RubeRad

Hey all,

I've had an Origin8 fork-mounted brake hanger for a few months, and it has been doing its job (getting rid of brake shudder) great, and at first I really liked the larger knob for quick-adjustment, but yesterday I had to loosen all the way to take off the wheel for car transport, and when I put the wheel back on, I found that the whole screw-adjust system was jammed for I don't know what reason. I forced it with vise-grips, and I think now it's totally hosed, I think the plastic threads inside the adjustment knob are stripped (found strips of plastic inside the metal threads of the threaded inner cylinder) and I think the tabbed insert that's supposed to "hold" the flat edge of that metal cylinder got some plastic scraped away so it doesn't securely hold that flat edge and it rotates in there and gets stuck.

So has anybody experienced this problem before and is there any way I'm not seeing to fix it? Just hoping against hope there, I'm expecting to have to buy a new one.

Looking at fleabay, there seems to be two options for fork-mount hangers: origin8 and tektro. But they look identical to me; in particular the adjustment knob/parts look identical. Is Tektro any better to be worth paying like double the price? Or is it possible to just buy replacement inner parts?

dsbrantjr

I would not be surprised to find both brands are made in the same factory and stamped/painted for their respective customers.

I would suggest using a product like Tef-Gel on the adjustment mechanism of the replacement unit to avoid seizing in the future. Or you could just live without your adjuster.

RubeRad

Living without the adjuster would mean letting the cable out every time I have to take the wheel off, and then get it back on at proper tension. I guess that's a better short-term measure than what I am currently doing, which is to pull the inside thing up and rotate the tab up out of its slot so it rides higher and keeps the brakes tighter. But plastic is not going to last like that forever...

RubeRad

doi, checking my ebay purchase history, it looks like actually the one I have is Tektro, pics of the origin8 one don't have an adjuster at all. Maybe I can repurpose the adjuster from my old headset-mount hanger.

Kopsis

For removing a wheel, you should be able to pop the straddle cable off the cantilever arm without changing the housing length adjustment (unless you're one of those folks that insists on having no free play at all in the brake levers before the pads touch the rim).

RubeRad

Yes I am one of those folks.

I've got 700x50 tires on my crosscheck, and the straddle bracket rides about 2mm above the rubber. My understanding is for wide cantis (like the the tektro 720s) the lower the straddle height the better.

And the wheel is true, so why not set the brakes close enough to do do some good?

Bezalel

Origin8 is a brand of J&B Importers. Just about everything from this brand is made by someone else. That being said I'm not seeing any identical hangers from Origin8 and Tektro. Which hanger do you have?

xenologer

get brake levers with quick releases, quit messing with barrel adjusters for wheel removal
Amazon.com : Cane Creek Flat-Top Levers for Road & Canti Brakes, 22.2mm Clamp Diameter : Bike Brake Levers : Sports & Outdoors

or replace stripped adjuster with one made of steel instead of plastic n aluminium

but really those are great levers, get them

Kopsis

Wide cantis like 720s are relatively insensitive to straddle height (at least in the range that most bike frames will permit you to use). Having a little clearance between pads and rim doesn't reduce the effectiveness of your brakes in the least. As long as the levers are not bottoming out, you're not losing anything by having enough clearance to release the straddle cable other than the ability to easily remove/install the wheels.

HillRider

If the old adjuster froze, I expect it was due to corrosion. If/when you replace the hanger, be sure to grease or anti-seize treat the adjuster threads.

RubeRad

It was Tektro all along. Origin8 was a mismemory. I have the Tektro one which is all over eBay for about $15.

RubeRad

I like that idea; but it's a little spendy and my bars are already kind of crowded. I'll put that in the idea bank.

RubeRad

They're plastic, and only a few months old. I don't think it was corrosion. I think it was bottoming out and running threads onto unthreaded material.

RubeRad

OK so researching a little, it looks like the above-recommended Cane Creek Flat Top is a full brake lever, which I can't use, because I've got drops and I'm not ditching my Retroshift levers. I thought it was an interrupter, which I could use anyways. I'm trying to find info about the Cane Creek Crosstop interruptors. This eBay ad says the CrossTop also has a QR button, but I can't find any further evidence that that is true, and I've found numerous instances where websites switch product descriptions of FlatTop and CrossTop.

Anybody know for sure? If the CrossTops have a QR button (does that even make sense mechanically for interrupter levers?) then I'll be getting a pair.

xenologer

looking at it, there's clearly no QR release on the cross levers, ebay listing is wrong

oh, you have drops? yeah, FlatTop is a mtb lever, assumed cantilever implied mtb

well, is not a QR button pretty standard on most road levers?
or does the retroshift interfere? looking at retroshift photos the QR button is visible ....

