apg

Just put these 515s I bought at a swap meet for $20. I tightened tension a bit but my cleats (new) are popping out when i brake really hard (I'm on a track bike). Any ideas-have these been too worn for my type of use?

GravelMN

I suggest backing the tension all the way off and giving the pedals a good cleaning and lubricating. Back out all of your screws one at a time, clean and add a drop of Lock Tite blue or the equivalent to each and retighten making sure they seat flush. With the bike in a stand and a shoe in your hand, make sure the cleats seat properly. If all looks good, do some test rides tightening the retention by about a turn each time until you get close to the correct release for you, then go about a half turn at a time and finally tweek it until it is perfect. I've seen some very worn pedals that still worked well.

If you are using multi-release cleats, make sure that you aren't twisting your ankle inward or outward.

FBinNY 

That type of cleat is highly unsuited for track (fixed wheel) use. It's not reliable enough for the shock loads of reverse torque. Also there's a tendency to drop one's heel causing back pressure on the pedal/cleat interface when stopping. Since the spring is in back, and the pedal is designed for toe down forward loading, back pressure can cause disengagement.

I still prefer the classic road pedal cleat designs (ie. Look) which I find much more reliable for road use, but still use clips and straps for track use (including street fixed).

Also, note that cleats and the latches on pedals wear, so you might do OK replacing the cleat with new and setting the latch hard. I wouldn't ride that way, but you'll have to decide for yourself.

apg

So, you think even if I got some egg beaters or something better than these pedals, I'm going to run into the same problem?

all the same, I'll give cleaning them out a try. Can see why not.

Homebrew01

FB wasn't referring to "better" or "worse". He was talking about design for use on fixed gear and gave a recommendation.

qclabrat

i use eggbeaters exclusively for mtb due to the quick release, wouldn't expect them to work much better for skidding

Andrew R Stewart 

I'll be the bad guy and say that riding fixed with out brakes is both illegal (in most states to my knowledge) and not too safe. It still makes me wonder why people think that the equipment designed for a controlled event (track racing) is appropriate for street riding with out additional capacities, like brakes. Andy.

Homebrew01

I just assumed anyone riding on the road would at least have a front brake.

apg

Why are so many of the people on here so ****ing grumpy all the time? Do you guys just sit about trolling bike forums threads and give worthless advice or gain satisfaction from correcting people's spelling and/or english interpretation ? If you've you've got useful advice on this pedal question, thanks. If not, **** off.

LastKraftWagen

Ironically, in California (at least when I lived there) fixies without brakes were more legal than my tandem, the standard for braking and bike safety being "able to lock up the rear wheel..." which I could never get my tandems to do two up. Not disagreeing with your comment, it just brought this to mind.

FBinNY 

Cleat reliability is much more critical on a fixed wheel bike than with a freewheel. Even if you have a front brake, losing a pedal on a fixed wheel can lead to serious complications or injury. Keep in mind that the cranks will keep turning until the bike stops. That means it's almost impossible to pick the pedal back up at any decent speed, and you'll have a crank whipping around looking for a calf or ankle to club.

Even though clipless is now legal on the track, track riders are selective about the pedals they use, and rarely (if ever) have any need for reverse toque braking except at very low speed.

This isn't to say that clipless on a street fixed bike is unsafe, just a reminder to make sure the engagement is reliable and predictable. Also keep in mind that setting the spring high enough to prevent accidental disengagement, can lead to difficulty if you have to unclip at a corner or after an emergency stop.

Andrew R Stewart 

I'll make a couple of comments then just read the responses, maybe I'll learn something.

A number of communities have had court decisions that ruled fixed gear bikes are not street legal in that a separate brake mechanism did not exist. When I was young and into mini bikes it was common knowledge that a engine mounted clutch which also had a band brake on it wasn't a smart brake system as both stressed the chain. Having redundant cable brakes (or hydraulic) lends a layer of security. Autos long ago adopted separate brake systems as a safety measure.

The hub of a track bike is designed around the *********** needed during track racing events. If you come to a complete stop you've pretty much lost the event. So the strength and repeatability of the fixed cog and lock ring are dependent on frequent servicing and inspection (track riders change their gearing with events and rider conditioning). The skid stop in racing is a mark of not paying attention, novice riders or a massive disruption of the event. But in the street use of the same hub and cog system these stops are FAR more frequent and often block to block of travel. In one daily commute the number of shocks to the system and exceed the number that a week of track racing incidents would have. Yet, if my shop experience is an indicator, the maintenance of the street fixie is FAR less then that of the track used bike. I have seen many fixed cogs coming loose on their threads, lock ring not with standing. I have seen these hub threads, both cog and lock ring, damaged and stripped so that the cog would no longer control the hub.

The prevalent of low cost manufacturing in the current fixie world causes further concern for those of us who pick up the pieces after things go wrong. Hub materials get softer, threading gets less precise and practices get sloppier.

All of this is independent of the pedal/shoe connection. Spring loaded shoe retention is meant to release at a loading that is below that of body injury (if you doubt this just turn to the ski business and look at binding/boot standards and case law). That this release threshold might be below that of a panic (what else might a skid be called) stop is reasonable in my experience. After all the mountain bikes that the SPD pedals were designed o be used with have had dual hand brakes for decades. Andy.

apg

Great explanation. Thank you all so much. I'm going back to clips and double toe straps.

Looigi

I don't know if it's already been mentioned, but there are two types of SPD cleats: Single release and multi release (SH-51 and SH-56 for the Shimano parts). Single release are intended to come out only with the usual twisting motion. Multi release will come out in any direction with enough force.

jyl

And why are some fixie riders so foul mouthed?

andr0id

I've raced track (Frisco and Alkek) and couldn't agree more. If I were to ever ride fixed gear on the street, I'd have a front and rear brake.

For mass start events, I've done fine with Dura Ace SPD-SL with the tension all the way up and fairly new cleats and never had a problem coming out of the pedals. The hard core riders will use SPD-SL and modify the pedal to add a toe clip and strap on top of that for sprint events.

Here's an example of how it's done.
Fitting straps to SPD-SL pedals




Cause they're grumpy because they don't have enough money to buy another pack of smokes.

gl98115

Who's grumpy?

Wilfred Laurier

not just fixie folk
here is a gem from andy
we can only guess

Andrew R Stewart 

I am still surprised at the auto censor that this forum is filtered through. Who would have thought that "re-qu-ire-men-ts" was a nasty (and I see if this way of writing sneaks past).

In a more serious vein (four letter work for path, starts with V ends with N). The reason I sometimes think that fixie riders are grumpy is because it's a defensive mechanism. Sometimes this is a self fulfilling prophesy given some of their riding behavior. Andy.

FBinNY 

Did you really say requirements? c'mon fess up.

Andrew R Stewart 

I don't copy my posts to a storage before sending off but that's my memory. For all I know I miss spelled it. Andy.

Wilfred Laurier

probably censored
'cause 'requirements needed'
sounds too redundant

Andrew R Stewart 

So the auto censor is also a grammar check? Andy.

Scooby Snax

Not as far as any of my posts are concerned.

Wilfred Laurier

I don't believe for one second that was the word you were using! The only bad word I could dream up with the right number of letters is C**ks****r, although I don't know how many c**ks****rs are needed during a track race... or how their presence could affect hub design.