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  1. #1
    Senior Member owenmyers's Avatar
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    1965 Frejus unkown

    I bought this bike for $125 because it had some campy on it. After some research i found similarities in serial numbers and lugs of most Frejus bicycles. Im not sure what the year is but i think it's a 65'. Im also having a vary hard time trying to identify the model with no visible decals. The bike has oilers in the front tube and BB.I read that Frejus models with oilers can go for up to $1,200 but the condition of mine is too rough. I would also like to know if it has the original paintjob, thank you.

    Last edited by owenmyers; 08-17-11 at 05:24 PM.

  2. #2
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    125 was pretty fair, at that point the only thing really worth anything is the components....which i'd say you paid for.... frame is worth next to nothing in that condition.

  3. #3
    Senior Member owenmyers's Avatar
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    What do you think about restoring it, is it even worth my time?

  4. #4
    Since 1938... JunkYardBike's Avatar
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    Have you inspected the top and downtube for crash damage? That fork isn't original, which is already a red flag.

    I wouldn't say the frame is worth nothing. You're right that the oiler ports make it more desirable. It's not scrap. I'm sure you could find someone who would make an attempt to restore it, or at least clean it up and ride it. If it's your size, I think it would make a great project.

  5. #5
    Senior Member owenmyers's Avatar
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    Restoring this is close to impossible without knowing the exact model and not having a headbadge. What other companies used the oiler ports and is it that the original paint?

  6. #6
    iab
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    It could be either a Professional or a Torino. Both had the oil ports.

    Headbadges come up on ebay pretty often.

    The paint is most definatly not original. I'd want to look under it to see if it is hiding any damage.

    What is the serial number? It will be on the non-driveside seat tube just below the seat cluster.

    I think it is worth restoring but that is only one person's opinion.

  7. #7
    Senior Member owenmyers's Avatar
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    I started to sand the paint and found only one minor dent, but the frame looks like it was copper plated. I agree with you that is most likely the Frejus professional and thank you for your positive opinion. This will be my first full restoration project. 94188 and MC R 56. 56 being the frames height?

  8. #8
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    It seems plausible that it's a Frejus. The vertical slot with rounded ends in the seat tube lug is fairly indicative as is the oiler/grease port on the head tube. I had a mid 1950's Frejus track bike (since stolen) and the over all visuals and feel matches up to me. Check out the examples at http://www.classicrendezvous.com/ and see what else does or doesn't match up. You could also check the BB threads to see if they are Italian as a cross check. Regarding the head badge, many of the later Frejus had decals rather than head badges. Assuming it's in your size I think it would be worth putting in riding shape as a riding bike not necessarily as a concourse bike.

  9. #9
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    Also, you appear to have the earlier 151 mm diameter bolt circle on your crank set (minimum 44 tooth chain ring). Distance from inner edge of chainwheel bolt is about 6 mm for the 151 mm bolt circle and about 2 mm for the later 144 mm bolt circle (minimum 42 tooth chain ring). That would date the crankset, and thus maybe your bike to pre 1969. See Campagnolo catalogs #15 (1967) versus # 16 (1969) at http://www.classicrendezvous.com/. The same sort of detective work can be done to the front derailleur (holes in cage) and shift levers (cable cover stops).

  10. #10
    Senior Member owenmyers's Avatar
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    It has a campy BB so im guessing italian. There is remains from where the badge use to be so i am sure it's pre 1969. But it is hard to understand why there is new paint underneath where the badge would have been. Im not sure everything is original on this bike either, the FD looks a little newer, Mavic MA40, Suntour superb pro etc. and as i can see the fork has shimano dropouts too. Im thinking the model is the torino now.

  11. #11
    iab
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    I think the cranks are original. Maybe the BB, headset and shift levers. The rest is not original to the bike. Neither is the fork.

    The serial number puts it in the early 60s. Although I wrote "Torino" is a model, i think it is actually more of a generic recognition of the word Torino on the headbadge. With the date, the oiler and I believe the MC may be a marking for Columbus tubing, I think it is a Professional. The only other models offered then were the TdF and the F4, both of which I think had Falck tubing and no oiler.

    And yes, the 56 is the seat tube, usually center to center.

    To restore and make period correct you will need:
    Campagnolo Record FD
    Campagnolo Record RD
    Ambrosio stem and bars
    Universal 61 calipers and levers
    Ambrosio or Fiamme tubular rims with Campagnolo high flange hubs
    Campagnolo seat post
    Brooks B17

    You can buy an early 60s Frejus catalog from velo-retro.com

  12. #12
    car guy, recovering aixaix's Avatar
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    Looks like a Frejus pro to me. The head badge would almost certainly have holes arranged vertically 2" apart. Both the pro & TdF frames used Reynolds tubing (as well as Columbus and others).
    Michael Shiffer
    EuroMeccanicany.com

  13. #13
    iab
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    Maybe the R is for Reynolds. I know the F on the BB shell of a Frejus I sold a while back was for Falck.

