Advertise on Bikeforums.net



User Tag List

Results 1 to 25 of 25
  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    66
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    too bent over damage to internet-sale Colnago?

    I bid on a bottom-of-the-line fixed-gear conversion on a famous server. I reconciled the Cromor tubing with self-assurances it wouldn't whip on descents, although the second thing to shock me about the frame was the ugly dropouts. The seller emphasized it was a Colnago and opened at $250. On unpacking I instantly noticed it was a hit-a-brick-wall frame, which I won't explain further here. Despite the tone here I'd like some objective opinions about whether this bike isn't safer than I thought.
    [revision]
    I'm sorry about my writing, having repeated English comp up to where I need toes to keep count. The following paragraph recounts my resolution with the seller; the resolution process isn't binding, it just spares "the server" having to deal with the dispute. When I initially complained that explicit answers by the seller, whom I call "Norma," about whether the frame was dented and whether it could be reverted to derailleur use were wrong because of it hitting a kerb or a wall, Norma said to send it back on her dime. After I asked Norma if that meant they would pay return shipping I read yes, I get refund and return shipping and then I started to read the "no problem"'s. So I replied that I would repack it, send Norma a tracking number billing Norma for the cost: "No problem." Then Norma complained that they only paid $50 to ship me the bike, not having told me my payment, which was knocked down from $86, included $25 non-bikeshop packing job. I was surprised, -no, angry, because "Brown" was going to charge me $85 to return without guarantee of not having the bike at the bottom of a pile of parcels. So I went to FedEx, and paid $74 to send it back with signature and $277 insurance. Since Norma stuck it to me, i.e. reneged on their promises in resolving the dispute, I used "truthful" to describe the attribute their listing lacked in complaining about how I shopped around for shipping of an item I wouldn't have bid on ("touched") had I known it hit a wall. Norma, having been supplied a tracking number, wouldn't even return what I first paid for shipping, because I overpaid %9 of this deal to freight carrier, apparently worse than not detecting some buckled tubes in a bike frame bought for resale. Norma has since relisted the item without any revision which induces me to be a peckerhead [Re:feedback] purely on the lookout for others. (Since being burnt to a crisp by vintageparts1978 and forfeiting leaving feedback because his frame took so long to arrive, I have simply left no feedback when burnt, if SoMEThing actually arrives.)
    So much for 2nd, (now 3d) paragraph hopefully, although this must be a stale thread. When I refer to "customer service executable," I just mean that "the server" and its funds transfer agent are "processes," running computer programs which are inflexible and only work when the parameters are ideal to the parties and the process both. Hence the sarcasm about Norma's "fear" of the dispute resolution service; it cost me $75 to be enticed by this frame, (because of the chrome, albeit Colnago is most certainly a [mass?] producer where the value is emphatically based in the fabulous paint and graphics, (something I communicated to the seller before knowing I'd been had, forwarding a link to the same model with red paint.)) Buyer protection, my but! The frame I bought from vintageparts1978 took so long to get here that the day of the deadline I filed a case because it hadn't arrived; accordingly same deadline revoked my privelege of leaving feedback. (wouldn't YoU prefer incoherent to verbose?) Anyhow, the frame arrived a few days later, and vintageparts1978 was bird-dogging me because "the server" had confiscated all the money. When I unpacked this item which had filled vintageparts1978's eyes with dollar signs I noticed the fork was a heavy knockoff where the dropouts were ground for a total of 2 seconds to remove the fender eyelets. I thought when looking at the frame that "the server" had not dealt fairly with vintageparts1978 while being po'd about the fork, and negotiated what I thought was a fair payment for a real frame with bogus fork. Forward to my finding out the frame hadn't any prep and bottom bracket threads were trashed by Mavic cartridge BB which is supposed to be installed with chamferring which is a modification but reversible. Instead the frame isn't usable even with modern external bearing BB's, and here I willingly paid higher than market for a production marque of junk, where the finish and chrome must be destroyed if any repair is to be effected. (I took it to LBS's with my tail between my legs to get written assessments that it was (undetectable) junk; the pro shop had to be demonstrated the lack of grip in the threads and wouldn't write down anything.) I can find no contact information for any customer service at Paypal outside the dialogs and buttons accessed with browsers; peripherally to my rant, I do not think that packaging a market in a database and managing the database qualifies a person to rule over millions of people, and the income of the database would warrant maybe more employees or flexibility and fairness in contract enforcement. It's a moot point, but it sort of makes my rant more objective if it's incomprehensible, because the pictures "do the talking;" I just thought I should cut a "lay person" some slack, but now that Norma is relisting without even mentioning my griping, I think more that Norma is "disingenuous." I promise other posts will be more patina and less whine.

