edotomato

I've got a bike with a 7-speed chainring that I'm looking to replace the drivetrain on, upgrading to either 10- or 11-speed. If I use 10-speed, will I have to use a 10-speed specific chainring, or can I use a 9-, or even a standard 678 chainring?

FBinNY 

You cannot use a 7/8 chain, but can use some 9s chains. Not all 9s chains are exactly the same width so some of the narrower ones will be OK. Be aware that the wider chain means more critical trim in the rear to avoid contact with the next larger sprocket.

I'm still using the last of my old Sram 89r chains with Chorus 10, but when they're gone, I'll go to 10s chains, though I'll miss the reusable connector.

fietsbob

+1 on Measuring things..

Roller width dictates the distance between the inside of the inner link cage plates.

to pack in more gears in a finite space the whole chain has to be thinner .

so. since at 8 speed te hub axle width spread stopped .at 130. [135 on MTB]

something has to give .. thats width.

to some extent a new bike with all the latest components is a better value than buying a whole new drivetain and retrofitting it

1, 7 speed normal, is narrower rear frame width.

HillRider

Wipperman 10-speed chains come with their reusable "Connex" connector link. I believe the KMC 10-speed master link is also reusable.

Drew Eckhardt 

KMC also sells a missing-link specifically for Campagnolo brand chains.

FBinNY 

Yes, I sold Wippermann chains for years, and still have a bunch to unload. But at the wrate I'm wearing my 89r chains (4 in rotation) it'll be about 2 more years before I'm in the market. I'll probably set aside a few Wippermanns when I'm at the end.

tanguy frame

When I got my bike new it had a 10 sp chain with a connector link. When it was time to replace the chain, I reused the connector link and I could feel it 'click' each time the chain engaged something (not sure if it was chainring, pulley, or cassette). I got rid of the connector link and the click went away. Never used connector link since. So I'm not convinced these links are reuseable.

FBinNY 

Reusable has multiple shades of meaning. Links wear the same as the rest of the chain, so I agree with you that a used link cannot (or should not) be reused with a new chain.

However, since they wear together, you want to keep the same link on a chain. I rotate chains at about 1,000 mile intervals, so I need links that can be reused with the same chain, since I wouldn't want to mix a new link with a used chain.

HillRider

Was it a Wipperman chain? Their Connex link has to be installed in a specific orientation or you will get the exact "click" you describe. Installed properly they are certainly reusable but not indefinitely. As a rule when you install a new chain you use a new link also.

Black wallnut 

Folks unless I have reading comprehension problems the OP question was about chainRINGS not chains. I too would like to know the answer.

FBinNY 

You may be the only one here who doesn't have reading comprehension problems. I read the headline and only scanned the text.

There's no difference in chainrings from about 8s forward (not sure about 11s), but chainring separation gets narrower to match the narrower chains, so they don't jam between the rings on downshifts. The actual tooth width is still the same.

tanguy frame

It was a campy chain with a 'powerlink' connector.

tanguy frame

Can you explain your chain rotation scheme again? How much additional chain/cassette life do you get over just running chains to end of life over cassettes and replacing cassettes when they skip?

FBinNY 

I run multiple chains for each bike, rotating them when it's time to re-oil (or 800-1,000 miles on the road and commuter bikes). The advantages are

1- that I can clean and oil off bike which is always more effective
2- I'm never under the gun about having to re-oil since there's always a ready chain on deck ready to install
3- the chains tend to run smoother because they're better matched to the wear condition of the sprockets
4- I'm not limited to the 1/16"/12" guideline since I'll never put a new chain onto the cassette. Typically I'll be able to run to almost 3/16"/12" before it becomes unworkable.

The biggest benefit of the whole deal is not being limited to the 1/16" guideline, so when I compare to the sequential method (asuming all else is equal) I get all those bonus miles after the last chain reaches the guideline.

Almost everyone I know who has adopted this approach reports longer cassette life, whether they rotate 2, 3 or 4 chains, plus the other benefits. However to be most effective, it calls for reusable connectors, so the connectors and chains can be kept in married sets.

FWIW- the only cassettes or freewheels I've ever replaced due to skipping are one on my old road bike which I retired after 50,000 miles, and one on my commuter which is now at something over 20k miles.

tanguy frame

I could try that.
When do you toss chains and replace with new?
Which connector link do you use with campy 10 speed chains?
When do you replace cassettes?

FBinNY 

Never toss chains, or cassette until they just won't go anymore. That's the point of the system, sometimes the chainrings will also be toast, but sometimes not.

As I said, I don't use campy chains, still running my 10s Chorus with a set of old sram 89r chains. When that's done, I'll see what my options are. However others say that KMC makes a campy specific connector. Or the QWipperman which is a nice system. I'm using Wippermann 9s chains on my 7s commuter and doing well with them.

tanguy frame

Sorry - we've totally derailed the original thread.

Let me get this straight: I typically clean and lube my chain every week or 2, depending on conditions. Are you suggesting that when I put on my next new cassette, I designate 3 new chains with connector links, and rotate them every time I normally clean and lube the chain? And that if I do this, I can expect unlimited life of both chain and cassette, until catastrophic failure of one or another drive train component?

FBinNY 

Not unlimited, eventually all the chains and the sprockets will be worn to the point that they skip under load. IME this is usually well beyond the 1/8" over 12" wear or stretch point, so comparing to replacing at the 1/16"/12 point, you're looking at double the total life of the system or better.

Depeneing on the relative cost of chains and cassettes, this can be the most economical approach. BTW-0 while most people diligently replace chains at 1/6"/12" to try to save cassettes, many do not see the benefit and end up replacing the cassette after the second chain. IME the 2nd most economical approach if cassettes are inexpensive compared to chains, is to simply use the original drivetrain until it's toast.

So there are three approaches to maximizing the miles per drivetrain dollar.
1- replace chains early to save the cassette
2- leave the drivetrain alone and ride until it quits
3- rotate multiple chains, and ride the set until it quits.

The best answer partly depends on the relative cost of the chains and cassettes and how much you actually ride. However there's no clear winner, with devotees of all three methods. My experience is that the rotate method yields the best results, but I have friends that do very well with No.2, using a single chain and cassette until it dies.

Chainring wear also factors here, and riders in clean conditions (road) will get better chairing life limiting the total stretch they allow closer to the traditional limit than those of us who run well beyond that.

tanguy frame

In my case, cassettes cost $75-$100 ,and chains run $40-$60. I'm not too sensitive to cost, I have a budget for consumables like drive trains, cables, and tires. I do appreciate the smooth feel of new stuff, but I have no desire to throw away expensive stuff, and I don't like to store $100 bills in my garage either. Especially, I hate the feel of a deteriorated drive train, and when I can't adjust or lube the noise or roughness out of the drive train, I replace the chain and wonder why I didn't replace it earlier.

So since I'm optimizing feel but I'm actually cheap, does the chain rotation method offer any benefit of longer life with good smooth operation? I guess I could experiment…. I only ride 3000-4000 miles per year, so results could be a long time coming.

bradtx

Always worth it to first try what you have with a 10S chain and if the chain doesn't fall between the chain rings, it's good.

Brad

edotomato

Thank you! Exactly the information I was looking for.

gsa103

It really depends on your time horizon. At that mileage you'd probably replace the chain annually? So to really see benefits your time horizon is probably years 4-6? Also remember there's the non-zero cost of having to buy and store multiple chains (yes I realize this is small, I include it because if applied to enough items you hit storage space limits).