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-   -   New bike - headset spacers not flush with top race (http://www.bikeforums.net/bicycle-mechanics/935934-new-bike-headset-spacers-not-flush-top-race.html)

owenfinn 02-27-14 07:21 AM

New bike - headset spacers not flush with top race
 
1 Attachment(s)
The spacers should sit flush on top of the race, right?

Is it the compression ring that is showing and preventing this?

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=366273

rpenmanparker 02-27-14 07:37 AM

Some spacers have a groove or slot feature on one side and a circumferential tab on the other side so they will stack securely together. If you have the tab pointing down at the bottom of the stack with no groove to receive it in the race, the spacers will "sit up" above the race. If that is what is going on, you need one spacer with a flush bottom to get it flush to the race.

hueyhoolihan 02-27-14 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by owenfinn (Post 16531566)
The spacers should sit flush on top of the race, right?

Is it the compression ring that is showing and preventing this?

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=366273

yes i wouldn't be surprised. but it might not the the compression rings fault. :)

WRT previous post, logos look right side up, but maybe they are on the other side too where they are upside down, IDK. maybe you could try flipping one over, just to see how it goes.

or maybe they just need a larger inside diameter. i doubt steerer tube spacer IDs are an ISO standard.

it seems to be a common problem. at the top and the bottom.

just thinking about it, i've got three threadless headsets, one Neco that has a compression ring and two Richey Logic ones without compression rings. with the Richey ones any spacers, or in my case the stem itself rides right on the ornamental dust cap. underneath the dust cap is a split wide plastic ring that, i guess, is designed to ride on the inner race and avoid touching the outer race. i never really looked at it closely. the Neco has what i have always considered the compression ring. not to be confused with a compression plug, of course. but inevitably is. :)

HillRider 02-27-14 11:29 AM

I'm just guessing but is there any chance that the two pressed in cups are reversed, that is the lower cup was installed on top?

Number400 02-27-14 11:54 AM

^ That would be a real pisser!

Ray Dockrey 02-27-14 12:26 PM

Are you sure that just isn't a washer for the spacers to sit against? I know I have seen on some headsets that a washer goes first for the headset spacers to sit against.

owenfinn 02-27-14 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ray Dockrey (Post 16532455)
Are you sure that just isn't a washer for the spacers to sit against? I know I have seen on some headsets that a washer goes first for the headset spacers to sit against.

Not a washer and there`s nothing special about the spacers (no slot or anything). I`ll bring it over the shop later today and see what they say - though I expect it won`t be much more than the usual confused teeth sucking sound so common in these parts.

hueyhoolihan 02-27-14 06:27 PM

it would be nice to know what kind of headset it is... could be as simple as missing a piece.

owenfinn 02-27-14 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hueyhoolihan (Post 16533527)
it would be nice to know what kind of headset it is... could be as simple as missing a piece.

The bike is a 2014 Marin Muirwoods - FSA headset.

http://www.marinbikes.com/us/bikes/d...muirwoods#spec

owenfinn 02-27-14 07:22 PM

Another shot - without spacers.

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3726/1...2b1d9a79_b.jpg

rpenmanparker 02-27-14 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by owenfinn (Post 16533671)

Why is there no top cap/ bearing cover? That would place the spacers higher above the compression ring.

owenfinn 02-27-14 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rpenmanparker (Post 16533704)
Why is there no top cap/ bearing cover? That would place the spacers higher above the compression ring.

That must be it. Can`t see how the shop could have neglected this. Will bring it in later today.

Thanks!

rpenmanparker 02-27-14 08:20 PM

Some headsets don't come with the bearing cover, but I can't figure out how they work. I have never actually installed a headset without the cover, but I did have one like that sent to me with a frame I bought. When I told the seller the head set was incomplete, he apologized and sent me another one just like the first one. No cover. I threw them away and bought a complete one. I don't get it.

HillRider 02-27-14 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rpenmanparker (Post 16533813)
Some headsets don't come with the bearing cover, but I can't figure out how they work. I have never actually installed a headset without the cover, but I did have one like that sent to me with a frame I bought. When I told the seller the head set was incomplete, he apologized and sent me another one just like the first one. No cover. I threw them away and bought a complete one. I don't get it.

I've never seen one that didn't. I have two FSA headsets on two bikes and have used a couple of others in the past and they all had a top cover over the upper bearing that pressed on the compression ring. I agree the shop just plain neglected to install it.

owenfinn 02-27-14 11:55 PM

So, after all that, rpenmanparker is right. According to the shop this headset doesn`t come with, nor does it need a bearing cover. This was confirmed by someone at Marin Japan. Looks a bit sloppy I guess but I can live with it.