    I threw in another $75 to return it, at the second shipper I went to, to save $10; the seller was so fearful of the resolution service they promised those funds and everything I'd sent up front, but that's fallen through because I paid too much to make it go away, according to them (within $2 of what I paid but they added handling.) This just means I now have to click buttons to try get my money back.

    This stuff doesn't photo, but the seller answered the question about dents with a reply that there were no dents, and they got to look up close, haggle, etc. The down tube manifests the incident with the appearance of internal reinforcement of the shifter bosses; whether it's bent is extent in buyer's and seller's eye. Have I got any right here or does this look (to customer service executable) like a bicycle in fine condition, albeit with about 1.25in sq chrome peeled off as well?
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Dovetube; 10-17-11 at 12:20 PM. Reason: Gobblety-gook

  2. #2
    Bianchi Goddess Bianchigirll's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Camp Hill, PA
    My Bikes
    Too many to list here check my signature.
    Posts
    20,039
    Mentioned
    29 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Colnago? where is the paint?
    Bianchis '87 Sport SX, '90 Proto (2), '91 Boarala 'cross, '93 Project 3, '88 Trofeo, '86 Volpe, '89 Axis, '79 Mixte SOLD, '99 Mega Pro XL Ti, '97 Ti Megatube, , '90 something Vento 603,

    Others but still loved,; '80 RIGI, '80 Batavus Professional, '87 Cornelo, '86 Bertoni (sold), '09 Motobecane SS, '98 Hetchins M.O., '09 K2 Mainframe, '89 Trek 2000, '?? Jane Doe (still on the drawing board), '90ish Haro Escape

  3. #3
    Constant tinkerer FastJake's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Madison, Wisconsin
    Posts
    6,122
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Maybe it's just the chrome, but I can't see any dents or bent areas. Maybe I'd just have to see it in person. Is the fork original and straight? Usually the fork is the first thing to bend in a front-end crash. Then the frame can be bent too if the crash is bad enough.

    For your amusement, here is an old Firenze MTB I used in college one year. One day, riding up to class the steel rims were wet and I didn't realize I had no brakes until the front tire slammed (literally) into a brick wall. I rode this bike the rest of the year, then dumped it on craigslist for $25.

    Last edited by FastJake; 10-10-11 at 10:00 PM.
    Why "derailer" is the correct way to spell the gear-change mechanism: sheldonbrown.com/derailer.html

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    363
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I can't even understand your rant.

    KeS

  5. #5
    Senior Member 3373jones's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    My Bikes
    Titan (Columbus SLX) = STOLEN January 2011. 1991 gary fisher proCaliber - currently upgrading - might go cyclocross style? Some other non-mentionable carbonfiber rides...
    Posts
    485
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    seriously. english not your first language?

  6. #6
    Randomhead
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Happy Valley, Pennsylvania
    Posts
    12,500
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I see the dent on the tt, but not on the DT. Not saying there is no dent on the DT, it's just that it's really hard to see

  7. #7
    Bianchi Goddess Bianchigirll's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Camp Hill, PA
    My Bikes
    Too many to list here check my signature.
    Posts
    20,039
    Mentioned
    29 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by unterhausen View Post
    I see the dent on the tt, but not on the DT. Not saying there is no dent on the DT, it's just that it's really hard to see

    I agree I see something on the TT but I think the angle of the pics is off just enough to make it hard to really tell what is happening.



    Bianchis '87 Sport SX, '90 Proto (2), '91 Boarala 'cross, '93 Project 3, '88 Trofeo, '86 Volpe, '89 Axis, '79 Mixte SOLD, '99 Mega Pro XL Ti, '97 Ti Megatube, , '90 something Vento 603,

    Others but still loved,; '80 RIGI, '80 Batavus Professional, '87 Cornelo, '86 Bertoni (sold), '09 Motobecane SS, '98 Hetchins M.O., '09 K2 Mainframe, '89 Trek 2000, '?? Jane Doe (still on the drawing board), '90ish Haro Escape

  8. #8
    Senior Member jet sanchEz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    7,421
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I'd say it definitely has been hit and that you should get your money back, if possible.

