
fixie.ninja, let us know what it ends up being. I'd be curious to know.
02-12-05, 08:10 PM
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Originally Posted by bostontrevor
flyboy, what you're talking about is the bottom bracket *shell*. The bottom bracket itself is all the crap that sits inside there. These days it tends to be a single unit like this guy right here:
Back in the day it would be loose ball bearings, some cones, cups, and the BB spindle. On American-style bottom brackets (any 1-piece crankset) the BB spindle and crank arms are one-in-the-same.
fixie.ninja, let us know what it ends up being. I'd be curious to know.
Back in the day it would be loose ball bearings, some cones, cups, and the BB spindle. On American-style bottom brackets (any 1-piece crankset) the BB spindle and crank arms are one-in-the-same.
fixie.ninja, let us know what it ends up being. I'd be curious to know.
Ok, so the part that is hollow on the frame is the bottom bracket *shell*. And the actual 'bottom bracket' is the spindle, and bearings? And you put the bearings in the bottom bracket, then you put the spindle and spindle spacer in throught the holes in the bearings, right? And then you put on the crank arms, and spacers, possibly even cones (if any) and then put the crank bolts in the crank arm threads and tighten. Is that all right? And then it should all hold together? Or did I miss a step?
02-12-05, 08:49 PM
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Well in the classic BB setup, the spindle also has the cones built in. Then the bearings and the cups go on. Then the cranks onto the spindle. Finally the retaining bolts or nuts (depending on BB spindle design) hold the cranks on.
02-13-05, 11:02 AM
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Originally Posted by bostontrevor
Well in the classic BB setup, the spindle also has the cones built in. Then the bearings and the cups go on. Then the cranks onto the spindle. Finally the retaining bolts or nuts (depending on BB spindle design) hold the cranks on.
02-13-05, 11:38 AM
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No, if it's a modern bottom bracket, it's probably a unit like pictured above. You screw the unit into the BB shell and install the non-driveside cup. Now attach the cranks and you're done.
edit: even if it were a loose ball BB, you're a little confused, I think. The BB spindle has the cones built in, they sit inboard from the bearings. So first you attach the fixed cup and put in its bearings. Then install the spindle from the other side. Then put in the other set of bearings and finally install the adjustable cup. Now install the cranks and ride.
Here are some photos that might make it a little clearer how an old-style BB goes together:
https://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/...e_track_BB.jpg
https://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/i...a-bb-axles.gif
https://www.flying-scot.co.uk/other_m...nger_patp4.jpg (cottered, but it doesn't really matter for our purposes)
edit: even if it were a loose ball BB, you're a little confused, I think. The BB spindle has the cones built in, they sit inboard from the bearings. So first you attach the fixed cup and put in its bearings. Then install the spindle from the other side. Then put in the other set of bearings and finally install the adjustable cup. Now install the cranks and ride.
Here are some photos that might make it a little clearer how an old-style BB goes together:
https://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/...e_track_BB.jpg
https://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/i...a-bb-axles.gif
https://www.flying-scot.co.uk/other_m...nger_patp4.jpg (cottered, but it doesn't really matter for our purposes)
Last edited by bostontrevor; 02-13-05 at 11:46 AM.
02-13-05, 11:57 AM
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Originally Posted by bostontrevor
No, if it's a modern bottom bracket, it's probably a unit like pictured above. You screw the unit into the BB shell and install the non-driveside cup. Now attach the cranks and you're done.
edit: even if it were a loose ball BB, you're a little confused, I think. The BB spindle has the cones built in, they sit inboard from the bearings. So first you attach the fixed cup and put in its bearings. Then install the spindle from the other side. Then put in the other set of bearings and finally install the adjustable cup. Now install the cranks and ride.
Here are some photos that might make it a little clearer how an old-style BB goes together:
https://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/...e_track_BB.jpg
https://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/i...a-bb-axles.gif
https://www.flying-scot.co.uk/other_m...nger_patp4.jpg (cottered, but it doesn't really matter for our purposes)
edit: even if it were a loose ball BB, you're a little confused, I think. The BB spindle has the cones built in, they sit inboard from the bearings. So first you attach the fixed cup and put in its bearings. Then install the spindle from the other side. Then put in the other set of bearings and finally install the adjustable cup. Now install the cranks and ride.
Here are some photos that might make it a little clearer how an old-style BB goes together:
https://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/...e_track_BB.jpg
https://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/i...a-bb-axles.gif
https://www.flying-scot.co.uk/other_m...nger_patp4.jpg (cottered, but it doesn't really matter for our purposes)
Ok, I still don't know if I get it completely. So if the bottom bracket has it's own spindle, then where does the crank arm spindle go? Ok, ok, I have a question:
When you buy a new crankset, it comes with the crank arms, the spindle, and the bearings. Then some spacers and cones. Is that all right? Then you put the spindle and bearings in the BB shell. Correct? And there is the BB bracket, right? All it is is the crank spindle and the bearings, that is what makes up the bottom bracket right?
02-13-05, 12:18 PM
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No, when you buy a new crankset you get the crank arms. Full stop.
There are no spacers involved, the cones are part of the bottom bracket spindle. Those are the two bulges in the spindle body.
That's a bottom bracket right there. The circular thing on the right is the fixed cup. It goes in the drive side. There are some bearings in that little container on the left. Some of those go in. Then in goes the spindle. Then the bearings are put into the adjustable cup (grease holds them in place) and that is screwed into the non drive side. That's it. It's put together.
The plastic thing is a dust cover and is optional. If it's going to be used it needs to go on before the adjustable cup is installed.
When you're done, you have an assembly like
If you look closely at that image you can see that the bottom bracket shell and part of the downtube and chainstays are drawn in lightly. The cranks then attach to the ends of the spindle.
There are no spacers involved, the cones are part of the bottom bracket spindle. Those are the two bulges in the spindle body.
That's a bottom bracket right there. The circular thing on the right is the fixed cup. It goes in the drive side. There are some bearings in that little container on the left. Some of those go in. Then in goes the spindle. Then the bearings are put into the adjustable cup (grease holds them in place) and that is screwed into the non drive side. That's it. It's put together.
The plastic thing is a dust cover and is optional. If it's going to be used it needs to go on before the adjustable cup is installed.
When you're done, you have an assembly like
If you look closely at that image you can see that the bottom bracket shell and part of the downtube and chainstays are drawn in lightly. The cranks then attach to the ends of the spindle.