LesterOfPuppets

+1.

For me, leaving pads 3 mm or so off the rim is often the sweet spot for many cantis. Nice modulation and whatnot.

LesterOfPuppets

Hey, lookie there! I wonder if they let enough slack in the line to clear 2" tires.

This is an interesting situation the OP's in here.

I think barrel adjuster as cable release would just plain suck if front wheel is removed often, no matter how good the barrel adjuster is. I'd likely just rather just keep a floor pump in the car and deflate the tire everytime.

RubeRad

QR buttons on road levers? On MY levers? That's news to me, and fantastic news at that! With that hint, I can probably figure it out if I look closely, but there are two pins of different diameters, which is the QR?

RubeRad

Quote:

Hey, lookie there! I wonder if they let enough slack in the line to clear 2" tires.

Doesn't have to be that much; the real question is whether they let in enough slack to detach the straddle cable. Then the brakes flip all the way out, and I have to squeeze the fat rubber past the pads anyways.

I can tell you the standard metal barrel adjuster when I was originally using a headset hanger, totally sucked. The wider diameter knob of the fork-mounted hanger is WAY better -- or was, until it stopped working.

Wilfred Laurier

you probably cross threaded the adjuster
when trying to thread it back in

however
as Kopsis said
you are mistaken about the lower-straddle-cable=better
this is true for low profile cantis
not for high profile cantis

you need to be able to take your wheel out without unscrewing the barrel adjuster
the barrel adjuster is to take up pad wear and cable housing compression
it is not meant to be used as a quick release

RubeRad

Yes I probably did cross-thread.

As for my super-low straddle cable (yoke riding maybe 2mm above the rubber), I took my strategy from SB:

that's how my brakes feel. I do have to squeeze quite hard, and still the result is more a slowening than a braking. I don't think I could do an endo if I wanted to. (in contrast to the tiagra calipers on my road bike; those things will lock up a wheel in a heartbeat!) Even with my cable as low as possible, I still feel that my brakes are like that description. So on (my understanding of) SB's advice, I have been keeping the yoke as low as possible. But I'm willing to be educated.

SB also saith:

I decided it was not a worthwhile trade-off, which explains why I am relying on my barrel adjuster to remove the wheel.

FYI I have Tektro CR720s with Kool-Stop pads.

Wilfred Laurier

since you have tried a low straddle cable
and it neither gives you acceptable braking
nor allows you to remove the wheel
why not try a higher straddle cable


from the same page you linked:

'...A larger contribution to the mechanical advantage of a well-adjusted cantilever brake, especially a low-profile one, comes from the transverse cable. The mechanical advantage is strictly determined by the "yoke angle "...'


you do not have low profile cantis
so lowering the straddle cable will not give the same effect
it is likely even to give less braking than a slightly higher straddle cable

RubeRad

Because higher yoke = less mechanical advantage, and less mechanical advantage will make my braking even less acceptable.

Correct I do not have low profile. So I could buy the argument that raising my yoke will not make things very much worse (will not decrease mechanical advantage very much)...

...but on what basis are you speculating that raising the yoke will have an effect in the opposite, beneficial direction, rather than merely a diminished effect in a negative direction?

For now I will stick with low yoke, pads running as close as possible to true rims, and see what I can achieve with the newfound QR in my brake levers!

Kopsis

As I mentioned before, 720s are virtually unaffected by straddle height. I've done the math and I've verified on my CX bike which runs 720s on the front. I like 720s because they provide great modulation, but if you want serious power out of them, you need to be prepared to put a death grip on your brake lever.

You're actually handicapping yourself by reducing pad/rim clearance because that's causing the brake lever to "bottom out" early in its travel where your grip strength is weakest. Open the pads up a bit and not only will you be able to get the straddle off, you'll also find they engage with the brake lever closer to the bar where your grip is much stronger and will generate more power.

Bottom line is don't expect wide-profile cantis to ever behave like dual-pivot road calipers because it's not going to happen. If you care more about power than modulation, either switch to narrow-profile cantis with a low straddle or ditch cantis entirely for a set of mini-Vs.

RubeRad

OK I hear that, it makes sense, and resonates with my experience of the 720s. Since I have to take out my cable again to replace the mcguyvered plastic barrel adjuster with metal, I'll give a try to a higher yoke and further pads, see how it feels in the grip.

Question about mini-V's, I did just a quick search and it seems the only thing "mini" about them is their size -- they still require long-pull levers, correct?