  9. #9
    Bianchi Goddess Bianchigirll's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Camp Hill, PA
    My Bikes
    Too many to list here check my signature.
    Posts
    20,039
    Mentioned
    29 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by FastJake View Post
    Maybe it's just the chrome, but I can't see any dents or bent areas. Maybe I'd just have to see it in person. Is the fork original and straight? Usually the fork is the first thing to bend in a front-end crash. Then the frame can be bent too if the crash is bad enough.

    For your amusement, here is an old Firenze MTB I used in college one year. One day, riding up to class the steel rims were wet and I didn't realize I had no brakes until the front tire slammed (literally) into a brick wall. I rode this bike the rest of the year, then dumped it on craigslist for $25.

    $25???? in that shape? just slide the seat back and it looks like a $150 bike easy
    Bianchis '87 Sport SX, '90 Proto (2), '91 Boarala 'cross, '93 Project 3, '88 Trofeo, '86 Volpe, '89 Axis, '79 Mixte SOLD, '99 Mega Pro XL Ti, '97 Ti Megatube, , '90 something Vento 603,

    Others but still loved,; '80 RIGI, '80 Batavus Professional, '87 Cornelo, '86 Bertoni (sold), '09 Motobecane SS, '98 Hetchins M.O., '09 K2 Mainframe, '89 Trek 2000, '?? Jane Doe (still on the drawing board), '90ish Haro Escape

  10. #10
    slow as I ever was Ex Pres's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    an imposter living in the 35223
    Posts
    5,652
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Crashed

    I agree with your assessment. Bike was misrepresented. Fork's not OE for that reason as well.

    But I have no idea what you're trying to convey in that second paragraph. Edit: couldn't read the revision
    Last edited by Ex Pres; 11-11-11 at 02:48 PM.
    72 special CNC ___________ 72 Frejus (ala Legnano) __73 Holdsworth Record
    78 Raleigh Professional_____ 80 Ranson_____________ 80 unknown French (SS)
    82 Peugeot PXN10_________83 Trek 620 (nee 600)____ 85 Gianni Motta
    85 Trek 560______________88 Guerciotti GLX
    90 Miele Gara_____________02 Casati Dardo (g/blue)__02 Casati Dardo (y/blk)
    03 Casati Dardo___________08 BF IRO (fixed)________10 Vassago Fisticuff (IGH)

  11. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,402
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I'm happy I'm not the only one who found this post incomprehensible..... What is "customer service executable?"

  12. #12
    incazzare. lostarchitect's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Brooklyn, NY
    My Bikes
    See sig
    Posts
    4,164
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I can't understand your post, either. Take a deep breath and write it again.
    1964 JRJ (Bob Jackson) San Remo Plus, 1989 Trek 520, 2000ish Colian (Colin Laing), 2013 Velo Orange Pass Hunter

  13. #13
    DRF aka Thrifty Bill wrk101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    The NC Mountains
    My Bikes
    Too many to list, all vintage
    Posts
    19,369
    Mentioned
    54 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by shelbyfv View Post
    I'm happy I'm not the only one who found this post incomprehensible..... What is "customer service executable?"
    +10 Add me to that list. Kudos to anyone who understood it.

    Assuming it was bought on ebay (is famous server code for ebay?), you need to file a claim on it immediately as being misrepresented and damaged. Top tube is bent.

    I would go ahead with the click buttons and get your money back.
    Last edited by wrk101; 10-11-11 at 09:14 PM.

  14. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    8,289
    Mentioned
    11 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    The second paragraph has me stumped, but nevertheless the top tube while not dented to be lawyerly is stressed showing an undulation of the surface. It should be straight and fair, this is not from chroming or polishing (aggressive polishing can cause ripples in the surface but not like that). Unwind the deal, eat the return shipping if you must. As far as it being compromised strength wise, it probably won't fall apart, but I bet if it was on a surface plate and measured, no good would show.