  14. #14
    Senior Member owenmyers's Avatar
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    Can someone tell me why the bike was copper plated, then it was silver plated? I dont know anyone who would paint over such a nice look. Thanks for that list of campy parts i already have the Ambrosio champion bars stamped frejus. Is it reynolds, how can you tell?

    Heres the frame in first stage restoration, see the copper?

    http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h2...810_190903.jpg
    http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h2...810_191032.jpg

  15. #15
    iab
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    When plating steel, copper is put down first. It is used to fill the scratches made when fabricating the frame. Copper is soft and can easily be buffed smooth. Then they put a nickel plating down, then finally chrome.

    As for confirming Reynolds tubing, sometimes there is a stamp directly on the tubing. I think most of the time that stamp is cut off when fabricating the frame.

  16. #16
    Senior Member owenmyers's Avatar
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    So we have come to a conclusion that it was originally chrome. In my research i have only found chrome frejus track bikes not any road bikes. What frejus model was chrome and had gears around 65'?

  17. #17
    car guy, recovering aixaix's Avatar
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    Perhaps the road bikes with chrome half-stays & head lugs were completely copper plated, though not completely chromed? Could also have been chromed after it left the factory...
    Michael Shiffer
    EuroMeccanicany.com

  18. #18
    Senior Member owenmyers's Avatar
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    Many possibilities but i have found a chrome model from the same era.http://cyclart.com/photos/Recent%20w...t%20Frejus.jpg Does anyone know where i could get any frejus headbadge?

  19. #19
    iab
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    Quote Originally Posted by owenmyers View Post
    So we have come to a conclusion that it was originally chrome. In my research i have only found chrome frejus track bikes not any road bikes. What frejus model was chrome and had gears around 65'?
    Just because a bike is entirely chrome, it does not mean it wasn't once also painted. If Frejus wanted the seat lugs and BB chromed, you dip the entire bike. It is easier, faster and cheaper than dipping in 3 or 4 places. Dipping the ends was done only when only the head lugs are chromed and a partial chroming of the rear stays. Below is my Cinelli with dipped ends. A Cinelli SC, while painted, will be entirely chromed underneath.


  20. #20
    Senior Member owenmyers's Avatar
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    I have reached a point where i need the exact year and model of this bike. As of right now my restoration project has stopped until i find the original color. I dont think chroming it will increase the value too much so im just going to powdercoat the frame then buy some decals. I have also discovered i have an old Tange F5 fork that was purchased for the bike as an upgrade, original price tag says two wheel t.a. $66.95 which was quite a bit of money at the time. Anyone know about the Tange 5F fork?
    Last edited by owenmyers; 08-17-11 at 05:24 PM.

  21. #21
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    IAB's bike looks like about one of the best.
    Frejus does a panel paintjob, and my bias is that cast-crown forks are highest end if short-reach brakes fit them, which is contrary to your aim of restoring your nice maybe 531 frame.

  22. #22
    Senior Member owenmyers's Avatar
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    I am not trying to "restore" this bike but i am bulding it to ride. To make it look nice i did buy the decals for it, but once again i was never really sure about the exact model. The tubing is 531 but i dont find a need to struggle to find a frejus fork. For the paint job i am doing all gloss black. The components are all Modolo and Campagnolo right now, but i would like a nice wheelset for it. I just need some money first. Tell me more about the fork, its Tange F5.

  23. #23
    Senior Member spacemanz's Avatar
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    Hi guys, I see that this thread is about a year old, but that's not THAT old, when it's about Frejus. I have a frame & fork, that I bought a couple months ago now, that looks just like the one linked to in post #18, except where that one is maroon (Frejus' team color, I've read), mine is blue, and it has that same "anodized aluminum" sort of look to the paint, which I've read was actually done with varnish. Mine has Campagnolo dropouts and fork ends, so I'm pretty sure it's a Campimissimo, which was a regular Super Corsa, but with the "upgraded" Campy dropouts & fork ends. Now I'm no expert, by a LONG shot, but I keep looking around the web, trying to find more info, and that's how I found this thread. I finally figured out for sure, that my frame is Reynolds 531, by looking at the pics in that link. I have the same fork, with the reinforcements inside, and my seatpost clamp is the same type, NOT the old "traditional" one. FYI, mine was fully chromed, like the one I keep referring to, but my paint was almost fully removed, for some reason. I see now, that it was mostly just stickers anyways, and I still have the seat tube stripes, but my head badge is mostly gone. There's still enough to positively identify it as a Frejus, but it's not really fixable. BTW, my serial # doesn't match anything else in that database, at classicrendesvous, but I did register it there, and they listed it (I'm Cliff). Anyways, I wanted to post to this thread, to bring it back up, so it's easier to find again.

  24. #24
    iab
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    Hi Cliff. For the record, your paint is called cromovelato and typically was only put on top tier models of any manufacturer. And also for the record, Frejus team colors are red and gray, although by the 60s it was more of a champagne and a brick red.

    How about posting some pics?

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