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3808/1...2fe22a9e_b.jpg

rpenmanparker 02-28-14 06:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by owenfinn (Post 16534295)
So, after all that, rpenmanparker is right. According to the shop this headset doesn`t come with, nor does it need a bearing cover. This was confirmed by someone at Marin Japan. Looks a bit sloppy I guess but I can live with it.

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3808/1...2fe22a9e_b.jpg

I wonder how well the head set is sealed against grime and water. The bearing cover usually has a rubber seal ring as part of it.

HillRider 02-28-14 08:10 AM

Some one mislead you. Your shop did it wrong and Marin in Japan must not have understood the question. All FSA headsets have a top cover and your headset is going to die a fast death the first time you get caught in the rain. Keep at them to make it right.

IthaDan 02-28-14 08:48 AM

I can't see the image in post #10, but just how new is the bike? Sometimes it takes a couple hundred miles for the compression wedge to fully seat.

That said, keep an eye on your headset tension (more of an up down play anymore with cartridge bearings, bounce the front end for an easy test) and have a 5mm key ready.

rpenmanparker 02-28-14 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HillRider (Post 16534769)
Some one mislead you. Your shop did it wrong and Marin in Japan must not have understood the question. All FSA headsets have a top cover and your headset is going to die a fast death the first time you get caught in the rain. Keep at them to make it right.

The good news is that the top covers can be bought separately in various heights for folks that want a slammed look. OP appears to have plenty of spacers so some can be removed to make room for the cover. Whether FSA or aftermarket brand, no matter, but I would definitely add a cover to that head set.

HillRider 02-28-14 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IthaDan (Post 16534898)
Sometimes it takes a couple hundred miles for the compression wedge to fully seat.

Maybe so but the compression wedge should NEVER be visible when the headset is properly assembled. Plain and simple, there is a part missing.

IthaDan 02-28-14 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HillRider (Post 16535566)
Maybe so but the compression wedge should NEVER be visible when the headset is properly assembled. Plain and simple, there is a part missing.

Fwiw, this is the image I couldn't see on my ipad. I agree, something's up here. There wasn't a lot to go on from the other two pics.

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3726/1...d72b1d9a79.jpg

E: check this out: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FSA-TH-888...-/140994521819

owenfinn 02-28-14 10:40 PM

IthaDan - thanks for posting that Ebay link. That`s definitely the model headset - it doesn`t seem to come with a top cover. In the shop, I took a look at some of the other Muirwoods on the floor and they were all set up the same way with the compression ring showing and no cover. I looked at some other model bikes with FSA headsets and they all had covers.

There must be some reason for this, right?

I tried to ask the staff, with my poor Japanese - I was only able to make out something about the steering being better? in some way without it.

Next, I suppose I will bring it to another LBS and see what they say. Hopefully, they will have a top-cap that`ll work. Still, I would like to know if this is a Marin screw-up.

hueyhoolihan 02-28-14 11:53 PM

it's possible, with regard to the explanation as to why no dust cover, that the dust cover supplied, if it in fact was supplied, was binding when assembled and they (the LBS) just left it off. could be that the headsets that came with the bike to the dealer unassembled, were packaged wrong at the factory, maybe with the wrong dust cover or maybe no dust cover at all. stranger things have happened.


btw, the FSA headset in the link supplied by IthaDan has a plastic compression ring that is different from the pics the OP has shown. neither has a dustcap, but the one from the Ebay pic looks more finished with the plastic compression ring. FWIW. which is about bupkiss.

rpenmanparker 03-01-14 07:42 AM

I really believe we are overthinking this. Believe it or not (and approve or not) apparently there are some threadless headsets meant to be installed without a top bearing cover. I don't get it and don't want it, but it seems to be true. OP needs to find a cover that fits or replace the whole headset, an inexpensive and simple job. A lost cover is not going to magically appear, because it does not exist.

fietsbob 03-01-14 04:41 PM

Quote:

The spacers should sit flush on top of the race, right?
no, they just fill in the space Your aesthetics may be happier if you paint the silver one , black .
then put it back together ./

Quote:

I wonder how well the head set is sealed against grime and water. The bearing cover usually has a rubber seal ring as part of it.
pull the fork and slide a section of innertube over the lower race then put the fork back in ..

a sealed bearing race for almost free..


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