  15. #15
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    121
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Bianchigirll View Post
    Colnago? where is the paint?
    It's not a Colnago. Lugs are wrong, as is how the rear brake cable is hidden in the top tube.

    Lee
    As I get older and slower, my bikes get lighter and faster...

    2007 Colnago C50, 2005 Colnago Dream Cyclocross, 2002 Colnago Dream, 1999 Colnago C40, 1998 Colnago Master Ti, 1998 Colnago Pista, 1998 Litespeed Blue Ridge, 1996 Colnago Steel Cyclocross, 1991 Merlin Ti MTB, 1989 Colnago Spiral Conic SLX, 1988 Wicked Fat Chance MTB, 198? Colnago Super 91, 1981 Condor Cycles custom road bike, 1980 Reynolds Team Pro 753 (SB 3711), 1984 Fat Chance Custom 24" wheels

  16. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    121
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Dovetube View Post
    (wouldn't YoU prefer incoherent to verbose?)
    We got both incoherent and verbose.



    Lee
    As I get older and slower, my bikes get lighter and faster...

    2007 Colnago C50, 2005 Colnago Dream Cyclocross, 2002 Colnago Dream, 1999 Colnago C40, 1998 Colnago Master Ti, 1998 Colnago Pista, 1998 Litespeed Blue Ridge, 1996 Colnago Steel Cyclocross, 1991 Merlin Ti MTB, 1989 Colnago Spiral Conic SLX, 1988 Wicked Fat Chance MTB, 198? Colnago Super 91, 1981 Condor Cycles custom road bike, 1980 Reynolds Team Pro 753 (SB 3711), 1984 Fat Chance Custom 24" wheels

  17. #17
    Godbotherer dwellman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Hermitage, TN
    My Bikes
    1986 Cannondale SR300 (full SRAM Apex) 1996 Cannondale R800 (Full SRAM Rival), 1997 Cannondale R200 (Shimano Tiagra), 2012 Cannondale CAAD 10-5, 1992 Bridgestone RB-1 (SRAM Force)
    Posts
    1,317
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by lml999 View Post
    We got both incoherent and verbose.



    Lee
    Pretty much.

    Paypal holds payments in escrow until shipment is received (and sometimes until feedback-- not sure about that). But if return shipping. . . parcel post.
    "Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one gets the prize? Run in such a way as to get the prize"
    "So I do not run like someone who doesn't run toward the finish line. I do not fight like a boxer who hits nothing but air."
    "And let us run with endurance the race God has set before us."
    "I have fought the good fight, I have finished the race, I have kept the faith."

  18. #18
    incazzare. lostarchitect's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Brooklyn, NY
    My Bikes
    See sig
    Posts
    4,164
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Good God, man. Stop typing.
    1964 JRJ (Bob Jackson) San Remo Plus, 1989 Trek 520, 2000ish Colian (Colin Laing), 2013 Velo Orange Pass Hunter

  19. #19
    Lotus Monomaniac Snydermann's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    1,047
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I'm still trying to understand the title.

    too bent over damage to internet-sale Colnago?

    What? More for what said read not many, damage Colnago, bummer.
    Always searching for Lotus literature and memorabilia for use at www.VintageLOTUSbicycles.com, can you help?

  20. #20
    Godbotherer dwellman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Hermitage, TN
    My Bikes
    1986 Cannondale SR300 (full SRAM Apex) 1996 Cannondale R800 (Full SRAM Rival), 1997 Cannondale R200 (Shimano Tiagra), 2012 Cannondale CAAD 10-5, 1992 Bridgestone RB-1 (SRAM Force)
    Posts
    1,317
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Yeah. Internet damage is nothing to get bent over. Or got bent. Which is odd. Unless you mean "bender". No, not the Futurama character. Bender as in a binge consumption of adult beverages.

    Famous server: I still know not this server of notoriety. Server of repute. These days it's either a virtual machine or a cluster of machines. Load balancing and all that. Don't want to have a single point of failure in a service architecture. Although, one can't always control the main route. If that goes down we're all screwed. Well, sort of. Verizon does some weird stuff from time to time. And people wonder why their faxes sometimes fail. Verizon. Which used to be Bell Atlantic. James Earl Jones did voice overs and appearances for Bell Atlantic advertising. Jones also was the voice fo CNN sweeps. Comedy Central sweep was Penn Jilette in the early to mid 1990's. But before that, Jilette played a small time drug dealer on an episode of Miami Vice-- "Prodigal Son" Season 2 Episode 1. He was gruesomely killed. That episode was directed by Paul Michael Glaser of Starsky fame and thus, considered a marginally famous actor. No relation to the famous server, I suspect.
    Last edited by dwellman; 11-11-11 at 02:32 PM.
    "Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one gets the prize? Run in such a way as to get the prize"
    "So I do not run like someone who doesn't run toward the finish line. I do not fight like a boxer who hits nothing but air."
    "And let us run with endurance the race God has set before us."
    "I have fought the good fight, I have finished the race, I have kept the faith."

  21. #21
    Forum Admin lotek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    n.w. superdrome
    My Bikes
    1 trek, serotta, rih, de Reus, Pogliaghi and finally a Zieleman! and got a DeRosa
    Posts
    17,623
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Pat, I'd like to buy a paragraph please...

    sorry I got lost somewhere after the 2nd or 3rd run on sentence.
    Hell I'm no grammar snob but that was painful.
    I concur it's not a colnago, and I doubt that you could
    describe Cromor as being whippy (you did say that didn't you?).
    Sono pił lento di quel che sembra.
    Odio la gente, tutti.

    Are you a registered member? Why not? click here to register. Its free, and only takes 27 seconds!
    Want to upgrade your membership? Click Here.

  22. #22
    Let your bike be the tool cranky old road's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    NC/SC border
    My Bikes
    '66 Raleigh Carlton, '70 Ron Cooper, '96 Bianchi CD'I, Zonal Frame with Xenon gruppo, Carbon Frame with Record Gruppo, Columbia Twosome, Terry Classic, Bianchi SX
    Posts
    813
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by lotek View Post
    Pat, I'd like to buy a paragraph please...

    sorry I got lost somewhere after the 2nd or 3rd run on sentence.
    Hell I'm no grammar snob but that was painful.
    I concur it's not a colnago, and I doubt that you could
    describe Cromor as being whippy (you did say that didn't you?).
    For Koresh's sake man! Can't you read gibberish? He reconciled his dissatisfaction over the fact that the frame is Cromor by telling himself that at least it wouldn't be whippy, implying that Cromor, while having some un-named deficiency, is not whippy! Get up to speed man!

    ...I mean, I beg to differ....
    Last edited by cranky old road; 11-11-11 at 03:11 PM. Reason: Just noticed the three blue stars
    Never try to teach a pig to sing...

  23. #23
    Banned.
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    40
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I have no idea what the OP is trying to convey.
    If their referring to eBay, I can find no seller called vintageparts1978
    If a seller posted pics of that bike even a distant side view would make that sort of frame damage even more noticeable.
    After seeing there's no seller by the name mentioned, I have even less of a clue as to what this post is about.

  24. #24
    Godbotherer dwellman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Hermitage, TN
    My Bikes
    1986 Cannondale SR300 (full SRAM Apex) 1996 Cannondale R800 (Full SRAM Rival), 1997 Cannondale R200 (Shimano Tiagra), 2012 Cannondale CAAD 10-5, 1992 Bridgestone RB-1 (SRAM Force)
    Posts
    1,317
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by slowleak View Post
    I have even less of a clue as to what this post is about.
    But that won't stop us from talking about it for 4 or 5 pages. . .
    "Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one gets the prize? Run in such a way as to get the prize"
    "So I do not run like someone who doesn't run toward the finish line. I do not fight like a boxer who hits nothing but air."
    "And let us run with endurance the race God has set before us."
    "I have fought the good fight, I have finished the race, I have kept the faith."

  25. #25
    Half way there gmt13's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Durham, NC
    My Bikes
    69 Hercules, 73 Raleigh Sports, 74 Raliegh Competition, 78 Nishiki Professional, 79 Nishiki International, 83 Colnago Super, 83 Viner Junior
    Posts
    1,107
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by lml999 View Post
    It's not a Colnago. Lugs are wrong, as is how the rear brake cable is hidden in the top tube.

    Lee
    My observation as well, the lugs are wrong.

    How long did it take for you to write that post. I got through a 3rd of the way and then gave up.

    -G

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •